I'm typing this from a place of hurt and pain. So, five years ago I started to experiment with guys. I had mixed feelings about it. I got excited so I guess that means I liked it. Eventually I stopped when I commenced a relationship with a girl. Pretty good relationship but then covid hit and realized I can't be with this person 24-7. Also, I found myself looking for sex with a guy. To clarify, it's purely sexual with guys. I don't see myself in any type of relationship with a guy. What I feel inside is to be in a relationship with a girl. The typical romance fun loyalty and sex with a girl. But if that's what I feel why do I tend to look for a guy. Now I realize that behavior appears when i feel alone and depressed. When I'm with a girl it's not an issue. Anyways, my g/f broke up with me bc i opened up about this to her. Now we haven't been together that long but the last time i was with a guy was about a year ago. So i decided to reach out and get some perspective. Thank you for reading this post.
JavyD3.....Hello and a great big LGBTQIA+ welcome to Empty Closets! I can remember the first post that I made on EC. I was desperate for help and I got the help that night that I so needed. I hope that we can help you in the same way that I received help. The most important thing to remember about Empty Closets is that we do care about you! We're very glad that you found us here on EC and hope that we can answer questions, give you support and provide a place to vent (as long as it's not violent!) when that becomes necessary! *****There are 18 different sub-forums here that you can check out and join in the conversations or start your own thread/conversation. When I first joined Empty Closets I was in need of a lot of support and encouragement and I found it here…EC is a safe place. I hope that you'll find good things here too! Folks here will talk to you and share...you don't have to be afraid of asking questions...we're glad to have you! Empty Closets is all about making connections and giving LGBT folks a voice when they otherwise don't have one in their day-to-day lives. In particular you may want to check out the forum that is titled "Sexual Orientation”, there are people there who have dealt with some of the same kind of issues that could be challenging you. Some info on how to navigate EC: When you have made at least 10 posts on various threads you will be able to post messages on a member's Profile Page. Just click on a member's Avatar Picture and then click on "Profile Page" in the dialogue box that pops up. You'll then be on their Profile Page and there will be a box that says: "Write Something" When you have been on EC for a few weeks and have made at least 50 posts on various forums, you can apply for Full Membership. A Full Member can send Private Messages (PM) to other Full Members and share personal contact info. Right now you can only send a PM to a Staff Member as that is always possible. Here is a quote from the Full Membership information forum: *****To be eligible you must be a member of Empty Closets for a minimum of two weeks, and have a minimum of 50 posts. These posts must be across numerous forums (Fun & Games does not contribute to post count), and consistently posted across a minimum of two weeks. You wouldn't be eligible, for example, if you registered, had no activity for two weeks, and then returned to post 50 times on your 14th day of membership. *****Well, as I said, we're very glad you found us! If you have any questions at all, you can always send me a Private Message. .....David
Welcome JavyD3, That’s sad that your girlfriend broke up when you were being open and honest with her. Sometimes the people who say they want openness and truth end up not being able to handle hearing the full story due to their own baggage. Personally, I like it when the person I love is willing to be open and vulnerable. I would not stay with a person who couldn’t accept the whole me. There is a whole continuum of sexual orientation. I used to think I was straight, or straight with a little extra, but about five years ago I settled on bisexual after a few sessions with a therapist. I’ve been married to the woman I love for decades, and we have grown children, but I realized I was noticing guys and wanted to sort that out in counseling. There are so many variations of how people describe themselves these days, whereas back when I was young people said “well you are either gay or straight” as if there weren’t any shades of gray in between. Since I loved women, I then “knew” I was straight - because everybody said gay guys didn’t like women, only men. How foolish as I look back on it. Anyway, I can’t see inside you to say what fits best for you. Hang around here at EC and read different stories and it may help guide you in your quest. If it turns out no particular label fits you, just accept that you like what you like and you don’t need external validation or a pre-boxed identity package to fit. Just be you. Welcome to EC!
Thank you for the reply. I appreciate it. I'm in my late 30's I would like to have a meaningful loving relationship with a girl. Thats what I feel inside. Just don't know or fully understand what to do with sharing this with potential partners. Or how to handle the fact that this is part of my past. I don't fully enjoy sex with a guy like i do with a girl. I experimented some of it was exciting at first. However, it never sat well with me. Again thank you for your time.
Welcome to EC Javy. I'm sorry you lost your girlfriend over this, but this place has lots of friendly and helpful people who can assist you with the "perspective," you're hoping to find/gain. As for the loss of the girlfriend. There is this assumption we make that the mere act of being open and honest will gain us the results we hope for, but life is more complicated than that. So while you didn't get the reaction you were hoping for, it may be that you still gained something good from being open and honest. The most obvious thing I can think of is that you won't find yourself with a wife and mother of your children who isn't sure she can stick around after hearing this news years from now. Or that you are bold and honest enough now, to not be tempted to live out a false existence.
Thank you for your repl Thank you for your reply. I was actually talking to my therapist today. She broke it down in a way that made me feel bettter. Its sort of the same thing you're telling me now. I was bold and honest expecting different results. I know the hurt will go away and I'll be fine. Its just that i truly found my girl. Our connection was so good. We had so much fun just being together. I never had that before bc my life has been a struggle and i often settled with the wrong partners. So this time around I was ready and expected to be with this girl for the long haul. So I'm hurting alot. Again thank you for your words.
Hello, @JavyD3! I'm sorry your girlfriend left you; I'm sure it was a bit of a shock for her and she didn't know how to cope with it, but I know that does little to mitigate your pain regarding the matter. As to the matter itself... If you experience attraction to both men and women, then you're bisexual: even if you find yourself leaning more toward one than the other, it still counts. So if you have been sexually attracted to men, it still qualifies. I think the fact that you see women as relationship goals while you view men as purely physical likely stems from a place of internalized biphobia and/or homophobia. Some people will claim these things are one and the same--they aren't. Internalized biphobia is specifically dealing with having attractions to both and the stigmas surrounding those attractions, whereas internalized homophobia is exclusively dealing with the same-sex attraction aspects. The reason I bring both up is because I'm not sure which one you might be experiencing--but if what I've brought up for either rings true regarding how you feel about yourself, I hope it gives you some clarity--and with that clarity, hopefully the ability to overcome those obstacles.
Hi, First, I'm sorry that your girlfriend took the news so hard and decided to end the relationship. I hope this doesn't discourage you from being honest in the future, because relationships must be built on trust and authenticity, otherwise there really isn't anything there. One of the things that strikes me is your statement "it's purely sexual with guys. I don't see myself in any type of relationship with a guy. What I feel inside is to be in a relationship with a girl. The typical romance fun loyalty and sex with a girl." What I hear you saying is that you are excited, aroused and attracted to and by guys, and less so (at least regarding sexual excitement) toward girls. What I also hear you saying is that you are seeking "the typical romance, fun, loyalty and sex" in a relationship, and you associate that with a relationship with a girl. So my question is, what gets in the way for you about the idea of having a typical romantic, fun, loyal, enjoyable relationship with a guy? Very often, when folks come here with these sorts of issues (and yours is a very common one), when they really start to unpack it, what is uncomfortable for them is the idea of seeing themselves in a relationship with a guy. And usually that has to do with internalized homophobia. For whatever reason, some guys are able to rationalize a sexual relationship with a guy as long as they don't see romance in it; as soon as they think about romance, suddenly something kicks in... and that 'something' is usually homophobia. This is also why some folks will (erroneously) talk about this mythical idea of a discordant separation between romantic and sexual orientation. The research shows pretty clearly, over decades, that there's basically no basis for this. And usually when that shows up, it is rooted in either homophobia or denial. I want to be clear: I'm not saying you are gay, and I'm not saying that what you are describing is not accurate for what you are feeling. You're the only one who can know that. But what does happen, very often, is that when guys start to figure out they aren't straight, it is the sexual arousal piece that shows up first, because it is largely the most undeniable. When we process any loss (in this case, loss of identity as straight), there are stages we go through: denial-anger-bargaining-depression-acceptance. And very often, for guys in the process of coming to terms with a different sexual orientation, there is, early on, a denial of any desire for the "soft" side of relationship desire (what you describe above) toward men. This can also show up as 'bargaining', in the sense of "Well, OK, I like sex with guys, but as long as I'm still attached to the romantic side and that's with women, then I can still end up with a woman." Both of these are pretty common for people in the early stages of coming to terms with being other-than-straight. So again, I am not saying that this is the case for you, only that this is a possible (and, at least in our experience here at EC, a likely) explanation for why you feel the way you do. What do you do with the above? Maybe think about it. Explore whether your perspective is objectively accurate, or if there's a part of you that is afraid of embracing what it would be like to genuinely feel romance for a guy, and you are thus blocking it out. Maybe that's the case, maybe it's not. But in any case, it won't do any harm to think about and explore it. It certainly won't change your sexual orientation to do so... just help you get clarity on where you are. And above all, the best thing you can do is talk about what you're feeling... which is exactly what you are doing here. I encourage you to keep up the process. I hope the above is helpful!
JavyD3 welcome to EC. You have landed on the right site. There’s so much help here for you and so many folks who have ‘been there’. I’m thinking it would really be helpful to ponder how threatening your news to your girlfriend was. Sounds like she went into protective mode, which is understandable. I know when I told my wife she reacted with total shock. I spent almost a year in therapy before I could tell her. Thought it would be okay. It wasn’t. She freaked. We’ve settled into a place that might be called denial on her part and refuses to discuss it (too threatening). I don’t think there are many partners around who would be okay with the changes we thrown at that them. I know it will work out - one way or the other. I however am no longer hiding my real self from her and I know for me I have to live that. You will find your answers here.
I don’t think that I have biphobia or homophobia. However, I’m ignorant to all these labels. Nonetheless, I try to find the root cause of why I’m in this position with my sexuality. The fact that I was harassed and raped as a kid. At only 5 some older kid was harassing me. At the age my sexuality was awaken. Only fours years later I was actually raped. Ever since then , my whole life has been so unstable. I fell into self confidence issues low self esteem and that led to alcoholism. Eventually In my early thirties myself experimenting with guys. In my twenties, I didn’t feel the need to do any of that. it’s not feeling that grew naturally in me. I’m a romantic guy that loves the idea of a traditional family life. But when it comes to sex starting in my thirties. I notice that when I’m depressed like I am now I will download good ole ###### on my phone. I really haven’t had sex a lot with guys but the times that I have afterwards I’m like well I still prefer sex with a woman. This is not who I am. And that’s truly how I feel. i don’t see my self holding handing, writing poems, dedicating songs to a guy. Not bc of any phobias bc it’s not what I feel in my heart or mind. Further more, when I was with my girlfriend I don’t feel the need or urge for a guy. So it’s all just so much at this point. I’m almost 40 and I’m torn wondering why …. Why did life grant me this card.
Appreciate your response. It’s all very informative and a hard pill to swallow. As far as romance with a guy I just don’t see that for me. I’ve explored, I’ve tried it. I’m very opened minded. I decided to explore bc I couldn’t handle it anymore. For instance, I’ve cuddled with a guy before bc he asked me to do so. I did it and I can tell you that it didn’t feel right. I didn’t enjoy it like I do with a girl. I find myself looking for a guy when I’m not feeling well or simply bc hooking up with a guy is much easier. Now I’m not out here just hooking up I’m just speaking my truth. My other variable to all this is that I tend to look for the real feminine looking guy. Or even trans. So doesn’t that mean anything? But in the End, what i feel in my heart is a relationship a family with a woman.
So what type of relationship do you have. Do you have the need to be with guys even though you’re with your wife?
Carl Jung said, years ago, "The thing about the unconscious is... it's unconscious." In other words, what is going on in our unconscious is not directly accessible to our conscious mind. So, at least based on the experience of working with many others here over the years, my guess would be that what's going on is, your unconscious knows you like guys, and your conscious is filtering that desire with all sorts of justifications, and some of that ends up as "well, they have to be feminine, or they have to be trans, so that I can somehow rationalize that there's still a strong female attraction there." Of course, my opinion and $4 will buy you coffee at Starbucks, so don't take anything I'm saying as gospel. But what we typically find is that over time, as people become more accepting of themselves, and the idea they may have same-sex attraction, that self-acceptance opens the door to more willingness to think about romantic things with guys, or having a real relationship with a guy, or having a life with a guy. A good number of folks have said that once they started to really accept it, it was like the doors to same-sex attraction sort of blew off, and the attraction to opposite sex started to fade away. This was disconcerting to some, but eventually, everyone just sort of acknowledged it because, well... it isn't something one can change. Again, I am not saying that any of the above definitely applies to you. It has applied to many others in a similar circumstance to you, so it may or may not be the same for you over time. All I'm suggesting is, if you can be curious and try to stay out of judgment... and avoid trying to analyze things, but just experience them... I think eventually, the answer, whatever it is, will become more clear as you allow whatever it is to emerge.
This was the case with me when I came here. Now that I have accepted myself, I can see the deceptions but they seemed 'real' when I was in denial. Once I began to accept myself, or rather than make excuses just look at the evidence and just ask if I might be gay the "I look at women", "Women are beautiful", "I don't see guys I am attracted to" and all the other excuses began to fade away. It was scary to feel like I was losing my attraction to women but in reality I never had it, I was letting go of the idea that I could be sexually aroused by a woman. It was very hard for me to accept too, and I was scared. I thought and still think of myself as open minded but I realized how much that fear was causing me to hold on to the idea that I was straight. I also couldn't imagine myself with a guy romantically - but what I realized is I was never letting myself do that. It may sound hard to believe now, but once I really accepted myself it was a huge relieve and I actually started to feel great about it.
Only you can decide, but as @Chip says a lot of people have come here and posted similar thoughts in the process of realizing or accepting being gay. I had these same thoughts: Well I might have gay sexual fantasies but I don't like it after so I am not gay, I am not comfortable with it so I am not gay, I don't like it after so I am not gay. Some things to think about: Imagine you were in a city where no one knew you and it was LGBTQ friendly and you saw a cute guy smiling at you. You say you're not comfortable with being gay. Is it you're not comfortable with it or you're not comfortable with what people would think? What you fantasize about when you're alone? In the past when you have sex with a girlfriend did you ever have to think about a guy? Have you ever tried to just look in the mirror and say "I am gay"? If it's not true it won't harm to you to try it once.
I am going to leave you with one more thought experiment. What if, instead of trying to get rid of or wish you didn't have sexual desires for men, instead you got rid of the guilt and shame? What would that feel like? Try to accept yourself even for a day, an hour, just say "I am going to try on" living with acceptance about my feelings. You don't even have to give yourself a label, but just imagine if you felt as good about your desires to be intimate with men as you do about women.
