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I've failed again at making friends/being gay

Discussion in 'General Support and Advice' started by lottaotter, Jul 9, 2022.

  1. lottaotter

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    The LGBT sports group I'm a part of had a one-year anniversary tonight which involved a party at someone's house.

    I didn't go because I felt pretty nervous about:

    1. it being at someone's house who I don't know well
    2. said person doesn't like me very much (I think)
    3. I'm pretty nervous around big crowds
    4. I've been feeling more shy than usual recently
    5. They were going to move onto a gay venue afterwards

    I feel like I've failed. I was so scared to go because I was worried no one likes me, or would talk to me, or that I'd be wearing clothes that aren't any good (I'm never sure what to wear). If it had been a going for drinks at a normal pub I would have gone, but I'm not totally comfy going to any LGBT-specific places yet :/

    I feel really ashamed. Someone else on the group asked me if I was going and I made up an excuse about having a prior engagment (he could tell it was a lie). He said he'd love me to go too, so I feel I've let everyone else down too. And now I've blown my chance completely. Who knows when the next social event will be? I'm just very nervous about the kind of loud, boisterous places that gay people seem to love- what's wrong with a normal bar or pub?? I'm totally comfy in one of those! Am I weird for not wanting to go to the house of someone I barely know?

    I feel ashamed of being 28 and still not enjoying this kind of stuff. Everyone in the group is much richer and better-educated than me too- I feel so stupid and inferior around them- they all have degrees and have high-paying jobs, but I'm just a cleaner from a poorer area (and a university drop-out). And don't even get me started on how they all look good when I look like shit.
     
  2. bsg75apollo

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    I have no friends, but unlike you, I haven't even taken that first step to get a life. I have felt some version of what you said. But reading it, makes it all seem like a giant load of bullshit and that inner critic who is saying all those things is a big old liar.
     
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  3. Mirko

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    Hi there! I don't think it makes you weird for not being comfortable or wanting to go to someone's place for a party or social get together. We all have our places where we feel comfortable, and if being at a bar or pub is a place that makes you feel comfortable, that's great!

    It is also perfectly okay to feel uncomfortable with going to places that are specifically geared towards LGBTQ+ . And it is also okay to say that.

    One thing to perhaps work on is the shame that you are experiencing. One way to start addressing it, is to think about what makes you the great person that you are. Does it matter that others are richer, better educated, have higher paying jobs? No. Comparison can make things much harder because there will always be something that someone has, that you don't - and it does not matter what it is.

    We all have our experiences, the things that worked out and that didn't work out. If things didn't work out the way you had originally hoped, maybe there are still goals in there, that you would like to achieve. :slight_smile:
     
  4. lottaotter

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    Thank you. I often feel bad for being 'too gay' around straight people and 'not gay enough' around gays. I would try gay venues more often, as some of them where I live seem like quieter places, but then they always seem to have to have some sort of loud event like a drag show on... Every. Single. Night.

    I feel ashamed about how far I have come [haven't come] compared to other people- there are people in the sports club who are from countries where being gay is not accepted at all, and yet they have so much confidence compared to me. I just can't shake the feeling that I'm 28 and I ought to have my shit together by now.

    The thing is, when I don't compare myself I love my [lower-paid] job. I get a real sense of satisfaction from it. I like my collegaues a lot as they're all from a similar background to me. I also chose to drop out of university recently. I was not even studying an academic subject, but I know this was the right decision for me, yet I still feel like I've failed, even though I'm content with the lifestyle I've purposely pursued. But one goal I suppose I should try is being comfortable in spaces where everyone is LGBTQ and it's loud and you're expected to dance. I've always felt inferior because I don't like nightclubs. I'm the same with live music events- never been to one, ever wanted to, but feel ashamed about that.

    A few weeks ago I was trying to make a list of things I like about myself. It's not a huge list, to be honest. I was trying to add two things a day to it, but didn't manage for very long.

    When I see the others today and if they ask me why I didn't go I was thinking of saying that I'm nervous in big groups and maybe even say that I'm especially cautious of LGBTQ spaces.
     
  5. lottaotter

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    It's frustrating isn't it, because I don't know how to counter the inner-critic. And my inner-critic sounds a lot liek real-life people, so I worry that maybe I would be being completely deluded to like myself.
     
  6. chicodeoro

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    Hi LottaOtter, a lot of what you write about feels so familiar to me from my own life. I've been through phases when I've not felt like I've fitted in and often I've scurried back to the comfort of my safety zone. I wonder..do you have any friends who accept you simply for being you? Ones where you don't have to pretend, you can just be relax and know that they are ok with you?

    Also...confidence. I remember being like you in my late 20s and thinking that so many people were so much more successful or at ease with themselves. In my experience that means they're only able to cover it up better. All of us are 'winging it' to a lesser or greater extent.

    It took me sooo long to build up my confidence. That confidence only came, I think, from finding a modicum of success in my chosen field and knitting together a support structure of friends from all different backgrounds. It didn't come, really, until my 30s.

    I think you should say this. Because then you're being honest and honesty is the mortar with which we build friendships - people really appreciate it (I know I do) and they're likely to take this into account next time they have a social event.

    Beth x
     
  7. lottaotter

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    Thank you for your message Beth. I'm not sure that I do have any friends who I can be myself around. I have a group of friends at home (three hours from where I live now) but we are drifting apart. Whenever I let my guard down and 'act gay' two of them often look disapproving and uncomfy though :frowning2: I definitey moderate my behaviour around them. And in the city I live in now (for almost there years) I only have oe friend, who is also one of my housemates. I have gone to a lot of stuff to try to make friends- learning a language, this sports group, a community garden... but failed so far.

    I do hope my confidence picks up soon. I feel I've worked so very hard since childhood to push myself, but I don't feel I can see results. And even if (as my parents often say) I'm A LOT more confident than I used to be, I'm still a lifetime behind normal people. Do you mean like doing well at work? Because for me at the moment that is one thing that is really going well. It's the first time I've enjoyed my job, and I genuinely enjoy getting up in the morning. Four blissful hours of doing something I'm good at - cleaning - in a museum, around other people who grew up on a council estate like me, with lots of laughter and fun relaxed conversation. Unfortunately despite that I've been finding it difficult to come out at work to everyone. I have been feeling a bit 'invisible' even there recently- unable to chip into conversations and feeling more shy than usual.

    Unfortunately I've let myself down again here. Although they talked about the party a lot no one asked me about it, and I had no idea how to bring it up :frowning2: I've come home and burst into tears. I just have no idea at the moment how to talk to people I don't know well. I'm always worried I'm too boring. Plus, I have a really good memory, so I don't like to ask people too many questions in case they think I'm creepy. I think I make people nervous and scared to approach me because I give off 'nervous energy'. At least that's what my 'friend' always tells me. I even got told by a stranger the other day that I 'Look like a transphobe'. And it doesn't help that I don't know the first thing about gay culture, so I can't talk about that either.

    One other thing that I did wrong is that this sports group have recently had t-shirts printed with their logo and I am one of the only people who didn't order one :frowning2: I didn't feel I deserved to wear it to be honest. Now I'll stand out even more as the unfriendly one.
     
    #7 lottaotter, Jul 10, 2022
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2022
  8. TinyWerewolf

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    Beth, bsg75apollo, and Mirko make some good points. In fact, Beth the words right out of my mouth about confidence- I'm not a very confident guy at all (I'm working on it), but unless I confided that in someone they would have no idea. It's about a bravado among our crowd and a lot of people. I recognize that now at 21, we're all just learning the real twists and turns of adult life- that's scary at first! I went to a bar for the first time ever in April, and it was bizzare and a bit nerve wracking for me (granted, my family was there with me). You can walk into a bar or pub and feel at ease! That's something!

    The confidence thing plays into making friends too, it's something I struggled with during my school days (and still do). Social anxiety creeps in when our confidence is low, makes us overthink what to say, when to say it, how to say it, how we appear. For me, this showed as a social awkwardness among my peers. I'll spare you the bad stuff inbetween, but I learned with therapy and observing how people interact- I learned to hide my fear and behave as if I'm "normal". It's all a facade until you know someone well, then you start letting them in. Underneath that facade a lot of times is another person who is scared.

    PS: That stranger who said you look like a transphobe, they're not someone you should let keep you up at night. We all know you're not a transphobe, and based off your descriptions of yourself in the past I don't think you look like one (I have a decent memory when I can focus for once).
     
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  9. Mirko

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    There is a theme emerging here: confidence.

    It's all about how confident you are and wether you are owning your story, without any prerequisites. The feelings you are experiencing about feeling too gay or not gay enough are likely as a result of comparisons and a part of you still working on becoming comfortable with yourself. Over time, you will find that it doesn't matter 'how gay' you are. The only thing that matters is being yourself, what makes you feeling comfortable.

    The great thing is that you already know that comparison to others takes away from your accomplishments, from what you like, or indeed love. You love your job... talk about the satisfaction you get from it. You know you made the choices because you felt they were the best decisions for you. I love the fact that you mentioned that you are content with your lifestyle.

    Try not to look at your choices as a negative - there is no reason to do so. Part of owning your story is to acknowledge to yourself that you are more than okay with the choices and decisions you have made. That will allow you to start speaking about yourself with confidence and also help you to build the confidence to stand on your feet and say: 'this is me.'

    It doesn't matter how long the list of what you like about yourself is. What matters is that you know that there are things you like (and perhaps even love) about yourself. That is the most important piece and goes to the heart of 'this is me.' Add the two things you haven't added yet to the list. :slight_smile:

    Owning your story, acknowledging that you are good with the choices you have made, could also help with addessing the shame you are experiencing.
     
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  10. chicodeoro

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    Jack and Mirko make some good points here, Lottaotter. I'd just like to add that we all think you're fantastic here - you're incredibly brave to be so open and honest about your progress. Hopefully the knowledge that you have friends here is boosting your confidence at least a bit!

    Just a couple more points - are there any people in the running club whom you feel a little closer to? I know at first when you join a new group it's easy for it to feel like a monolith. Then after a while you notice there are some folk you find it easier to talk to or who you find out you have something in common with. Gravitate to those people and that might be a way to feel at ease in the group as a whole.

    Oh and order that T shirt! Of course you deserve to wear it!

    Hugs, Beth
     
  11. lottaotter

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    Thank you very much. I definitely agree that 'fake it till you make it' often works with confidence. Recently I've been feeling too scared of social situations for it to work but hopefully this is just a passing phase.
     
  12. lottaotter

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    Yes- confidence is at the root of so many of my problems. I hope I am still working on being comfy with myself- it doesn't always feel like I have made progress.

    'Owning your story' is a good way to put it. I have this yearning to tell my story too, so that the other gay people I know - to whom socialising in gay spaces with gay people is normal - understand that for me I have to put in so much more effort just to show up in these events. I want them to understand that I am sincerely trying my best. I'd like to be judged against the progress I've made and the courage I show (because I really think I do), not against other people who had a headstart.
     
  13. lottaotter

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    Thank you :slight_smile: Yes, it has been helpful to come on EC and it is making being gay more normal and everyday for me.

    There is one person who I think understands what's up and maybe understands a bit better that I'm shy around gay people. He was the one who tried to get me to change my mind about not going to the party, so I feel like I let him down a bit. I always feel surprised that he voluntarily talks to me because he's so very out and proud and seems to have his life sorted; high-paying job, fancy apartment and gorgeous long-term boyfriend.

    One really good thing has happened since I made the post. They are organising another social event and this time there is no alcohol, it's not in an LGBTQ space and it's in the morning :slight_smile: All perfect for me. They're doing a walk/hike and it sounds perfect for me so I've said I'll go.

    It's weird- sit me in a normal [straight] pub and I can have a great night and feel relaxed and at-ease and like I belong there, but just the mention of an LGBTQ meet-up sends my anxiety through the roof.
     
  14. TinyWerewolf

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    Is there anything that could've put you more on edge as of late? A bad interaction with someone or drinking a ton of caffeine (that really affects my anxiety in general)?
     
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  15. chicodeoro

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    There you go - he's probably being friendly because in you he sees someone who isn't so confident and wants you to feel at home in the group. He's being friendly because, well, a lot of people are just nice in that way!

    Remember though they may all seem confident at the moment every single member of the club knows what it's like to feel the fear and go through the ordeal of coming out. They might have done it at an earlier age but they know all about the adjustment in the sense of self that it brings. None of us were born out.

    Beth
     
    #15 chicodeoro, Jul 12, 2022
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2022
  16. lottaotter

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    Oh definitely! The interaction with the person who said I looked like a transphobe was intense (long story, won't share it here, I understand it was just that specific person being a douche, not all trans people, and I feel better about it now that I did just after it had happened. It involved being yelled at in public to give you an idea!).

    I also usually go to the gay sports group every week, but had to miss a week due to work schedule, and I find that missed week does set me back a bit when it comes to feeling comfy socialising
     
  17. lottaotter

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    Thank you. The sense of shame I have about how 'far along' the journey I am is immense. There are plenty of factors that caused it, but they aren't all good things to bring up in polite conversation, so I don't often feel comfy discussing it anywhere but EC, but I still feel the urge to justify it.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he suggested the idea of a hike as a social event to the organiser, thinking people like me might be more into that than drinking at a gay club.
     
  18. TinyWerewolf

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    I want to ask what happened, but since you said you'd rather not say any further I won't pry. It makes sense why you've been more anxious this week, I've been yelled at in public before and it's nerve wracking. I'm sorry you had to deal with that.

    I hate when I had plans for once and had to cancel them for work. My friends were having a block party and firework show on the 4th. I was going to go until my new boss asked me to open because he left his key (his first full week there). It always sucks when that happens.
     
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  19. Mirko

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    Reading through all the responses, I think you are well on your way to start feeling comfortable and being okay with where you are at. You have already identified that shame is at the core of where you are at in your journey.

    One thing I would suggest is to work on that shame and is to think about whether it really matter how far you are in the process of being comfortable and being out? You will probably find that at the end of the day, it doesn't really matter because everybody that you meet is at their own stage and know that the very people you speak with and would like to spend time with, were most likely at the same spot that you are finding yourself in presently.

    Also make sure (and as odd as it sounds) to talk to yourself about the shame that you are experiencing. Name it, define it and say it out loud. Saying it out loud, you are no longer giving it the room to grow or to fester within you. Secrecy, or keeping it hidden, allows shame to grow. After that, be kind to yourself and remind yourself of the things you have already accomplished.

    Do you have one person in your life that you trust? If you do, ask them to listen to you and speak with them about your experiences and shame. It is perfectly alright to talk about shame - if you trust and know the person well and know they are empathetic, their response could help you start moving beyond the shame.

    The other thing to keep in mind, is that we are our own worst critics. We ourselves place roadblocks in front of us, preventing us from achieving what we want to achieve - it doesn't matter what it is. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter if something you would like to do is successful or not. What matters is that you have tried it; what matters is that you are in the arena as it were, and pursue what you would like to or want to pursue. You are in the arena, trying to move forward while also showing to others, 'this' is who you are, 'this' is who would like to be, and 'this' is what you would like to do.
     
  20. BiGemini87

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    I think @Mirko has reached the heart of it, and by the sounds of it, you have too. Your confidence floundering around other LGBT people (particularly other gay people who live the "richer" lifestyle) is understandable. It's hard not to compare ourselves to others when we notice a vast disparity between our characters, appearance, successes, etc. But like Mirko said--we are often our own worst critics.

    It's 100% okay to beg off an engagement that makes you uncomfortable (i.e. house of someone you barely know, loud and crowded, etc.) It sounds like the one person who asked you if you'd be going and said they'd love if you did probably likes you; maybe you can arrange to meet him them and a few others you're comfortable with in a more relaxed setting? I'm sure if they get to know you, they'll understand your discomfort in more crowded settings, even if they don't experience it themselves.
     
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