General News UK EU Referendum - 23/06/2016

I'm certain nothing will change for any foreigners working here, we're simply not that kind of person.

I think careful wording and consideration on both sides are gonna be crucial to any future relations between the UK & EU. Russia is watching closely it seems.

Thank God we have Ireland on good terms with us.

 

I fully agree. There was little more disappointing than seeing Corbyn so non-committed to the campaign. Either he's lazy, a poor communicator or didn't care enough. All three cases are unacceptable in the man who is supposed to be the alternative PM.

As a result of whichever option it was, he was unable to explain to Brexit's natural constituency (who incidentally, like him, appear to be rather stuck in the 1980s) the benefits of the EU and consequently left the impression of Remain to be one of 'toffs' and London elites. His voice would have been valuable and he miserably failed in articulating Labour's position or showing authority within his party.

This has ended Cameron's political career, but Corbyn must take some responsibility. I happen to think he should fall on the sword and resign, not because he lost, but because he failed to show the leadership necessary to win or to govern.

 

It will be more difficult to do anything with Ireland now that you have left the EU.

 

Actually, we're not out yet. It may seem that way but no formal legal process has been initiated yet.

 

I know, sorry. I meant now that you're probably about to leave. Hopefully not, but probably.

 

Seems there is also a lot of doubt that all the signers are even from the UK. And "hackers" are claiming to have signed more than once, using North Korea as their location.

They will, this can't be undone. Not without damaging democracy anyway. And even if democracy was thrown out, EU officials are already fuming and want it done and over with as soon as possible, relations are damaged.

 

If the 2 constituent countries of the kingdom decide to leave, it would most definitely spell the end of the UK and its reputation as a power. Many politicians have already expressed that the UK would be diminished if either country leaves. The mayor of London has called for unity across the nation however this is not shared by other politicians such as Sturgeon. I'm finding it harder to believe that England and Wales would be able to sustain themselves as this would greatly diminish London's value to the world. The UK is powerful as a four country union and that is fact. London and Edinburgh are the largest financial centres in the whole country and if they separate both of them both cities would be significantly weaker. London will have a hard time assuring the international community that it still is a safe place to do business given the fact that everything else around them is collapsing.

Based on everyone's reaction, it seems that most people didn't anticipate the possibility of the fragmentation of the country. I doubt British politicians would let that happen though... but really, this is the worst that could happen, I gather.

There is a stronger chance for a United Kingdom to endure being out of the EU than a fractured one. At this rate I've already conceded that we are on our own and that we must own up to it. Whether we remain or not, whether the UK is diminished with my country leaving- we are the only people who are accountable for the consequences of our actions.

 

I doubt it will make a difference, but Nicola Sturgeon has raised the possibility of vetoing the UK's exit from the EU through the Scottish Parliament. It sounds like she is proposing a parliamentary vote to refuse legislative consent.

I'm sure it will lead to a lot of legal wrangling, but this might not be over yet.

 

She might have threatened to do so, but it's hardly a veto, because the Scottish Parliament is subordinate to the Parliament of the UK. If push comes to shove, Westminster can repeal devolution and there's precious little Holyrood could do about it because it exists purely by a Westminster statute. Of course, the political consequences of that would unquestionably cause the UK to disintegrate.

Whatever the post-Cameron government looks like and whatever the makeup of the new Parliament might be (I can only presume the fixed elections law will be repealed and a good, old fashioned election sparked by crisis will be called), I doubt the English MPs will be very sympathetic to losing their dignity by caving in to Scotland. The only hope then would be for a reinvigorated Labour Party or a (miraculous and nigh impossible) resurrection of centrist Conservative leaders to win on a pro-EU platform.

That is a very tall hope, I fear.

 

I can't imagine the English being happy with that. Will she manage? Hard to tell, because right now everything is so uncertain...

 

Maybe we should join the United States? :eek: I seem to be going giddy and need to lie down now!

 

Thing is it's a win win for her if she goes this route. If she succeeds in vetoing this then her popularity is only going to shoot up at home and in the remain bits of the UK, if she fails then it's more fuel for independence.

 

If the UK goes miraculously back it will be seen as huge humiliation from the likes of Germany, Eastern European countries, Italy, most of France etc.

It can't happen - their best bet for now is to seek their dreamed union of the Commonwealth with countries like Australia, Canada, India etc and for this I wish them luck.

 

Seems like it really is the end for us. It's more interesting that these issues were not discussed by both sides at all. I mean, I would have to assume that there were analysts that would study the effects of an in/out result and I'm surprised that this concern wasn't raised. It's a simple question really. "What if a country within the UK doesn't want to leave?".

This whole "The British people have spoken" phrase that has been said so many times actually annoys me so much. The British people are composed of the people living in the separate countries of England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. It was only England and Wales who had a majority of leave votes and Scotland and Northern Ireland didn't want to be taken out of the EU. How is this "the British people" when it's obviously divided. The majority of British people are English but they're certainly not the only people in the UK. If that were the case why count scottish or irish votes anyway if they won't mean anything?

This post gives me hope (though I feel like it's the kind of wishful thinking hope)

 

I'm not a fan of Alex Salmond or Nicola Sturgeon.

There's something fishy about them.....

 

Absolutely, seems like a very clever move from her to get what she wants. Of course it will lead to more division between Scotland and the rest of the UK, which could lead to more independence. In fact looking at the political mess in the UK government (on top of the overall decision to leave the EU) is probably enough to convince Scots to go towards independence.

There is a lot of division, fear and uncertainty at the moment and what the public (both leave and remain voters) need is reassurance and guidance. Instead of the government (or even the leave campaigners) presenting an agenda for how they take the country forwards, we have had Cameron resign with no one yet in line to take his place and take the UK towards exiting the EU. By Cameron resigning, he has delayed triggering Article 50 which would start us exiting the EU. Whoever succeeds him will have to do this and face breaking up the UK as a result. We haven't seen or heard from Cameron or Osborne in days. We've had leave campaigners go back on their campaign promises hours after the vote, and instead of Labour providing a stable alternative to the Tory government, they're off in-fighting with some people seeming to use this as an opportunity to challenge Corbyn's leadership. It's still early days and hopefully work will be done to reassure the public, but given the caliber of those leading the leave campaign, I'm yet to be convinced that they actually have a way forward from here. All of this uncertainty will just fuel the calls for Scotland to become independent. We should be pulling together and moving forward together, but I don't know how likely that is at the moment.

I can see this with both of them, which is why I didn't vote for independence first time round. They are more right wing than they claim (they present themselves the way that Scottish people want them to be but they always seem to have another agenda.) However I would say this is true of all our major politicians, Cameron and Osborne definitely have this awful smugness about them, Corbyn isn't particularly good at hiding his true feelings (which in part has led to the calls for his resignation as people could see he wasn't that pro-EU), but Farage and Johnson also present themselves as likeable buffoons to mask their bigoted side and they have a whole other agenda at work. It's the way these leading politicians behave, combined with the impact of the media, which have contributed to the divisions in this country (on both sides of this debate.)

 

To be fair, Nicola Sturgeon suggested to David Cameron that a vote to leave should have the support of all four nations to be binding and he refused to take it up. It was clear from the outset that Scotland would vote to remain, but Cameron chose to roll the dice and gamble that the overall result would be for remain and now it's backfired spectacularly.