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I really want to solve this once and for all

Discussion in 'Sexual Orientation' started by confused155, Mar 2, 2019.

?

What do you think I am?

  1. Bisexual

    14 vote(s)
    87.5%

  2. Gay

    1 vote(s)
    6.3%

  3. Straight

    1 vote(s)
    6.3%
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  1. confused155

    confused155
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    So where do I start. First off, thanks for taking the time to read my post and I appreciate any comments you can give to me. I am just approaching 25 years old, and for about the past 10 years I have always had the thought about if deep down I am gay. I have exclusively to this day been with women, but that is because I am nowhere near ready to try anything sexual with a man. I would like to break down my attractions into a few categories to give you all a better understanding:


    Fantasies:


    Porn: I watch both gay and straight, although gay porn I can admit turns me on much more. Bottoming and topping both turn me on a ton of I’m watching the porn. I still however only fantasize about men about 40-50% of the time, mainly because I feel shame when I do. If I fantasize about men without porn, it doesn’t really come close to porn ever. I can still get turned on but it is nowhere near as powerful. I however on days where I feel more gay will have constant thoughts about it and will be thinking about when I can go relieve myself.


    When I fantasize about women, it helps a lot if I picture a girl I know. I am mainly attracted to the girl, and her butt, but I would say these fantasies are not quite as strong as when I watch gay porn, but can still be quite enjoyable when the thought creeps up. The fantasies are also normally taboo, either with someone I shouldn’t be with or doing something taboo with the girl (anal, etc.).


    I dated a girl for just about 2 years, and I definitely loved her, but I always felt like I was missing some attraction there, and even once in a while would have trouble performing. I’m not sure if this was because of the anxiety of worrying I’m gay or because I wasn’t that turned on. There were some times having sex that were good and enjoyable.


    In real life, I have gotten erections from hundreds of girls, and just flirting with them can get me there. I also only actively seek out women and as soon as I have a few drinks that is all I can think about. It may be because the idea of feeling straight and powerful makes me feel good, but I am wondering if I always do this when I drink to try and feel more straight and to convince myself I’m “straight.”


    With the girls I’ve had sex with, if I feel emotionally attracted to them I can be super turned on. If I’m not, I will still be turned on but sometimes the sex will be just okay. I am definitely much more turned on by girls butts than any other part of their body. I have had a few times where I was literally so turned on I came really quick and enjoyed every second of the experience, and other times where I wasn’t that turned on and the thought was in my head “maybe I’m gay.”


    Romantically, what gives me motivation and excitement is girls. On the days where I feel gay, I feel a bit depressed because getting woman or going out to places and meeting them is what gets me most excited. With guys, probably due to the fact that I know there is no way I would act on anything probably is the reason why I don’t get excited or even feel anything. Furthermore, I am repulsed thinking about kissing a guy and I have never felt emotional attraction to a male, and not sexual attraction either that I can really recall. If I ever fantasize about men, it is always their bodies and the physical act (never a specific person) where with woman it is normally a girl I know and a scenario that feels taboo or bad. It doesn’t really work fantasizing about them if it doesn’t feel somewhat taboo.


    I am just wondering if anyone has a similar experience as me. I have a tendency to think I have everything (kind of a mild hypochondriact) where I am constantly worried I have something wrong with me or that I have something. Literally dozens of times I’ve thought I’ve had a sickness of some other thing wrong and pretty much every time it is in my head or caused by a different factor. I am just in the bargaining phase and I’m now starting to acknowledge my attraction to men, and I’m trying anything I can to feel attraction to women or to hang on to the straight life. I will also have days or weeks where I feel entirely straight and confident, and in my head I will think that I am entirely straight and confident. However I’ll then have days or weeks where I feel gay and in my mind at that point I’ll see no other way around it than me being gay. I know this does sound a lot like a bisexual but I know I can’t be fully independent because I deep down want to be straight so I can’t know for sure if it’s me just manifesting any attraction I have towards women. All in all, I think I am probably bisexual, but it is just the stories of a lot of men realizing later in life that they are actually just gay is what scares me and makes me worry that deep down I am gay. Also I have had a few girls I meet question whether I’m gay which feels weird because I didn’t think I ever gave out a gay vibe at all, and it was even a girl I was hitting on before. However most girls and my friends would think that I am definitely not gay if they met me. Thanks for listening and I appreciate your comments!
     
    #1 confused155, Mar 2, 2019
  2. Chip

    Chip
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    A couple of things stand out.

    First, the revulsion and shame associated with arousal to gay stimuli has nothing to do with sexual orientation; that's conditioning, and is a byproduct of the messages from media and organized religion (thank you, religious bigots.) So I think you can toss that as any sort of signal as to whether or not you're gay or bi.

    Second, I concur with your assessment that you're in the bargaining stage, so at this moment, it may be hard to ascertain any clear direction one way or the other until you get more comfortable with the idea that you might be bi or gay.

    Third, it sounds like there's underlying anxiety. If so, and assuming this isn't solely around the sexual orientation piece (it sounds like it isn't), then the anxiety itself can get in the way of understanding what your sexual orientation is, so putting your energy into resolving that first might be your best bet.

    If I had to guess based on the above, I'd say there are clear indications that you're at least bisexual. I can't really assess the rest of what you're saying because it's hard to tell, given your circumstances if it is justification and rationalization, or authentic feeling... not that you're being untruthful, but more that there could be a part of you that's vehemently resisting the idea that you might be gay. I think as you work on the anxiety piece, and simply get to a place where you can let go of worrying about it, the answer will become clearer.
     
    #2 Chip, Mar 3, 2019
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  3. Romeo

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    I would say bi. And stop stressing it. If your worried about having to tell others don’t. I would say just do you. If one day you run into some one and see u kissing another man. O welll. You like it? Be comfortable with you. If u ever hook up with a man and u like it then you now know you like sex with men. Feeling for that person. Male or female means something. Just enjoy your life. And do you
     
    #3 Romeo, Mar 3, 2019
  4. confused155

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    Thanks for your responses. Yes I know that I need to work on the idea of accepting that I could possibly be gay in order to fully be able to assess what I am. My thing is that I have truly felt attraction to women, and at this point in my life they are what excite me if I ever leave the house or go out, etc. What worries me is I have read how if people who are at my stage hookup with a man, they say their attraction to women fades. I guess I’m just worried that if I do take the leap I am scared I will really like it and I’ll go down that path because I’m holding onto the idea of being straight or at least liking women. I would actually say a big part of my identity is the way I will approach women and smooth talk them, etc so maybe this is something I should work on. Chip, do you have any recommendations for how to work on this social conditioning/to help me work on potentially accepting the fact I could be gay so that I can try and move forward.
     
    #4 confused155, Mar 3, 2019
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  5. confused155

    confused155
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    And in regards to the anxiety piece, I don’t really suffer from anxiety. It is more that I am just really uncomfortable accepting the notion that I could be gay. I actually keep a pretty level head with everything else. I am just worried about losing my identity of being a heterosexual man which is something I will need to work on
     
    #5 confused155, Mar 3, 2019
  6. regkmc

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    Hey man, you sound just like where I have been. All I can say is that holding onto something too tightly will eventually suffocate that thing or person or idea or ourselves.

    I think that letting go, at your own pace, understanding the consequences but not letting them take you down is the Path.

    Easier said than done.

    I can tell you that meditation, mindfulness, family support and meeting other gay/bi people has been most helpful for me to this point.
     
    #6 regkmc, Mar 3, 2019
  7. confused155

    confused155
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    Hey thanks for your reply! If you’ve been down my path, do you mind telling me where it led you? Did it lead to the realization you’re bisexual or are you gay? I will try and work on getting support, I just don’t want to come out to anyone when I for one haven’t accepted myself and when I’m not sure exactly what I am at this point.
     
    #7 confused155, Mar 3, 2019
  8. regkmc

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    Well, the truth is that I care less about the words right now than I did a year ago. I’m married, taking care of my family, talking with my wife, acknowledging attraction that I refused (consciously and subconsciously) to acknowledge for decades. Trying to breathe into the fear and uncertainty, but allowing it to exist.

    I actually told a bunch of people that I thought I was bisexual or gay because I was so distressed and thought talking about it would be helpful. I certainly hadn’t, and still haven’t fully accepted it....but I discovered three things. 1) it feels good to share with people who are non-judgmental 2) it feels good to share with people and risk judgment! And 3) most people really don’t care - they just want you to be happy.

    I’m not sure how things will go for me in the future, but I’m ok with where I am today.

    No book or podcast or therapy or conversation with another person though, has allowed me to learn as much as being with myself (meditation, exercise, etc) in a loving way....and anyone can do it!
     
    #8 regkmc, Mar 3, 2019
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  9. regkmc

    regkmc
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    Maybe you could say to someone....just for practice....I think I’m attracted to guys too, and I’m struggling with that”. I mean - that’s a fact right? Perhaps no one knows where you’ll end up, gay, bi, both, neither, whatever, but it’s nice to speak truth as we’re experiencing it.

    Without expectation for a particular response, maybe it would help you to progress. It seems you’ve been thinking this way for a while, so it could be helpful to talk about it with another person.
     
    #9 regkmc, Mar 3, 2019
  10. Chip

    Chip
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    So this is an imperfect analogy, but the above is a little bit like worrying that something is wrong, but being afraid to go to the doctor to find out whether anything actually is wrong.

    If you do take the step and like it, and find your attraction to women fading, you didn't "make yourself gay"... you're actually being authentic to who you are. And, if we take the leap and make the assumption that this is actually the case, not doing so is a huge disservice to both yourself and whomever you might date or marry... because at some point, you won't be able to keep pushing it down, and at that point, your marriage will blow up and you'll have way more problems. (Take a look at some of the threads in the "Later in Life" section for some real-world examples.)

    Conversely, if you pursue connections with men, and after you've tried it a few times, figure out that it doesn't excite you, or doesn't excite you any more than women, then you have your answer and can move forward appropriately.

    In short... being afraid of a given answer isn't going to make that answer go away, and usually it's best to just confront the issue and see where it takes you.

    That makes a lot of sense. Your schema of yourself is of a suave guy who is good with the ladies; accepting being gay would mean that your foundational schema of who you are no longer fits, which means rebuilding your entire perception of who you are. And that's terrifying for most people. So perhaps one of the best ways to address this is to consider that, no matter what happens, you'll still be you, and that even if you are gay, this isn't anything new, it's just that you are newly aware of it. If you can realize that it's not that you're actually changing, you're just getting in touch with your authentic self (whatever that is, gay or straight or bi), then usually it gets a little less scary.

    And you can also consider that, realistically, life isn't a whole lot different whether you're gay or straight. The only real difference is who you go home to at night, and what you do in the bedroom. Especially in 2019, many of the stigmas that existed even 10 years ago have mostly gone away, and so being appreciated and accepted as a gay or bi man isn't much different than being accepted as a straight man.
     
    #10 Chip, Mar 3, 2019
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  11. confused155

    confused155
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    Great advice chip. I really appreciate how well thought your answers are and how you moderate posts to continue to be rationale. It seems like a lot of things are getting away from that today. I do believe I have some exploring to do once I feel ready. The only thing about exploring is that I have never felt conscious attraction to a guy in real life and I have never been tempted to try hooking up with one. It probably comes with the barriers I set up but at this point in time the best thing I can probably do is eliminate the barriers and see if that changes anything.
     
    #11 confused155, Mar 6, 2019
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  12. confused155

    confused155
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    And also chip, I read something briefly on another post of you quoting research on men who are only physically attracted to men but both sexually and emotionally attracted to women. Is there anything to this or is this just up and coming research
     
    #12 confused155, Mar 6, 2019
  13. Chip

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    The above is really dangerous and destructive territory, because it feeds into stereotypes that gay people must have certain mannerisms, behaviors, or aspects of self that make them stand out. While this might be true for some, it certainly isn't true for all, and, conversely, there are plenty of straight men who trip people's gaydar, but are, in fact straight (and not closeted)... but some gay guys have difficulty accepting that.

    It's important that when we communicate these sorts of issues, that we don't inadvertently reinforce stereotypes.

    I have never, ever seen this definition or concept quoted or stated anywhere in the credible literature. Without credible citations, I'd say that's an extremely suspect definition.

    Again, I've not seen evidence that would support the idea that the brain differences between heterosexual and homosexual men apply only to those who are "exclusively homosexual."

    Ummmm... while Kinsey does tell us that the majority of people are somewhere on the spectrum and only a small percentage of people are at one end or the other, it's again dangerous to imply that "most men are naturally bisexual" because that can really send the wrong message to people who are just coming out... it can, for those who are truly gay and struggling to accept it, prolong that process, and it may at worst put someone at risk if they (falsely) believe that, since "most men are bisexual", they should be able to get a given (straight) guy to have sex with them.

    This isn't to say that there aren't plenty of people who are genuinely bisexual; only that the majority of people, even though they may technically be somewhere on the spectrum, tend to identify (and behave) within the trinary of straight-bi-gay.
     
    #13 Chip, Mar 6, 2019
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  14. Chip

    Chip
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    That's pretty common, actually. Remembering the five stages of loss (in this case, the idea of losing identity as straight), denial-anger-bargaining-grief-acceptance, our conscious mind can do all sorts of gyrations and rationalizations to keep us in denial when this stuff starts to come up. And one of the common rationalizations is the "I'm not attracted to guys, so why would I consider going out with one" perception. I've heard a lot of gay men say that they never realized they had same-sex attraction until one day, one particular guy, maybe someone they saw on the street, or someone they struck up a friendship with... or even, someone they had a hookup with... puts them in touch with their same-sex attraction, and often, once that barrier comes down, they suddenly find a torrent of feelings opening up. This doesn't mean that they're definitely gay... but it does indicate that there's definitely some same-sex attraction. Of course, if the opposite-sex attraction starts to fade, then the idea that they are gay becomes more clear.

    That may be a scary thought. But one thing worth knowing is... if that were going to happen, nothing you do or don't do will stop it from happening. At best, you might delay it a while, but in general, once people start opening up to the possibility, unless they're simply going to lie to themselves, whatever is really going on usually starts to emerge fairly quickly.
     
    #14 Chip, Mar 6, 2019
  15. Nickw

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    @confused155

    Hey. I'm a bisexual who was a lot like you when I was young. I used to compartmentalize my attraction to men because I was so attracted to women. "Gay guys cannot be attracted to women right?" Of course this isn't true for many gay men. I was in the bargaining period of trying to figure myself out when I met my wife and fell in love (and lust). But, I always knew there was another part of my sexuality I kept hidden. Even for bisexuals, later in life can be very stressful. Just because I can be attracted to women does not mean my attraction to men is any less. It is a mistake to believe that bisexual is "gaylite". So, if you are bisexual, then you will, likely, continue to have the attractions regardless of your relationship status. You just might not need to act on them.

    You sound younger? And, you sound like you are sexually active with women. So, why not try to date a man? I never did this and I wished my whole life I had done it just for the experience. This won't make you gay as you fear. It just might clarify it a bit. I wouldn't recommend a hookup though...at least from an app. If I based my sexuality on my first casual sexual encounter with a man I would check the "definitely straight box" I found it so unfulfilling.

    I am now doing what I wished I had when I was young....really exploring my sexuality with men I am close to. And, I've learned so much about myself in the process. Your sexuality is not something to fear.
     
    #15 Nickw, Mar 6, 2019
  16. Contented

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    Chip’s advice is spot on. Whatever your true orientation is you need to take the steps necessary to find your true North. My path was just as he mentioned in his last post. Never really thought about gay until I met the man that changed everything. He opened the floodgates of emotions and feelings I never imagined. There was no closing the gate after the torrent of change began. At the very beginning I tried to pretend I was still straight or at least bi but in short order my attraction to women faded to zero both emotionally and physically. I no longer wanted to pretend and play act. I needed to be real. This wasn’t easy as I had always pictured myself one way and now I was one of “them”. Slowly I came to terms with my same sex attraction. I am so happy I did. Living authentic now for over 2 years has been the best experience of my life. Not to say there still aren’t challenges but it worth it. Going home at the end of day to my wonderful BF and being free to love and live with him openly as 2 unapologetic gay men is as close to heaven as I can imagine. You path may be different but you need to explore it.
     
    #16 Contented, Mar 7, 2019
  17. confused155

    confused155
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    Hey thanks for your reply. Would you mind explaining a bit more how you felt before when you thought you were straight, and just how the transition occurred? What were the clues for you that your attraction to women wasn’t genuine? Do you think it faded or was it never really there? I appreciate any insight you could give
     
    #17 confused155, Mar 7, 2019
  18. confused155

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    Yes I agree with you that I should definitely explore. I just need to gain that confidence to make the first step..easier said than done though. I know my sexuality shouldn’t be something to fear, but it has always been something i feared. I however appreciate your insights and advice and will keep tracking forward! Cheers!
    ee
     
    #18 confused155, Mar 7, 2019
  19. Contented

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    I guess the answer to how I felt before would be it was ok because I had nothing to compare it to. I just thought that what guys do. It was never earth shattering but enjoyable I guess. I did it for many years.
    The transition started when by chance I met the man who would eventually become my BF. The more I got to know him themore I was attracted to him and less attracted to my then GF. After the first time we were intimate I knew I was changing. It started with sex but then I wanted an emotional connection as well. That’s when I knew for sure I wanted a same sex relationship. In a short time my attraction to my GF and women in general faded to zero. I knew Bi was not an option nor did I care. After coming out as gay and working with a fantastic LGBTQ therapist who helped me adjust to my homosexuality I realized the attraction to women was never really there I was performing a role I thought I needed to perform to have the dream of wife, home and family. Turns out I really didn’t need a woman to achieve that dream. In almost 2 1/2 years since coming out have not looked at a woman sexual, dont miss them and am perfectly happy as an openly gay man in loving relationship with my BF. Still face issues but I do so now as a 100% gay man proud of how far I have come and still excited about exploring all aspects of gay life. For me gay is so much better. My only regret is that I didn’t come to terms with being gay as a teen. If I had a do over I would have prefrred to have been gay from the beginning of sexual maturity and not wasted so many years acting straight to fit into the heteronormative mold.
     
    #19 Contented, Mar 7, 2019
  20. confused155

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    Ah I’m really glad to hear you worked everything out and have affected yourself and are happy on the other side. What I don’t exactly follow from your story is that you said there was no attraction to women in the first place. Does that mean you would never fantasize about them, never got erections from them etc? Or was it more than nothing blew you away and although you could get off to women it wasn’t nowhere near as powerful as it was with men? For me, I have days where I will really lust for a girl and will fantasize about women, etc. I guess I’m just wondering how you’re saying you never really had any attraction to them in the first place.
    ll
     
    #20 confused155, Mar 11, 2019
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