married and gay

Open relationships can work, though everyone has to be on the same page about it. The chances aren't great when the relationship starts out monogamous, and one of the partners decides it should be open (non-monogamy is not widely accepted as an option by people in our society).

However, I don't really see the point of opening the marriage up, considering you're gay (as you claim). If you were bi I'd see its purpose, as bi people oftentimes desire intimacy with both sexes. But you are not bi. You are gay. Your wife should be with a man who can completely "be" with her in all aspects. Spouses who are in open relationships are still completely intimate with each other. What separates them from monogamous couples is that they desire more adventurous sex lives, and don't view sexual exclusivity as a necessity for a loving relationship. This isn't your case. You don't want sexual non-exclusivity, you want the sexual exclusion of your wife and yourself from each other's intimate lives. What you want is to "outsource" certain parts of your relationship. That's not really an open relationship as much as it is a sham relationship. Your wife deserves better.

Probably not what you want to hear, but it's what you need to hear. You married your wife in 2003, not 1973. Times are different, and some things are less excusable.

(BTW, regarding your earlier sex with your wife, when people are younger they have higher sex drives, some so high they could have sex with anyone. As you grow older, your sex drives is less crazy, and only people you find genuinely attractive can do it for you. You can only deny your true orientation for so long.)

 

What you should do is tell her the truth. A life based on a lie cannot be sustained indefinitely. And cheating on her is out of the question, so don't even think about that. You also should start accepting that this thing (your marriage) is likely not meant to be. If you do "love" her, realize that you tricked her into marrying you (you knew you were gay, but you didn't tell her), and are not the one for her.

 

Hmm. I wonder what the " mean... You are doubting what OP says?
Also, tricked her? Really?

OP, I believe you should tell her. Either that you are bi or gay. Make sure she understands that the sex and all the intimacy in your marriage weren't forced and unpleasant for you. Then together try to decide what to do. Maybe she will be the one who will offer opening your marriage. At certain age the bond of friendship can be more important than sex. You never know. But I believe you should tell her and give her time to "digest" the news.

 

Yes. Really. He knew he was gay and he didn't tell her he was, thus denying her the opportunity of making an informed decision whether she'd marry him or not. He did that because he likely knew that she'd not marry him if he told her. This is by definition "tricking". And look where they're at now.

Also, the above does make me doubt the love part. I've heard way too many stories of men who are totally gay, and who met a woman they "kinda" liked and immediately grabbed at that opportunity of possible heterosexuality like their life depended on it and jumped into marriage, only to end up in situations like geff's. Makes me wonder if these men act due to love, and not something else.

 

It's very easy to judge gay people who have gotten into straight marriages as deceptive or dishonest, particularly if you've never been in one. That's really not accurate. There are a good many of us here who grew up in situations where being out and gay was simply not an option. Either we had no exposure to gay people of any kind, or we were brought up and trained to believe that they were unacceptable or abnormal. Totally incorrect, obviously, so please don't think I'm suggesting that being gay is a bad thing. But if that's how you're brought up, you have a lot more baggage to work through than if you grew up in a more open and accepting culture or environment.

Coming from that background, a straight marriage, at least at the time, felt like a safety net, especially if you geuinely liked and got along with the person you married. Geff, I totally get that you loved, and still love, your wife. I feel the same way about mine. I'm just finally realizing the gaping holes in that love that are the result of my being gay, which can never be filled for either of us. It takes time to realize what you have given up emotionally, and how badly you have misled yourself and the person you married. The first person that you "trick" (if you can even call it that, since you did not set out to be deceptive) is really yourself.

In your case, though, if there's another guy who could become part of the picture, you have to look at how this would affect not only her, but also you. You are agonizing over this enough as it is. If you don't come clean with her, and end up cheating, can you live with yourself? If you feel guilty now, won't you feel ten times worse if you start living a double life? Can you really do that to someone you love?

I'm not out to my wife yet, so I can't judge or tell you what to do. But before you jump into a clandestine relationship, consider not only what it will do to her, but also to YOU. If you feel dishonest or selfish now, messing around with some guy and then going back to her will only make it worse. You may want to consider telling her before it comes to that point (which sounds pretty close).

 

Hi Geff

My situation is VERY similar to yours, except that I recently came out to my wife as bi.

Everyone on this forum is entitled to their opinion and here is mine:
Not everything in life is as black and white as Adi is trying to make it out to be. It is possible to truely love your wife and enjoy the intamacy, but still be attracted to men. I also found that as I got closer and closer to telling my wife that sex with her became more "difficult", I seemed to be consumed by my desire for men and my performance with her suffered. Since coming out and having A LOT of conversations our sex life is better than ever, I feel like I can really enjoy sex with her because I don't have this sword hanging over my head. Sex with a woman is not AT ALL like sex with a man (well not for me anyway) and I would always want to have both. I would never cheat on my wife with another woman, but I don't see me having a responsible, romantic, emotional connection with a man as cheating, I really don't. I'm not talking about random sex or hook-ups, but a relationship similar to the one that lead to you and your wife ending up together.

Don't let harsh criticism or strong opinions put you off this site, this is a place you can feel supported and not judged. You are responsible for your own happiness and you seem genuinely concerned about your wife's happiness too, so I would suggest trusting her enough to let her know about you (she already suspects something is wrong and the uncertainty is far worse). Once she knows, only then can you really start deciding where the future will take you and what's best for both of you and your daughter.

All the best and feel free to message me if you'd like to chat.

 

geff, add 4 years to what you wrote, and it could have been written by me. I'm 39, been married (to a woman) for almost 14 years, and was just in May of this year finally able to admit to myself what I had known in the back of my mind for 26+ years - that I am gay. It took another 2 months or so to be able to tell my wife that. In the end, she knew - and had for some time, but was just waiting for me to know it myself and be able to admit it. 2 weeks have gone by, and we just filed for divorce today. We're still friends; I hope that we will continue to be through this process and after.

Telling my wife that I am gay was without question THE single hardest thing that I have ever done. But, in the end, neither of us were happy, and this was the only way to eventually find happiness again. Please, take a look at my previous posts, and at the support that I've received here on EC. Feel free to send me a message if I can help out in any way.

 

geff,

Thanks for being so open about your situation. Know that there are many people on EC that share your experience and are here to support you and give insight from what they went through. I never married and have come out later in life as a gay man. Early in the coming out process, I feel I was overly critical of people in your situation. I felt as though I had never married, so no other gay man should put a woman through the eventual pain of break up when she is told or finds out.

But over the years, I have met alot of gay men, and my opinion has changed. I have realized the error of my thinking. We all travel a different path. I think it is more important to be gentle with yourself and embrace the person you are now. If you are at a point, as you describe, where you can no longer live as a straight married person, then it seems important to be honest with your partner. You seem to be going through tremendous personal growth, which I commend you for.

In the end, you will be thankful that you were honest with both yourself and your wife. And yes, this will probably be the hardest thing you ever have to do, should you choose it. But the payoff of a clear conscience and a potential amazing relationship with someone of your own sex might be worth it. I look forward to hearing more about your journey and wish you the best!

 

Amen. Yes, we all travel a different path. I wasn't so much critical as much as I didn't understand it. But there could have been so many variables I've come to learn from talking to people: that of once being in love, that of once enjoying intimacy, that of societal expectations among the reference group, that of getting in touch with one's feelings and urges later on, and on and on ...

At any rate, Geff, there are a lot of folks here who will lend an ear and be a sounding board. No one's experience is the same, but there is commonality as well as similarities, and people can offer helpful viewpoints. Sometimes, putting together several viewpoints is the most helpful thing I've found here.

 

Defending my post, which might have seemed to harsh, geff lives in Palo Alto, California, and married his wife in 2003. The bolded is quite unlikely, and the societal attitudes towards gays in the region he lives and at the time he married his wife would hardly be comparable with those in Wisconsin when you were growing up, or even those of current day Romania. He also never even stated that there was any actual "pressure" to marry a woman.

@BiDad3: In my initial post I did state that there was quite a big different between a bi man marrying a woman and a gay man doing that (geff identifies as gay, not bi). While you can still be (and are still) intimate with your wife (in your case, you just have different needs which society at large is not willing to accept that some people can have, but thankfully the only person whose opinion matters - your wife - is on your side), what geff wants is to "outsource" part of his duties as a husband, as he can't meet them. He wants to still maintain the privileges of being in a heterosexual marriage, while at the same time living a gay life. If his case really does end up being like yours, I'll take everything I said back.

 

geff, sorry for being so rough on you. I only based my comments on what you wrote, and in the back of my head I realized it was a bad idea to do that, as your posts didn't have that much information, but one of my character flaws is being extremely self-righteous (plus, the religious thing is less impressive to me, as that aspect is a much bigger problem for gays in Romania than for those who live in any part of America).

If you did have attraction to your wife and other girls in the past, it could be as BiDad3 said, and your sex drive has went downhill due to repressing part of your sexuality (I have first hand experience with this myself). You might not necessarily lose your wife, but if it comes to that, remember that truly loving someone (in the non-selfish, non-possessive way) means wanting what's best for them, and that might sometimes mean them not being with you anymore.

Also make sure that the people you come out to and seek support from aren't the kind that will force you to "conversion therapy" or something of the sort.

Best of luck to you, and sorry again for not being of help.

 

Geff,

Like you I was in a similar situation. Married 18 yrs had kids, I have known my wife since we were 17. So your story is just like mine. Yes the older I got the stronger my attraction to men became, sex was almost non-existant.

I just want to reinforce what you stated previously and that is NO YOU DID NOT TRICK HER!!! I must say that the 20yrs that I have been with my wife I, like you have loved and cherished my wife. You married your wife out of love , as did I. I dont think ANYONE here should ever minimalize your marriage or presume to know your state of mind when entering into the marriage. As if we were all rubbing our hands looking for someone to intentionally victimize or use to hide our homosexuality. that may be the case for some but not all!!!!

Geff like you my wife is my best friend and a year after comming out we remain so. My outcome was not the norm but our ties are stronger than ever. I can relate to you when it comes to seeing your wife with another man because I would feel the same way , which makes it very difficult to rationalize having an open marriage.

I dont have any advice, the only thing I can say is be honest with yourself as well as your wife. You owe it to yourself.

Best of luck to you Geff!!

 

Wow, what a fantastic thread this has turned out to be. Thanks Geff for telling your story. I think so often we all feel so alone and don't even realise how many other guys are going through a VERY similar situation.

Jae, your sentiments about the love you have for your wife really resonated with me. Just like you and Geff I have known my wife since I was a teenage boy and no one will ever be able to convince me that our relationship has been anything but a blessing - I only need to look at our kids to appreciate the depth of our bond. Even though we are journeying together on this road at the moment, there is no guarantee that we will be together at the end - the only possible chance of us success lies in our commitment to keep talking.

Good luck Geff and keep posting. This forum has been such a wonderful help to me during the last few months.

 

After reading all of the above, it is clear that a very raw nerve has been exposed. The question that bugs us always is: how could we? How could we get married and have kids "knowing" all along that we were at least, less than straight.

I was annoyed with Dan Savage when he just dismissed us; saying he had "no respect" for people in our situation. Sorry Dan: too easy to dismiss it, too common to just ignore us either.

Fact is, we loved our wives, not knowing how much more we could love men. We accepted that feeling of love and took it as normal, not knowing that the love we could feel for men could be so much less forced, so much less a construct and more authentic. And so we accepted it and, because feelings and desires are part of the muck of the psyche, we tended to dismiss them as being either temporary or unimportant: biting the bullet and just doing what "normal" guys are expected to do

 

This, x1000.

 

This is SO right on. I was also raised in a Christian church. Before I got married, I told my wife that I "used to be gay". I sincerely thought that once we got married and started having sex, then all my desires for other men would go away. I thought that God would do a miracle. I had "faith".

Within 3 months of getting married, we were in marriage counseling. I started having anxiety and panic attacks. 17 years and 4 marriage counselors later, I confessed in April that I'm still gay. She's known through the years that I was still struggling. I spent 3 years going through an Exodus International ministry.

I love my wife. I love our daughter. However, I couldn't keep pretending that everything is fine, when it's not. I was tired of pretending that I wanted to have sex with her. I was tired trying to be something that I'm not. And I was killing myself trying to avoid the issue.

I still love my wife enough to wish her the best. And I've finally realized I am not the best for her and she is not the best for me.