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Why hate religion?

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by Mental, Oct 11, 2016.

  1. Browncoat

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    Religious beliefs based on the schizophrenic voices inside the "prophet" Abraham's head do not really hold any value with me.
     
  2. mangotree

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    It is fairly secular ... now.
    Though, many of our parents (e.g. baby boomers) grew up with the largely unchallenged misinformation.

    Plus, as with everywhere, the ignorant voices seem to be the loudest and get the most media coverage.

    Sure, male-male activity has been taboo in many societies, but where and how do you think that taboo originated? My guess would be either politics influenced by a religion or a religion itself.
    I can't think of a secular, non-supernatural or biological reason for a taboo that wouldn't have originated from information spread by one of those powers.
     
  3. gravechild

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    I'd say a part of it has to do with many cultures valuing things like marriage, having children, and set gender roles. For example, in almost every case, it was young men who were the warriors and put their lives on the line in wars.

    Implying someone is "submissive" to another man in bed is an attack on their manhood. Not to mention that gay male stereotypes seem to share common traits throughout time and place. There's a reason many special roles, like priest, were set aside for "third genders".

    So I guess those things might tie into politics/religion?! Considering the two were one and the same, for a long time.
     
  4. johndeere3020

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    A couple of you here, should have respect for those of us that do believe in everlasting peace and forgiveness.
     
  5. Mental

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    Just making sure, you're only talking about abrahamic religion, correct?
     
  6. Libertino

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    A few different issues in your question. One is that to have a "problem with the Abrahamic God" sounds almost like an accusation of religious turmoil within a person's psyche (i.e. their issue accepting the Abrahamic God as the One True God), not the same as taking an issue with religion or religious doctrine or with the concept of a god in general (it also sounds like a common defensive complaint of religious conservatives, i.e. "well if you just stopped hating God!"). Secondly, LGBT having a "thing" against religion is not the same thing as hating it, despite what your question title states. Explanations of why LGBT people reject religion or criticize it may not sate a desire to know why some hate it.

    Let's be clear that being an atheist or irreligious does not necessarily mean you hate religion or that you "hate God", despite what many religious people claim. Nor does it mean that you hate the people who practice the religion. Not that I would personally mind if some people do hate a religion (though it's not my own position) since Christians often claim that they hate sins and behaviors that are a part of who people are (i.e. homosexuality) but not the people who practice them, one can do the same thing with religion (i.e. hate the religion, but not the people who practice it). Fair's fair, isn't it? This logic is only valid if it is able to be reciprocated.

    To the issues that LGBT people take with religion: Many of them have already been adequately covered in the answers above mine, but I will emphasize some that I have observed from an American point of view (Christianity is in the focus because it is the dominant religion in the West):

    The movement to resist homosexuality and LGBT rights in the U.S. is largely religion-inspired or at the very least religion-bolstered. Opposition to homosexuality is touted as taking a stand for conservative family values. Many Christian conservatives believe they are losing the culture war in this country and that acceptance of homosexuality (manifested especially with legalization of same-sex marriage) is a sign of the declining morals of our nation and their way of life, thus taking a stand against homosexuality and same-sex marriage shows that you still cling to Christian values and will not succumb to the libertine morally bankrupt liberal agenda that threatens to undermine everything that made this nation great.

    Given this, it's no surprise that many LGBT do the reverse and take a stand against religion. This kind of "culture war" pits homosexuality against religion, as if they are mutually exclusive, as if they are opposites of each other that cannot coexist (either on a macro-scale or within an individual). Many LGBT people have experienced rejection and hatred from family members and friends who cite their religion as the reason for their rejection. Many LGBT people see religion as an obstacle to acceptance since in many cases, it is.

    Now, whether or not Christianity is "actually against" homosexuality is a contentious and debatable issue. Some say it is, some say it is not, some say it is but don't believe they have a right to judge homosexuals, other judge them freely...the interpretations are manifold. The point here being that for many, Christianity does indeed reject and condemn homosexuality, and this is reason for LGBT to not be fond of this religion. The other Abrahamic religions of course are no exception. Infamously, in many Muslim nations, homosexuality is not only unaccepted, it is illegal, and in some places, punishable by death. While homosexuality and religion are not opposites, there is no denying that religious morality that opposes homosexuality is a primary driving force behind anti-gay bigotry, laws, and feelings around the world.

    It's up to an individual to reconcile their sexuality with religion if they do so desire. The best we can do is realize that LGBT and religion are not necessarily exclusive, that they can coexist, and many LGBT people do identify as religious. That said, we should also respect the LGBT people that are not religious. Freedom to believe is imperative. And that includes beliefs about beliefs.
     
    #26 Libertino, Oct 12, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2016
  7. ThatBorussenGuy

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    For the sake of not offending the religious and/or getting the banhammer dropped on me, I'll keep my answer down to two reasons:

    1) Religion is used, quite frequently and around the world, to justify hate, oppression, and unspeakable atrocities. The bad in the so-called "holy books" outweighs the good.
    2) It can't be proven, and there are far too many contradictions to be taken seriously, especially in the bible.

    Now don't get me wrong, I can respect religious people, and if it helps you sleep at night or gives you comfort, as long as it's not hurting anyone else, more power to you. But religion itself, I do not respect, just like I wouldn't respect the doctrine of any other group of people if it proved itself to be as hateful as religion has.
     
  8. Czarcastic

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    I hate religion for many of the same reasons that others that already mentioned so I don't feel I need to go into those much further. However, I have other reasons as well such as indoctrinating children into belief and preaching about helping the needy and poor while accruing massive amounts of wealth.
     
  9. Tritri

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    I'm talking about all religions that fit my reasons. Any religion that contains a personal God fits my #1 (that they arrogantly think the entire universe was created just for humans), which alone encompasses the vast majority of them.
     
    #29 Tritri, Oct 13, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2016
  10. 108

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    It offers nothing substantial to modern society and only proves itself as a means to divide people and incite hatred. At least, when it comes to Abrahamic religions.
     
  11. mangotree

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  12. Mental

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    I wouldn't be so sure about that. In many religions, mankind is kind of just an afterthought, a little bonus.
     
  13. iiimee

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    I hate religion because I don't see any evidence for any sort of deity or afterlife to exist, and I think that believing in such a thing is about the same as believing Narnia or Hogwarts is real... You can, and I can still respect you as a person, but I probably will laugh if you try to preach to me about it. I also hate religion because, not only does it promote what is pretty much anti-skeptic, but it also is often used to encourage people to hate. You can say "not all religion" or "that's not its intention" but tbh religion has done more harm than good.
     
  14. NoXsOrOs

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    Well, I see that people are very negative. Everyone's entitled to their own views on what classifies as religion. More over your beliefs are to be respected however isn't a bit much to say you *Hate* religion; rather don't believe or simply disdain the whole aspect of religion rather. Finally people cause problems not religions, it's the people. By saying the religion has caused the problem you are scapegoating the crime committed by the individual. Anyhow, I don't hate religion but I don't rather care too much for it beyond mine.
     
  15. TheLionRoars360

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    I am Christian and I believe a lot of the stuff people of my religion say is false. Also, "man may not lie with man" was originally "man with boy" and then they translated the crap out of it until it was interpreted as an anti-homosexuality thing. So sad that religious people are giving their religion a bad reputation by not doing their research.
     
  16. JackAttack

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    I dislike some religions because of how they can spread hate and take away freedom. I feel sorry for those kids who are forced into going to faith schools and as soon as they are born, they are forced to believe in something which has no evidence for existing.

    For me, several religions create too much hate, inequality and control.
     
  17. PatrickUK

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    Religion is whatever we want it to be. It always has been like that and it always will be. You need only look through the books of the Christian Bible to see the evidence. If we want religion to be an instrument of hate, we can make it so, if we want it to be an instrument of peace, likewise. It's very easy to use religion to undergird our own prejudices about life and people (and many do - sadly).

    I'm afraid ardent evangelicals and atheists both indulge in reductionist arguments and squabbles about religion and it just comes across as exceedingly petty and ignorant. Both parties need to understand that faith and belief isn't as simplistic as their notional ideas on the matter. While they launch bitter attacks toward each other a whole group of people in the middle look on totally perplexed at the silliness of it all. All of this "hating" achieves nothing at all.
     
  18. Linthras

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    I object to religions in general because in 99.9% of the cases, it's based on dogma as opposed to reason.
    I object to Abrahamic religions specifically because:
    1. It's inherently contraditory, at least as presented in the bible.
    2. It preaches blind obedience in lieu of reason.
    3. It preaches the concept of thought crime.
    4. It presents a god that condones slavery, commands genocide and promotes or condones several other things I cannot justify either rationally or morally.

    I don't hate any of it per se.

    Edit* To clarify I fully respect an individuals right to believe whatever they want, including religious beliefs, up to the point where it affects the life and freedom of other people.

    ---------- Post added 15th Oct 2016 at 01:28 AM ----------

    We should have respect for you as a person*.
    Why should we respect your beliefs**?

    * Asuming you've done nothing to earn disrespect.
    ** Not talking about your right to belief something but the beliefs/ideas themselves.

    ---------- Post added 15th Oct 2016 at 01:38 AM ----------

    With all due respect, this appeasing nonsense.
    Several verses in the bible and Jewish texts have clear messages that do not allow for diametrically, if any different interpetations.

    I don't know what strange Reformed churches there are in your country, but here int the Netherlands, the Reformed church is one of the most conservative, anti-gay, anti-women religions in the country.
    More-over moderate churches at best demonstrate that religious people fit religions to their own preferences thereby negating the notion that it's gods word or absolute truth, and at worst evidence that a god or gods are just fucking with humanity, letting us make shit up as we go along, rather than giving us clear moral guide lines.

    If there were truly a benevolent god that loved all mankind and wanted to save it, it would make it's presence clear, as well as it's moral guidelines and the requirements for salvation.
     
    #38 Linthras, Oct 14, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2016
  19. Calf

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    I would suggest that it is because most LGBT people have at some point had a negative experience with religion - even the believers. It can range widely from direct harm or abuse, to public attacks, to religious objection against our rights, equality and entitlement to happiness.

    Sadly the minority of religious people, often described as hate preachers, are the only ones that claim to represent the whole of their religion in it's purest forms. In fact many of them claim to get their messages of hate directly from their chosen god/s. In any other walk of life and given any other rational, they would likely by kept safe from society and treated for the mental health issues they clearly suffer from.

    In contrast the majority of religious people that have less extreme views tend to distance themselves from these other groups, highlighting the many divisions and variances in their selected religion. The problem here is that it gives the impression that they are not truly representing 'religion' in the same way as the haters and even worse makes them appear accepting and supportive of homophobia in the greater organisation.

    The type of vile comments that many present in the name of their chosen religion are usually so ridiculously hypocritical and unfounded that it can only be interpreted as venomous hatred. You can't blame an LGBT person for taking it personally, even if the comments have never been aimed directly at them.

    Most major religious organisations have two main goals; political influence and wealth accumulation, fuelled by faith and vulnerability. I don't think anyone can honestly support that but it is so heavily ingrained in the worlds societies and cultures that many find it hard to separate the two.

    Personally I worry that so many people need the fear of god, the reward of heaven or ancient story books to stop them committing murder, rape or theft. I worry that so much good intention and love is committed to community causes via religious middle men that take a "believers tax" to become major investors in arms dealing and other less than peaceful enterprises. I worry that the state of the worlds mental health rests in many cases on myth and fable instead of therapeutic care and medical science. I worry that so many people look so far beyond the physical world around them to find a spiritual connection for hope, peace and love, because it is so hard to find it in the person sat right next to them.

    In summary I don't personally hate religion, though I can see why some do, I just don't understand it.

    I could go on but I'm super tired and hope that I've managed to make my point by now anyway.
     
    #39 Calf, Oct 14, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2016
  20. Tightrope

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    A lot of LGBT folks have been rejected by their congregations. Understandably, there's a lot of anger toward the institutions that have rejected them and told them they were less worthy because of their sexual or affectional preference.

    I don't think it's time to hang it up with religion if this happens. I think it's better to deal with it in other ways - find another congregation, scale back participation, etc.

    I'm not at all comfortable with the Big Bang theory. I fear God, though I'm not supposed to ... we're taught that God is in our corner. I find that I get along better with people who have a faith than those who don't. Those who have a faith include those who aren't very active in their faiths but were raised in one.