Are you religious?

Gotta love Internet circle jerks.

 

This is a stupid thread of the highest calibre, it should be closed.

 

Religion is important to some LGBT folks. That's perfectly okay with me. I'm not personally religious but if others are, that's cool.

I've found that atheism and the dislike of a religion can at times almost be a religion of itself. A close friend was an atheist and she preached it to everyone and looked down upon monotheistic religions.

Anyway it's not bad to be religious. The only thing I dislike is when religious people try to force others to convert and when they use religion to spread hate. There are some very nice religious people out there. There are also some really hateful religious people. Same goes with non-religious people. It happens. I don't like when non-religious LGBT people look down upon religious LGBT people or vice versa.

 

No, I am not religious. I don't look at the world around me and see any evidence that suggests a divine artificer. Furthermore, I believe that the texts of the three major world religions are racist, sexist and homophobic. Many of the faithful read their scripture, take it to heart, and behave in a manner which is utterly vile to this community. Some--including many LGBT people--are able to maintain their faith without believing in these oppressive things, and I applaud their moral rectitude. Though, I am led to wonder why they discovered the well-spring of moral truth their brothers and sisters who are reading differently failed to...

 

I am kinda religious. As my title suggests, I am a Hellene. I believe in the ancient Greek gods and goddesses. There is nothing against homosexuality (actually, it is somewhat supportive), progress, science, etc. Stuff like that. I don't push my beliefs on anyone. In fact, I rarely talk about it to anyone except two friends of mine.

 

I am kind of religious, and I like to go to church or something, but not ehen there is a mass. i go there when it is mostly empty and I pray myself. I don't like what some religious folks say, that it is wrong or something, like my father's parents do.

I don't mind religious people in general, i just dislike those who tell me I am wrong and those who tell me what I have to believe.

 

I thikn you and I may have slightly differing ideas about what the core of religion (I'm specifically thinking of Christianity) is, IrishLad. The problem does not lie with Christianity or the Bible, and one should not blame those. The problem lies with the interpretation of specific parts of the Bible in a way that goes against its core message, and that is unique to individuals.

 

No. After the life I've had it's hard to believe in such things. Additionally the child abuse scandals, murdering in the name of faith, discriminating against people in the name of faith. I never really bought into it, but seeing those things now, I never will.

 

Hi IrishLad, I just want to say I totally understand where you are coming from. I was raised in the Jehovah's Witnesses until my mom left the church when I was 14, and I've been agnostic the last few years. It's actually rather hard for me to post this because the only people I've ever told I was agnostic were my close family and my therapist. You just never know how people will react, if they will try to preach to you or something.

I also have some trouble understanding how someone can reconcile being religious and gay. Between the ex-gay camps, gay exorcisms, Muslim countries that punish homosexuality with death, and the Mormon Church donating a huge amount of money to Prop 8, it just seems like religion is a huge roadblock to LGBT people finally securing their rights. But hey, if it's really important to an LGBT person that they have a relationship with God and they're able to find peace with it, than that's their business. I'll respect their opinions as long as they respect mine.

 

So... very much not religious.

 

http://emptyclosets.com/forum/chit-chat/66571-you-religious.html


Anyway, I think too many people think being religious = being Christian. I'm currently an agnostic athiest but Buddhism really interests me and I'm going to look more into it for sure. And although the bible is personally ridiculous to me, I don't judge others who believe in what it has to say.

 

Buddhism is wonderful. I have a ton of respect for that, and Wicca. If I ever met someone who was into either I'd at least want to learn about it so I could gain a better understanding. =)

I also follow the Dalai Lama on Twitter. xD

 

I agree with you on all of that, except for that there is only one verse. There is one in Leviticus and one in Romans chapter 2, that I know of. I don't agree with those interpretations on those verses, so in a way neither of them actually condemn homosexuality. Some people translate it as condemning lust or rape. If you flip a few pages down Leviticus, you also find where we aren't supposed to eat pork. So, while I am a practicing Catholic, I do find things wrong with the church. By eating pork and condemning something mentioned in the same book, they are choosing which parts of the bible to believe.

 

Nop

 

LOL I love that :lol:

 

I'll answer the OP first and read the other posts after ...

Here's my take on the subject.

I was raised Lutheran/evangelical, and though they're not very LGBT friendly, there are many who are still. If not inclusive, so at least tolerant. The theological basis of being anti-gay is definitely there, but there is a lot of stuff in the bible that is ignored or updated to fit modern views of human rights and so on. There isn't any branch of Christianity that does not cherry pick the bible. Simple as that. There is no need to exclude LGBT people in Christianity aside from wanting to uphold bigotry.

So yeah, religion can definitely be used to fuel hatred, no doubt something you've seen a lot of in Ireland. It doesn't have to though. Most of my family are religious. They are all nice people even if they aren't particularly tolerant on some issues. Religions in usually conservative and reluctantly updating its views to follow the progress of society.

For me, religion is simply redundant. I don't need it. Not on a personal level and not as a way of answering big questions. I have found being non-religious to be infinitely more personally rewarding. Truly. It was a huge relief to give it up. I also think religions are horrible at answering questions because the answers are constructed to cater to our desires rather than actually find the truth through investigation. I am also appalled by all the hatred and bigotry that dogmatism allows.

Also, as a feminist, I don't much care for the patriarchal structures of most religions.

So yeah. Me personally, I'm a secular humanist. And I am very happy with that. Others can believe what they want for all I care, as long as it doesn't limit my freedom and hurt people.

---------- Post added 9th Sep 2012 at 02:27 PM ----------

It's not like those aren't connected though. Religion form its followers, and the followers form their religion.

 

I know you don't mean it, but you aren't really being respectful to our member who do happen to be religious.

Its okay to have different believes, but its not okay to create threads in order to convince/show people how absurd their own believes are. If you truly want other points of views without being critical, then you cannot make it into a debate. Let people give their opinion, learn from it, disagree or agree, and then respect their opinion.

Might not be the debate you are looking for, but EC is hardly the place for those. Lets keep it civil and keep in mind that there are members who are very religious on here, and they deserve as much respect about their believes as we all do

 

This. I'm starting to get really fucking sick of people starting threads here that are obviously going to just cause shit.

 

I am not religious, but I understand the difference between people who are religious and assholes who hide behind their religion

 

Religion is not a necessity for morals, but does provide a good teaching tool. In your argument, you could replace "religion" with quite a few other nouns. Morals are developed from our collective experiences and worldviews, and religion falls under that umbrella.

You're implying quite a few things there, incorrect ones at that, particularly the notion that all religious people are mindless followers. Not at all true. The only time I would accept that as an argument would be in the case of true religious extremists, but for the vast majority of the "religious" population, people are free to think for themselves.

I'd also argue that many "religious" people who have homophobic views do not have them strictly because that's what their morals say, but rather they're undecided on the matter. A friend of mine who I came out to (and was rather convinced would take it badly) ended up being totally fine with it. His reasoning? Well, he hadn't done enough looking into what all of religion said on the matter and since it wasn't affecting his life, there was no reason to be bothered by it.

So, more often than not, I think it's a case of religious people accepting that view because it's the first one presented to them on the matter and not having it adequately challenged. It's not a strong belief, but rather a religiously-constructed default.

Wait, it's selfish to believe that we DIDN'T create everything in our world and AREN'T responsible for what we have today? That sounds like quite the opposite.

Think about this for a second: for someone with no scientific knowledge, using a scientific/evolutionary argument for how the world is is just as convoluted as saying some dude up in the clouds created everything we had.

You're denouncing religion like it's the most horrific thing on the face of the planet because of some beliefs they share amongst groups of people... what exactly do you think you're doing right now? It's easy for us to say "we're right and they're wrong" when we want to argue our own side, but if you step back for a second, denouncing all religion like that is comparably bad to religions denouncing all homosexuality.

Just some food for thought.