When is it not enough anymore?

Something that struck me recently, I'll leave it here.

"Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it."

I don't see the value in staying in a marriage where everyone is miserable. I also don't believe in running away from responsibilities. There are so many gray areas, and only you and your partner can decide what is right.

 

Hi third time, I hope you are both doing ok. Keep us posted. (Edit: glad he's doing ok. I hope the dentist will be able to repair the teeth easily)

I get being upset that he didn't tell you. I think I'd be upset/concerned too. It sounds like you guys have several sex related topics to discuss.

High art, I think that is a more elegant way of putting the poker term 'pot committed'. Sometimes we continue to pay in just because we have so much out there already. When do you say, "enough is enough?"

 

Agreed. I brought up those examples because they are kind of ridiculous and yet people (men) leave their partners (women) all the time for less. I wanted to put a minimal bound on the difference.

As for whether or not there really are fundamental differences between the genders...I often think that there is more of a difference between a woman like me and a passive, gentle woman than there is between me and many men. I am often assertive and analytical, can get carried away with my own work, etc. The men I seek out as friends are creative and kind, not Alpha types. So, well, the idea that there is more than a physical difference is harder for me to support, given my own personality and my preference for intellectual, nice men.

There IS a difference, but it blurs sometimes. It's something I am wrestling with. I know that I WANT to think that my attraction to women is something apart, and therefore justified in having as well. At the same time, I want to be OK with not having a woman, and so I want to minimize the difference and think "you're not missing much".

AARGHHHH wtf.

Your approach seems so honest. I really hope that things work out for you and your intrepid husband in the poly arena.

 

It sounds like the new wrinkle could be a reason to step back for a while and consider. It would have rattled me in a huge way and made me want to pause. So allow yourself to do that - if you feel that.

But, I did want to comment on your statement about negating the past. I don't think that anything can ever negate the past. My particular story involves many relationships begun and ended, and several with whom I have retained dear friendships. My outlook and history are not traditional in the least (anymore.) Having actually turned my back on a traditional life, I guess I have had to find a different way to look at connections and love.

I only know that the people who have remained in my life, including the former lovers that I retain a connection with, are so valuable to me. Relationships are precious. But they change sometimes into things completely unrecognizable compared to how they began. How can anyone spend decades with a person and have the relationship remain the same, when the people in it aren't the same? I guess my outlook is that love and pain and loss are all just part of the same package. There can't be love without loss of some kind... whether it is the loss of the sense of security of something "unchanging", or the loss of the actual person through separation or death. Gee this is all some weird profound stuff coming from me but you have me looking at my own life differently too...

 

Oh my goodness this whole post is mirroring my life right now. I am going through this with my husband. I feel so much guilt about not knowing I was gay and not wanting to break up my family. But I honestly just can't imagine my life with out my marriage. He is my best friend and he is just my family, plain and simple.

Everything you said about your family coming first and never being about you is exactly how it is for me too! But I have been noticing that my kids are starting to pick up on the tension now too, and that is unacceptable for me. So I know now I have to do something. I'm just lost on what.

I would be pissed if I found out my husband was taking Viagra without telling me. I think you are right to feel upset , you are trying your hardest to be open and honest with him about what you're goi g through and him doing that with out telling you would make me feel like....I was lied to....maybe? I don't know but I know I would feel hurt.

I hope everything works out well for you, and thank you for taking the time to write this post out. I couldn't find the words myself, so it's been very helpful to read this here.
Take care. (*hug*)

 

This is just my opinion:

Mixed orientation marriages are rarely happy from what I've observed.
If you know you are a lesbian and don't enjoy sex with a man, or a gay man who doesn't enjoy sex with a woman... it is a mercy to all concerned if you get a divorce. If kids are involved, it's not so black and white in my opinion. Hash it out as a family as to the timing of when you leave. (When they are 18 at the latest.)

If you are bisexual and have children, I think you should really try to make your marriage work. The grass is not always greener on the other side. If both of you are terribly unhappy in the marriage and have tried your very best to make it work, and both of you want a divorce, hash it out as a family, and then split up (when the kids are 18 at the latest).

Obviously, I'm saying put the children's happiness above your own. You owe them a secure home during their childhood. If you know one day you will be free, it will make it easier. Until then, try to stay true to your vows and give your spouse the best that you've got.

I find close, non-sexual relationships with women quite fulfilling. I have two very special female best friends that I experience intensity with minus the sex. It's not easy to keep them non-sexual, but it's possible if both sides agree. The sharing, friendship, support, and affection is enough.

I am also blessed to be in touch with my first love (male) occasionally too. Long distance.
Again, the mutual respect, sharing, support and some affection via occasional e-mails and rare brief visits are enough.

How many people can say they have their three greatest romantic loves as a part of their lives? No, we can't live together; we can't have sex together for a complex of reasons... but it is satisfying, if not ideal, and it is enough.

If I were 20, or even 30, and didn't truly enjoy living alone and wanted children, I probably wouldn't say this.

 

I have a hard time with this "staying together for the kids" stuff. I understand your concerns as I have two children of my own, but isn't it important to that you live a fulfilling, authentic life? If you can do that in your marriage, great. If not, aren't you becoming a martyr of sorts? Is it not going to make you even the least bit resentful?

My dad died when I was 12. He died at 48, a miserable man. He married my mom because he got her pregnant and he never left her because of me and because it was his second marriage and he didn't want to break up another marriage. He went to med school on a dare, loved being a doctor but hated all the politics around it--what he had really wanted to be was a biology teacher.

My point is, he was living an inauthentic life for others and he never had the opportunity to turn it around. Even at 12, I could sense his unhappiness. I wished so much he would have just left her, been happy. That's what I wanted for him.

Our time here is limited. I just think it's important to consider that. You can love and take care of your children and give them all they need regardless.

 

It's such a tough spot to be in. It seems that wherever you turn, someone gets hurt. It's also hard not knowing where you stand. I went through a phase where I was afraid of destroying everything for something I wasn't even sure of. I am sure now, but I still wonder if I'm making the right decisions. We can only do what we feel is best for ourselves and our families. It's so hard when there is no "right" answer, huh? Life would be so much easier if we could just fast forward 10 years to get a glimpse of what will be it could be. Or if someone would just make the hard decisions for us.

Good luck.

 

While we can all be a little goofy/wacky/over the top at times, at least all of us are examining our lives and deciding not to settle. I just remember so many miserable adults when I was younger. I don't want to be one nor associate with one. Keep moving!

 

Hindsight is 20/20.

Many of us who are married entered marriage wanting to live a normal (heterosexual) life and raise a family believing that's what we should do based on parental, religious, and/or societal scripts while in denial about our own sexuality. As time passes and we gain clarity about our sexuality, we realize we face an explicit and often painful choice to live authentically or choose to somehow reconcile our newly discovered sexuality with our values. Our spouses may feel that we've used them as cover - a human shield - which may be true from a certain perspective once we've achieved the clarity of hindsight but our intentions were always genuine and acting on the scripts presented to us early in life.

 

Yeah I realized I kind of sounded like an asshole after the fact. I didn't mean it that way, very sorry. I'm in a weird place right now. Everyone's journey is different and what's right for one is not right for anyone, or even comparable. I look forward to following your journey as well.(*hug*)

 

EC is a supportive forum. Sometimes posts are fluffy, direct, or somewhere in between. As long as you offer constructive advice that's meant to be helpful to the OP, you shouldn't have to apologize for candor. Coming out is not a cakewalk and sometimes grit is necessary. Thanks for bringing this perspective to the conversion.

 

darlin, that sounds highly judgemental. what works for you, and if it works thats fantastic, may not apply to someone else even if it is a similar situation.