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Should I offer to pay?

Discussion in 'Coming Out Advice' started by SecretColor, Dec 8, 2011.

  1. SecretColor

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    Ok guys, many of you know about non-EC Ben- those who don't can read my blog. Anyway, we're having coffee Saturday afternoon, which is great since we're spending time together (!), but I've been thinking: I want to offer to pay, just because our friendship is at that point even if that's all there is. But how do I say it without coming off as pushy?


    Thanks in advance,
    Twisty
     
  2. J Snow

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    I mean, when its time to pay I would just say "I can get this if you don't mind." My speculation is he'll probably at least offer to pay his part, at which point I would feel free to say something like "I don't mind... really." If he still insists on paying for himself, I would just let him rather than push it past two offers.

    Have you considered the possibility he might want to pay for you? >.< If that's the case I would just let him, in fact I think it would be very smart if you are interested in him. Most people think that doing something nice for someone would make them like you more (and that's true obviously) but in fact studies show that having them do something nice for you is actually far more effecting in getting them to like you. I could go into the psychological reasons as to why that is, but I doubt that's something you are interested in >.<

    I'm not saying you should by any means encourage him to pay for you. I'm just saying... if he does offer it would probably go further to be polite, say something like "You don't have to do that," but go with it and just be very thankful.

    I hope that advice helps =P
     
  3. SecretColor

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    Well, I actually am interested in the psychological reasons, but I doubt many people on EC are :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes: So just PM them to me if you can, pretty please. And thanks for the advice!
     
  4. J Snow

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    I'll just try to explain it here. Here is at least the theory as to why this happens.

    So, let me try to explain it with this example:

    Person A gives a piece of gum to Person B. Now, let's go through why each individual would like the other person more as a result of this kind action from person A.

    Person B: This one's obvious. The other person gave him something at no cost. It was a nice gesture, so he's going to appreciate it.

    Person A: A's got a lot more complex thought processes going on in his brain right now. He gave something away. He didn't trade it, or give it away with the prospect of future compensation. He just gave away something he had. So he starts to ask himself why he did that. So he has to justify why he would do something like that.

    As a result, rather than make the person feel stupid for giving up his piece of gum, the brain starts searching for reasons why it performed an action that doesn't makes logical sense. The conclusion it will come to is that he must really genuinely like Person B. So the brain will automatically begin to think highly of Person B, as a sort of defense mechanism to justify one's own actions.

    At least that's the explanation I was given in my Social Psychology class last year. I believe our professor said something akin to, "Want someone to like you? Bum a smoke off of them." lol

    Hope that was helpful >.<
     
  5. SecretColor

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    It was :slight_smile: The best part is, I want to pay because it was my idea for us to catch up in the first place; yeah, I'm crazy about him, but that's not the only reason :wink:
     
  6. Ianthe

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    Another reason is that doing things for others makes you feel good about yourself, and then you associate feeling good about yourself with that person.

    And, when you are given something and you don't give anything in return, you might feel a little bad, or like it obligates you in some way and puts the other person in a position of more power. Whereas, when someone asks you for something and you can give it to them, it has the opposite effect of making you feel stronger and more competent, of having more power or social standing--if you are in a position to help someone else, that means you have some strength or ability or means that they do not. It also makes you feel like they have reason to like you and think well of you, which makes you feel more confident and better about yourself in relation to them, so that social anxieties are eased and you have a more positive feeling when you think of them. If you feel like the other person is always the one who is able to help or give, it might actually increase your anxieties, and then you would associate negative feelings with that person.

    In our culture, masculinity and femininity are associated with giving and receiving different kinds of things. Paying for dates in associated with masculinity. You can offer to pay, but be sensitive to whether it makes him uncomfortable--don't insist if he seems to feel weird about it. If he offers to pay, you can know that in addition to all the other reasons he'll feel good about it, it will also make him feel more masculine. If he's the sort of person that feels sexier when he feels more masculine, this is to your distinct advantage. It would be good for you if he associates you with feeling sexier.

    Women are more trained to think this was in our culture. Girls are culturally taught to understand that asking someone to help you with something makes that person feel good, and makes them like you. (Will you carry my books? I'm having car trouble, can you help? You're so good at math, can you come over and help me with my algebra? etc.) Most of the negative feelings from having someone else do things for you are eliminated when you don't actually need whatever it is they're doing, and you understand that the purpose of having them do it is to make them feel good. (Girls do NOT need boys to carry their books for them, and never did! And really, everyone knows it!)

    Anyway, whether you pay for your date or not, maybe you could think about what he is good at that you could ask him to help you with.

    Okay, so I just spent way too long unsuccessfully searching YouTube for the scene from Meet Me In St. Louis where Esther (completely unnecessarily) asks John Truett to help her turn out the lights. But that's what I'm talking about.
     
  7. insidehappy

    insidehappy Guest

    i have not read the other posts and blogs about this but here what i know regarding men and paying for them.

    1. if someone is direct about paying for their own stuff when the bill comes, let them pay.
    2. if YOU invite someone out and your dating them and they know you're dating them and its' not one of these (i'm not sure if he is gay situations). you can offer to pay. if he says no i have my own, offer again, if he says ok, then pay. if he say, no trust me i have my own, then let him pay.

    here is the pschological crap that comes with paying for men.
    1. men traditionally paid for women's dinner, food on dates during the ole skook heterosexual dating courting process.
    2. if u try and pay for a guy he may think you are flirting with him and this may make him uncomfortable.
    3. if you try adn pay for a gauy and he knows you are gay, he may think you want to "hit dat" after you pay for him or that you're expecting something.
    4. if you pay for a guy, he may think you are trying to exert yourself as the dominate one....basically you are the one that wants to "hit dat" and make him the bottom...the weaker sex....the passive....
    5. prideful self sustaining capable men of their own means do not need anotehr man to pay for them and it can be taken as an insult. of course there are people that have nothing going for theiselves and like to get free meals will gladly accept free meals or whatever else you want to give them for free. this is not to imply that if you accept a free meal, you're a loser. but most men want to be seen as the hunter, the provider and self dependnet so they may not accept anotehr man paying for them.

    bottom line, ask them out. when the bill comes, take it and if they person says "what are you doing" just say "hey i asked you to hang out so i'll pay for it and you can get me a drink next time we hang out." if they say "ok" then end of story. if they say "no i got it", then say no, i asked you to hang so i have it this time. if they still say, "no i have it let me pay for my own, " then say ok, no problem but you still owe me that free drink "laugh laugh wink wink".
     
  8. SecretColor

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    Well to answer your question, he's gay. I'm not sure how HE feels about someone paying for him because I never asked, but he told me about how he'd tried to get guys to like him by giving them gifts and such.
     
  9. insidehappy

    insidehappy Guest

    ok, so look., if you wanna pay, pay. if you dont, dont. you asked him out so you at least are obligated to ask. then let him make up his mind what he wants to do. problem solved.
     
  10. Hidinginalabama

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    If you say you want to pay I wouldnt think you are being pushy. You are just being nice and all.
     
  11. SecretColor

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    Thanks for all the advice guys. Well, we're having coffee tomorrow; here's to wishing it goes well, very well!