Being gay and Muslim, doubting my faith?

Actually, I meant that my friend is from RSA (=Republic of South Africa), not KSA (=Kingdom of Saudi Arabia) but he actually lived a few years in KSA. As far as I know he is not gay. He is married and everything but because we spent so much time with each other he would always (publicly) make jokes about us being a gay couple. He even introduced me as his boy friend to his mom as a joke. (His mom didn't say anything at the time so I assumed she got it was a joke but apparently after we left he called straight to his wife to ask if it was true .) He is really the only liberal minded in the family. Wears western clothing and doesn't mind other people's business. The rest of his family dresses like Taliban and their views are not that much different from the Taliban either.

I have actually heard of that. Sex among same sex is very common in sex segregated environments be it prison, single sex boarding schools or sexually repressive Islamic countries. A western friend of mine told me that guys in KSA have openly come to ask for sex because they got this funny impression that all western guys are open for gay sex.

When I lived in RSA I learned that in the prison system there is a large organized gang of criminals who themselves have sex with each other and who organize same sex sex in the prisons yet they don't identify as gays. Up to 50% of RSA prison population has had sexual intercourse with a fellow prisoner at least once.

In Iran among male university students 16% admitted to having had sex with the same sex (26% for women) during the past year. However, only 4% admitted having had a romantic relationship with the same sex for both men and women. This study was conducted by the Iranian government in attempt to find out how widely spread vice is in the campuses.

So all in all, sex with your own sex is fairly common if the circumstances are right (or wrong depending how you see it).

I'm not telling you to quit being muslim. What I'm saying is that if you don't believe in god anymore don't fear ending up in hell. You can be a "closet atheist/agnostic/non-practicing Muslim". So I mean do the salah even if you don't believe in it. You can take it as a physical exercise with all that getting up and down. You don't even have to say or think of the prayer, just think whatever you want to think. I'm forced to go to church for occasional funeral or wedding and I don't believe any of the crap the priest is telling us. I don't even listen to him, I just think about other things and get up when everyone else gets up etc.

Previously you asked why it seems like every successive generation is becoming less religious? Well, there are two reasons. First is that we no longer require religion to explain the world around us as sciences have explained most of the things once were considered religious mysteries. Second reason is that religion needs despair, fear and misery to attract people. If your life sucks it's so people wishfully think that the afterlife will be much better. Now since living standards have improved and continue improving the role of religion is falling.

Finally, you said you have a high respect for the Prophet (PBUH). I think you probably don't know much about his life or then you haven't really thought about it. This prophet married his favorite wife when she was 6 years old. The marriage was consummated when Aisha was 9 (read: he raped a 9-year-old girl). Aisha narrates that she brought her dolls with her when she moved to his house. He held a number of sex slaves and personally ordered execution of multiple people whose only crime was being Jewish or poets. And this all is recorded in the Qu'ran or in the reliable Hadiths. Yes, he did do some good things, like many other historical figures. Yes, his behavior was not unusual for the time he was living in. But yet, do you think he is a model for every Muslim to follow in all places and times?

 

^IMHO you don't have to dig all that up . Every Religion and Mythology has something good in it and something bad in it. You should take the good out of it and practice it. Let the bad lay in dusty tomes. never to be opened again. Questioning why something happened ages ago and discussing on whether it was moral or not it a waste of time.

 

Well yeah, this not the place to debate on life of the prophet. I personally get a little annoyed when people idolize some historical figure as more often than not their public image is result of careful brand building rather than actual merits - be it Mother Teresa, Jesus, Mo or Winston Churchill.

 

Oh no no. I wasn't trying to call you guys on it. . I'm so sorry if it came out that way.

Discussing about something that old in order to try and get your facts right is ok. But I just find that it is somewhat futile. Especially if it might be somewhat controversial. Again it's alright.

 

I'm known among my family for using phrases and idioms from all over the world lol. . That is one of my problems.

Not to be offensive, but you did mention and I believe so did Euler, that your mother and sisters have chosen to switch religions. Do you think your father would be hurt if you chose to be an atheist or switch religions because you are his son or because you are the only one left in the family following Islam? I'm just trying to understand.

 

While what i'm going to say isn't helpful to you. i just wanted to add or correct you beast on what you've just said about Saudi Arabia, now what am going to say, applies to Jeddah and Mecca. it wont do so to other places. you said a lot of guys experience gay sex as teenagers. well they're not a lot as you said, at least not in the places i mentioned, the only time you experience it, is either rape as in by force, which is the most likely thing. or,you actually choose to be gay and be lucky enough to find someone who thinks the same way and is willing to help, which falls into the rare category. in both cases, you're more likely to be caught and lashed,or,decapitated. the part with women is partially true, but you're allowed to ask for directions or things like that if needed, otherwise yes you would be caught by the religious police, class separation isn't a thing here, there are schools for each one however, as in one for males and one for females.about the sex in the bathroom part, it's untrue for women, because there are actual female moderators now, that check in who goes in and out of the bathrooms. as for males, it's more lenient, as in there are moderators or guards , but, they don't pay as much attention, so they ignore the bathrooms, but, not all the time. as for guys asking for it in bathrooms, that's untrue as well, i mean it happens but rarely, usually, if it happens in the bathrooms, it's rape, as in one of them is forced, be it by a knife,sharp object,just pure strength,as for the underground gay culture, there was one, but, it was raided, as in, lots of be headings,lashes. i'm not sure if there's one now, but i know there was one, and it got raided. sorry, it's not helpful. i just thought i'd say that.

 

Well...,yes, not really proud to admit it, but am born and raised and still living there. and as for classes, no, you get different entire schools for each gender, at least that was what it's like for me, only time you got to mingle was in kindergarten. but you have to remember am talking about jeddah/makkah, things could be different in riyadh , and it's mainly rape, there are ones who desired it but like i said they're a minority or less than a minority, like when i was in middle school, i had plenty of people older and or stronger from highschool try and intentionally force themselves on me but i never stopped fighting them off, keep in mind back then, i had no idea what being gay even meant, and i don't know if the government is aware, but i know the schools are , or at least most of them.as for the article, that i can't tell you if it's true, but what i can tell you, is that the government over these past years, have been intentionally fishing out people who are either gay or follow a different religion, by fishing out i mean engaging them with fake conversations, like you could be gay and chat with someone who you think feels the same way as you do, you end up getting invited to visit, but you end up being ambushed grabbed and killed. even the people who commented on the article you mentioned, it could be them trying to get people to believe that, so they'd make mistakes and get caught. i unfortunately, witnessed a public beheading a few years ago, the person that was be headed was disowned first by his family also in public then be headed, so, yeah. again sorry, it isn't as helpful with your current situation, and hope you do find a solution.

 

Thanks, and i questioned it because, i had the idea that only women and men are only meant to be together engraved or programmed into me, so after trying that one guy i started to question it after a long while, and iv only seen my father when i had to make my ID, after that only saw him a few months ago because he ''asked'' for me, turned out he had blood cancer, was in the hospital, but i didn't care, only visited him once, then when he asked for me again, i refused, and after i refused, 3 days later he died. so yeah, that's what happened.

 

i don't know, am still confused about it, and it's ok, i didn't really feel anything toward my father, i mean my mother cried even tho he wasn't her husband anymore and he had a different family, but i didn't feel anything, and she yelled at me for it, so yeah.

 

What more do you want to know?