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Am I bisexual or not?

Discussion in 'Sexual Orientation' started by Maverick 007, Aug 31, 2021.

  1. Maverick 007

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    Dear readers. I'm sure this is the one hundred and eleventh thousand post on this subject but I've entered a very confusing part of my life. First off to start I'm grateful for anyone who reads this let alone reply. I know there are a lot of deatils here but I figured context is important to understand even a bit of what's really going on. And second I never imagined coming to a forum for help since I'm used to solving my problems myself.

    So my problem is I've always thought I was heterosexual since I've been sexually attracted to girls however I've never had a romantic attraction to any of them. Hell I've never even had fantasies about them in any way other than sexual ( no romantic intimacy at all). No matter how cute or sexy they were when we kissed it felt strange and mechanical. I never actually enjoyed the experiences. Maybe I need a emotional connection or maybe Its something else but early this year I felt myself leaning further and further away from women physically and sexually.

    And like a switch that was flipped without my knowledge I started staring at guys, checking them out, fantasizing about them. It's all so strange. I've never saw myself bringing a girl to meet my family, nor have I desired it...yet with guys I've had fantasies bringing a guy home and more intimate and sexual fantasies with them. Constantly looking at their eyes and their lips and their butts. Similar to how I looked at girls but with the romantic aspects as well. These past ten months or so have been wild. I even find guys more attractive than girls which is mind boggling since that's a crazy transition in such a short amount of time for me.

    I've always been a very open person sexually and intellectually but I never assumed I would be where I am right now. I was obsessed with anal play and experimented with myself anally since I was in elementary and junior high, and started prostate play when I got in my twenties. I have watched both porn (hetero and gay) and to be honest neither does it for me, they just look like people pushing their bodies against each other and making strange noises (but when I was younger I was addicted to hetero porn). Interestingly enough my first sexual experience was when I was somewhere between four and six years old and it was with a boy (my friend and classmate) we got caught playing with each other in the closet (no pun intended). It was probably my idea to do it too. I remember constantly repressing that particular memory every time something would trigger it to appear. I even recall the conflicted feeling I would have when I'd have to tell certain people who questioned my orientation that "I'm attracted to girls". All these memories and details started coming back to me this year as I struggled with my sex orientation. Like how for years even feeling equally uncomfortable around guys as I do girls. Hugging guys or physical contact made me uncomfortable (as if I was nervous about misunderstandings). Having no issues acknowledging to other people that certain guys were "attractive, or "cute", or "handsome". I explained I was speaking only objectively and it doesn't mean anything. How half the girls I have always been attracted to were androgynous and eventually turned out to be lesbian. And low and behold it now lead me to guys who are all androgynous and gay.

    I don't think I'm gay because I'm turned on by women (certain women of course), but I don't know if I'm bisexual because I haven't even kissed a guy despite my desires/fantasies. I definitely have a type with guys just like with women but it feels different...I don't know how to explain it. I guess if I could describe it, it would be..."women I can play with, but guys I can be with"? I'll leave it at that for now, I think I've overloaded your brain cells enough with all these ramblings and details. I've posted this on other forums as well to see if anyone out there can give me some sound perspectives.
    P.S. thanks for getting this far
     
  2. QuietPeace

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    Welcome to EC.

    Only you can really determine your orientation. Other people can describe their own experiences or point things out to you but in the end you are the one who has to decide who you are and how you will allow it to affect your life. I would like to breakdown some of the things that I have heard from you along with my nonprofessional observations on them.

    This really sounds to me as if you were simply living according to compulsory heterosexuality.

    It sounds as if part of you has finally realized that you are into men.

    This though is only indicative of you enjoying being stimulated and it has nothing to do with your orientation. Plenty of straight men are into pegging. Nerve endings are nerve endings regardless of your orientation.

    This also does not really indicate anything. Porn is an unreliable indicator of a persons orientation.

    Children explore with themselves and each other. I do not think that this experience indicates anything about your orientation.

    This is another thing that indicates to me how you have been affected by compulsory heterosexuality.

    You do not actually have to have experiences with men to understand that you find them attractive and are interested in them. From all that I have heard from you in this one post it seems more to me that you actually might be gay but have been pressured by society to pretend that you are straight, of course as I said at the top only you can determine your actual orientation.
     
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  3. Nickw

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    @QuietPeace provided a lot of valuable information and insight and you should carefully consider those comments.

    In addition, for me, I found that my attraction to men resembled a “hunger” rather than an intellectually definable thought. It was this hunger that I could feel for a man that convinced me I was not straight and my same sex fantasies were not a kink.
     
  4. PatrickUK

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    The only person who can decide what label is best for you, is you. Having read what you wrote in your post it might be worth considering the idea that you are in fact gay. I acknowledge what you wrote about having sex with women, but looking at the entirety of your remarks there are enough question marks to suggest that sex with women was nothing more than getting off for you.

    You described your attraction to men as a switch that was flipped, but is that actually correct? The events in your childhood may seem insignificant, but they're actually not. You recall playing with another boy in an intimate way and even though it happened at a very young age you carried the weight of shame for many years, constantly repressing the memories every time they were "triggered to appear" (an interesting way you described it). What this demonstrates is that you were already aware of something about your sexuality and you had already picked up on the societal messages about the appropriateness (or not) of same sex attraction. As a result you began to live to the standards dictated, rather than the true nature of your feelings and it's only now that you are allowing space for those feelings and fantasies to develop.

    Most significant for me was the following comment towards the end of your message:

    This seems to confirm the idea that sex with women was about conformity and getting off, rather than relationship building. You have done what society demands of you, but now you wish to connect with those feelings that have been repressed for a long time and it all seems to make sense. You can imagine being with a guy.

    Nobody can choose a label for you. We can offer suggestions, but ultimately it has to feel right for you because you are the one who has to live with it. If you feel bisexual is the best fit for you, then it's nobody else's place to say otherwise.
     
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  5. Maverick 007

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    1: Thank you @QuietPeace for your insight. Your right that there are too many nuances and each person's journey is different from another's.
    2: What is compulsory heterosexuality? I have never heard that before.
    3: Your comments on how physical experimentation is not an indicator of orientation is appreciated, I was debating on that for a while and it had me pretty confused for a few years.
    4: yes realizing I am into guys was and still is pretty amazing to be honest. I never imagined being where I am right now and as you said I'll have to figure things out for myself. Thanks for your time and analysis, every little bit helps.
     
  6. Maverick 007

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    Thanks for the reply Nickw. A hunger? Interesting way of phrasing it. I don't know if that's how I would describe how I feel though but I'm sure that's not surprising...nuances right. I guess your trying to say theirs a difference in feeling, one intense like a gravitational pull?
     
  7. QuietPeace

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    https://equalityarchive.com/issues/compulsory-heterosexuality/

    You are welcome.
     
  8. Maverick 007

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    PatrickUK...you have given me a lot to meditate on. Those insights hit harder than I expected. Really hard. I'm glad I made this post. I honestly thought I could figure this out on my own like most of my problems but...*sigh* I think there's too many layers to unravel. I never expected myself given my personality type to go along with society's demands but hey, what's life without a little irony. Thank you
     
  9. tidalpool127

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    Hey Maverick, I just wanted to say that I agree with Patrick about you choosing the best label for you. Man, parts of your story really sound autobiographical. I'm gay(not saying you are, if bi fits you better)and I too got playing "doctor" with my best friend when I was 6, by our moms no less. I loved playing it with him and had been for some time. We were too little for it to be sex, I just loved being that close to him. I'd seen my mom mad at this point in my life, but nowhere near this scary. I knew to deny it was my idea. Man, I still feel bad when I think about that I pinned it on him. It took months before my parents let me see him again. Our friendship never really recovered from that, unfortunately.

    I too later discovered that 85% of the girls I tried to convince myself I had crushes on were really lesbians. Sexual fantasy wise, I was the opposite. I liked to imagine being held or being kissed by girls, but anything more sexual I found difficult to imagine. Boys, on the other hand...I wasn't sure what gay sex looked like until we got better internet than dialup when I was teenager but I knew just imagining being close was electric.
     
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  10. tidalpool127

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    Sorry, I meant "got caught playing doctor" up above.
     
  11. Nickw

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    Sort of. I used to do this test where I would look at two dozen guys and not feel anything. Then, I would look at women and I could always feel something for at least maybe 20% of them. So, I was straight... right? Then the "guy" would come by and my heart would race and I couldn't not look at him. It turns out some guys just do it for me and it is in my gut...not my head.
     
  12. Maverick 007

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    Tidalpool127 thanks for your perspective. What Patrick said has been haunting me all day at work and still rolling around in my head now. What you said about most of your crushes turning out to be lesbians is a funny similarity and begs the question of how common is it amongst gay and bisexuals.

    What you said about playing doctor with your friend; was their any shame left over from your mom catching you and getting upset?
     
  13. Maverick 007

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    Ah now I see. Yes that's very similar to what has been happening to me. I look at women and say "hmm she's attractive". Or "hmm nice body". Then these particular guys would enter the picture and I just zone out; no words just me staring at them and I feel it in my chest, or gut like you said. Very very different feeling.

    *Sigh* you know it feels so strange talking like this. I'm sorry if that's offensive to anyone but this is all so strange for me.
     
  14. tidalpool127

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    Oh for sure. Like I said at that point in my life I had never seen my mom so angry with me. She told me how what we'd be doing was totally inappropriate and wrong. Said she'd better not catch me doing something like that again. So yes, the first time I got societal feedback from doing something "gay"(I mean we were too little, it wasn't really gay or straight or anything yet) it was pretty negative. When I did start to realize I was having my first little kid crushes towards other boys a couple of years later; I knew I shouldn't tell anyone. I'm glad things seem to be changing for today's kids. Just here on EC, I've seen stories of kids feeling comfortable to come out at ages that I could not have imagined coming out at.
     
  15. PatrickUK

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    It's not always a conscious thing though. From the day we are born our lives are being shaped and moulded by other people; parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, teachers, pastors, peer groups... wider society. We pick up on all of those subliminal messages and just find ourselves going with the flow, to a large extent. Along the way, we may indulge in a bit of rebellion, but we'll still act within certain parameters to try to keep life sweet.

    The narrative about sex and sexuality may not be overt when we are infants, but it's definitely present and if we act against the narrative we may find ourselves on the receiving end of stern correction. When a child hears disapproving comments about their behaviour from parents, grandparents or other respected adults it seeps deep into their core and becomes embedded for many years, or a life time. To regain approval the child represses their instincts and self corrects (to keep life sweet) and then carries on as though nothing happened. They may even forget about it for a long time, but those buried feelings always want to resurface and there is no telling when that will happen - but it almost surely will.

    Honestly Maverick, I think this is where you are now. It may feel like a switch was flipped, but I sense an undercurrent going way back to childhood.

    I'm sorry if my comments caused you difficulty yesterday. I know it can be a lot to take in.
     
  16. Maverick 007

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    Yes it seems society although slowly, is evolving to the pint where younger generations can feel a bit more comfortable to come out (not counting the cultures that have been violently defensive against sexuality). My mother has always had a liberal personality although she comes from a slightly traditional family (carribean islands). My father's side is more traditional like hers as well but he's always been open minded too (Dominican). But I guess the hard part for me is acceptance part.
     
  17. Maverick 007

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    Correction: it's harder for me to accept myself than to come out to others
     
  18. Maverick 007

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    No Patrick it was/is necessary. A quote I remember someone posted on Instagram a year back was "if I didn't make you uncomfortable, you would not move". It was regarding god but it seemed appropriate here as well. I came here for insights and sometimes those insights need to break down walls so that we can get started on the work. I'm still dealing with your words so thank you again.
     
  19. Nobu

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    Just want to second that it might be worth considering you are gay. I would at least try going on a date with a guy(s) and see how you feel.

    You don’t need to immediately adopt a gay label if you enjoy it either…many people experience “The Backlog” where once they unlock new attractions they didn’t know they had, those attractions are 1000x more powerful for a period of time. For some, the attraction evens back out, for others it doesn’t. For me, I thought I was gay for awhile, only to eventually become attracted to girls again.

    I will note though that some therapists believe youthful play/noticing/attraction is a massive indicator of where your orientation lies, because those attractions exist before society has had a chance to imprint and cloud you. Many of my gay friends are able to cite some type of experience/clue from their childhood.
     
  20. Maverick 007

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    Nobu thanks for that recommendation. In regards to going on a date with a guy, I'm not gonna lie that sounds a little scary lol, but nothing will change if i stand still so i will consider it.

    I have never heard of "backlog" before. i wonder if ill rebound back, but at the same time i don't know. Nothing has changed regarding my sexual feelings for girls other than it greatly diminishing over the last 12 months. But if i start having strong romantic feelings for them then yes that would be a hell of a change.

    My romantic and sexual feelings for guys however...feels natural i guess. I don't really feel like a boost in my feelings as if a dam broke and now things are flooding out like a horny teenager, but instead like a sudden and natural attraction/desires for guys (the cute ones obviously). I joke that girls feel like their from another planet in many ways, like i get them but they are very different. Many of the traits guys say they like in girls never occurred to me, but i always chalked it up to me being weird. While guys are more from earth (still alot of assholes though), and its easier for me to spit off the top of my head things that i like about them (at least its easy now. I didn't give it any thought until a year ago). I didn't expand on this in my original post but almost all the characteristics and traits i was attracted to in the girls that turned out to be gay happened to be the traits that all guys have; the things that attracts me to them. I don't know the Psych term but i'm sure a word exists for that.