Is He Gay?

NoClue:

A degree in criminology? Wow! I was kinda thinking you did something along the lines of school teacher or something. Now it sounds more like CSI: NEW YORK. Particularly since you said criminology and not criminal justice. Which, around here anyways, if you're on track to be a state patrol or police occifer, you'd go for a two-year degree in criminal justice. So instead of NoClue, should I start calling you Fox Mulder? Or just Fox? I'm totally picturing a half-Asian David Duchovny right now.

Anyhow,
I highly doubt you fit the sociapath description as well. If you did, you'd have no trouble telling Corey how you felt, the only problem then would be that you wouldn't really mean it or care what he thought.

No, if we're going to play amateur psychiatrist here lets call it like we see it:

1) You have some trust issues, people have let you down in the past and now you've closed yourself off to the point where you've let your fears get the better of you. You refuse to let yourself become emotionally vulnerable to anyone and that keeps you from becoming emotionally invested in anyone. In the past, this has worked so well for you, because the people you shut out weren't real, true friends to begin with. But now, Corey feels different to you somehow, because you've found something real in him. Something you might not've even felt with previous boyfriends. REAL LOVE. (and I'm not saying Corey might be gay or this is romantic love)

2) Then there's whatever you call it that you got going on with CG. What do we amateur psychiatrists like to say? That you are "projecting"? Yes, thats a good way of putting it. Its true that CG feels some bad vibes from you from time to time and its true that this make her uncomfortable and uneasy at times. But I feel like you have completely blown this out of proportion...

Originally posted by NoClue

I promise you CG is NOT doing this to you. Not kinda, no maybe, not even a little bit. Not in any way whatsoever, no possibility. I have absolutely NO DOUBT IN MY MIND that CG is NOT doing this to you. YOU ARE IMAGINING THIS!
You feel this as a result of your own mechanisms of fear and self-doubt. Thats it. (well AND because you're the one trying to sabotage CG and so its natural to feel like she's trying to do it back to you)

Just like if you're a cop and you've pulled someone over who's dangerous and has warrants. Your job is to subdue the suspect and until they are on the ground in handcuffs - you put yourself in a heightened state of reaction and response until the job is done. Threat Response Survival Mode.

So yeah, you see CG as a threat so in a roundabout way, you are in relationship SURVIVAL MODE, trying to think a few moves ahead and imagining what her next moves will be. Quit it! She isn't trying to outmaneuver you, she's just trying to get along and have fun with one of her boyfriend's friends. Stop making it harder on her by going into threat response.
:::helicopter blades whirring::
Delta echo charlie four-niner, this is NoClue to base, we have a situation in sector five. Go to threat response yellow, we've got CG having drinks with us at the bar tonight, over.

Originally Posted by NoClue:

I would probably stop doing this NoClue. If its really this easy for to you to drop someone as a friend then it probably means you're not getting that emotionally invested with them in the first place. If you don't put yourself out there and get your heart stomped every now and then - then you aren't really living. Its possible to be successful by every measure and still live a life of fear and of no substance. After all, what is a degree, a good job, a house, a car, a 70" LED Smart TV, your own *mint" condition twilight zone pinball game, but a few possessions and accomplishments? - - - Family, friends, good friends, close friends and someone special (and throw in a border collie for good measure)- the true commodities of a rich, successful life.

Originally Posted by NoClue:

Mmmkay so to put this into perspective if you were a straight guy and Corey was a woman, the conversation you had with him would've went something like this:
NC: Honey? Are you mad?
C: No.
::silence:::
NC: Honey? Whats wrong? Are you still mad at me?
C: I said no.
:::Corey goes into kitchen and starts banging pots and pans around getting dinner ready VERY LOUDLY:::
NC: Honey? You're acting like you're still mad at me. If you're still mad, why don't you tell me whats wrong so we can talk about it?
C: You son of a bitch! If you don't know whats wrong, then I'm not going to tell you, you Bastard! Don't touch me or I'll cut off your nuts and feed them to the dog!

Well see, this is why I'm glad I'm gay because for the most part this doesn't happen between two guys as often. But in your case, yes, its not enough to say your sorry, you have to know WHY you're sorry and make it up to him accordingly. (Or just come clean and say you have feelings for him and its been messing you up so bad lately that it's been difficult for you to cope, that'd probably work as an acceptable excuse)

Really? Now, com'n NoClue, I think you really do have some clue here. I mean considering how hung up you were on CG not putting your birthday first when she talked to you. Then Corey goes and plans out a birthday event for you and you blow him off? Now of course nobody expects these things out of anybody. But damn, enjoy it while you can. Out my last ten birthdays, I've spent half of them taking the day off work, treating myself to dinner and movie - ALONE. I have plenty of good friends and several really good friends, but if not for facebook reminding them its my birthday they'd have never even known it happened. If someone cares enough about you to take the trouble to plan a special birthday for you, then you bail on them, I think you know just how bad it would hurt them.

So yeah, I guess I do feel like in a way you put some stuff on Corey that he didn't deserve. Corey isn't feeling all these conflicted, frustrated, maddening feelings that you are. Corey might at some point and at times suspect that you like him, but he doesn't realize the extent of the obsession or the pain that's engulfed you. Corey only knows that you're his good friend and you guys get along really well. He loves you and likes to spend time with you. He wanted have fun and do something special for his good friend on his birthday. Now he's trying to understand why you did what you did. He feels like you don't care about him at all. He knows how much he likes you and up until now, you given him every indication that you've felt the same way about him. He doesn't understand.

For the other readers...This is also why I don't usually mess with threads like these because I hate to see the aftermath for the poor straight guy we leave in the dirt once we're all through with him.
And by that I mean we've all read that thread type a million times, it's probably all happened to us at least once in real life and for that matter it's the quintessential gay love story: "I fell in love with my straight best friend". Then we go and have our inconsiderate, one-sided unrequited love affair with our supposed "best friend", thinking only of how bad it hurts us, the gays; if only he's just cross that great divide and love me.

Then what makes me cringe will sometimes happen, which is the minute the gay guy realizes his straight friend is never gonna come around and play winky stinks with him, then he drops his straight friend like a hot potato and moves on, sometimes not even being friends with him at all. But what about that poor, sweet, loving, affectionate straight guy he left behind? Straight guy honestly loved and cared for his gay friend, every affectionate gesture, every kind thing he did, he really meant it for his gay friend...he just wasn't wired to go all the way and now he's out a friend. Don't hate the playa, hate the game, right? Awww, bullshit!

Nah, I don't like to see that. I think it's shitty when we gay guys do that to people we have the nerve to refer to as our best friends. Too chicken shit to just come out and tell someone how we feel and at the same time, living out some perfect fantasy using our "best friend" as a pretend boyfriend. It's wrong, I tell ya. ::whispers:: wrong!

So yeah, I really hate to see the aftermath when gay friend loses interest completely and goes and finds another friend. I think its great if we gay guys have male best friends. I'm lucky to have several good and a couple best friends I've known over half my life. But I definitely think that since we're gay, we need to scrutinize the situation carefully and ask ourselves just how interesting we find that person once all sexual feeling is removed.

And for NoClue, as I've wrote here before, I don't usually dive into threads like this, but I dunno, yours had this little extra something I just couldn't put my finger on. I can't say for sure, something more unique here than usual, I don't know. But here I am, and here we are. And over there we have Corey, CG and Amy.

Gah! So anyhow I only meant for this to be a short "hey whats up" kind of post and its already blathered on long enough. I'm sorry its still harsher than usual NoClue, but I felt like you had some additional issues which needed addressed.

So to conclude,
if you are still wondering how it was such a huge deal to Corey about your birthday, and how he's hurt by it. I'll spell it out by reminding you of the prime difference between men and women (and on this site, the masculine and the feminine spirit sometimes). Women say and men do. Feminine spirits express how they feel through words and masculine spirits demonstrate how they feel through actions.

With that in mind, I'm sure you can imagine exactly what it would feel like if you expressed to Corey that you loved him and in reply he yawned and walked away. Well, if you can imagine that, then you can imagine how Corey felt when he demonstrated his affections for you by performing the action of planning a birthday party...and you couldn't be bothered.

gah, I can't end this post on that sad a note...
:::hands NoClue a small individually wrapped butterscotch candy::::

ROCK ON
SCANNER

 

this a million times. Not saying it applies to NoClue because I'm also pretty certain that given the length of his friendship, closing in on two decades at this point, that it should be unshakable... That Corey would accept you regardless of anything you ever said.

 

NoClue:

Okay I don't want to beat a dead horse here but I'm a bit confused here because on the one hand you say that you're sorry and remorseful and on the other you say that you still don't get it why he was so upset.

So at the risk of overstating the matter, I will try, one more time to put it out there:
You are in love with Corey for pretend, its like a dream.
You have an unrequited fantasy love for him that is layered over your true friendship with him.
Corey on the other hand, loves you for real. You are his good friend. People vibe on that because you both get along so well, like an old married couple.

Because of that, if you had kicked Corey in the nuts, then when he leaned over in pain, you punched him right in the face, then knocked him over, then stole $20 bucks out of his wallet and pointed and laughed at him the entire time and told him he was pathetic.
That...
THAT!!....
would've hurt him far less than what you actually did to him.

He wanted you to WANT to share your birthday with him...and take pictures ..put them up on facebook..so everyone could see what a good time you both had...and later he tell all his other friends what a good time you both had.
In HIS MIND, he thought that you and him were close friends. But now thats changed, that warm feeling you get when you think of someone and you are fond of them, and you feel happy just thinking of them and spending time with them. He now believes that while he has that feeling for you...that you don't share that feeling for him at all. He thinks you don't care.

Hence why he said, "thats why I still hate you"
You playing with his glass triggered a warm memory of you and him spending time together at some point ...and he was happy for a moment and then it mixed with that sadness ...and he felt sad again. Because of you. Which of course doesn't mean he really hates you, he's just still very hurt by what you did to him.

Just like when he says, yeah I'm really hurt, BUT I'LL GET OVER IT.
Everyone says that when something terrible happens and you have to force yourself to move on.
My dog died, but I'll get over it.
My grandma died, but I'll get over it.
I got fired from my job today, but I'll get over it.
My best friend didn't bother to show up for his birthday party, acted like he didn't care anything about me and didn't even apologize for it, but I'll get over it.
See the trend?

And bless you NoClue, in the nicest possible way ...this is kind of why that one guy called you a sociopath...because its like you cannot recognize that he really cares for you. Its like you got blinders on and you can't believe its possible that Corey feels for you and you can't allow yourself to feel it back for him. Which like I said in the previous post is probably due to trust issues. You've been burned before a lot in the past to the point where maybe you don't believe anyone cares. You don't believe it's possible that Corey loves you, but he does. I can definitely relate to that, I've had my own bouts with trust. But Corey is something different altogether. Definitely worth fighting to hang on to.

You REALLY DO need to explain yourself to him why you didn't make it to your birthday party or make it up to him.

WHICH ----if you ask me ...is also your best golden opportunity to tell him how you really feel for him.

I mean if you told him:
Hey man, I just want you to know,
I didn't go the birthday thing because I didn't care,
its because I care about you too much,
and I've been really hung up on that lately.
I'm trying to focus on finding someone else so that the lines no longer blur
on my feelings for you and I can put it out of my mind and move forward.
I don't want to hurt you or CG. I'm sorry if that really freaks you out.

If you said something along those lines....now is the best possible time...
you'd practically be sneaking it in there because I guarantee at this point,
he'll be so relieved that you really DO care for him. The fact that you maybe
care too much will simply be a side issue. He'll be relieved and happy to hear it.

(And of course, if I'm wrong about him and he really is as gay as you want him to be and he finally takes you by the hand, looks in your eyes and says, "I've waited forever to hear you say that, I'm gonna take you out back and show what 'taking like a man' really means" ...well then ...MORES BETTER RIGHT?)

Anyhow,
again, not trying to beat a dead horse here. I get it that you are sorry and you want to make things better. I just think its important that you precisely understand the WHY here and have a good long cry about it. It will help you out later. I don't plan to mention this again though unless you bring it up and have something specific you'd like to discuss.

ROCK ON
SCANNER

 

NoClue,

Where is the next exciting installment? Yeah I'm a bit worried, too much has happened lately for you to be silent for this long. How did his birthday go? How are you doing?

I know my last post was fairly blunt, but I'm hoping it will be a place for you to start building a foundation for the idea that you're going make up your mind to open up to him and accept whatever he has to say once and for all. Him being your good friend, once he knows the truth, he'll be the best person who can help you through this, whatever the outcome.

Originally posted by NoClue:

It really sounds here like he already knows how you feel about him. But him being your friend, he knows you well enough to give you the time you need to come to terms with it and talk about it when YOU'RE READY. From your posts, we can all see he really does care about you very much. Whether or not he's really capable of having a romantic relationship with you, he WILL treat you with respect and compassion. You really mean a lot to him and I feel like he wants you to trust him with your feelings and the REAL you..all the way.

Trying to look at it logically. Yeah, its scary to bear your feelings and make yourself emotionally vulnerable. Its possible you can get hurt from it, but look at the months and years of pain you've put yourself (and him) through trying to protect yourself. You can end that and finally find some peace.

Anyhow,
please let us know how you're doing. I hope things have been going well and you've been enjoying a great Thanksgiving/Black Friday long weekend.

ROCK ON
SCANNER

 

Scanner is right, Corey really cares for you. You guys are best friends. Best friends don't fall from the sky. You're lucky to have a guy like Corey.

 

Ok now it's been a really long time... I hope nothing bad happened. Give us some news!

 

Yes, we're worried. What's happened?

 

I guess a lot happened, and maybe there's still something going on.

Hoping for the best NoClue. Hang in there

 

Now I know things can't be all that bad that you can't give us an update NoClue....I just had someone call me at my job and threaten to kill me...had to call the cops ...and that was only two weeks after we had a bomb scare where the bomb squad told us "it was a pretty good fake" with all the wires, batteries and clay and timer it had it seemed like whoever did it knew how to make a real one...so unless things are that crazy in your neck of the woods. ..SHOW ME THE UPDATE!

Take care
ROCK ON
SCANNER

 

NoClue, I miss your posts! What happened?

 

Noclue,
Lol. ...interesting life...no...more like a mundane life with brief spurts of bizarre and crazy.

So first off...how did his birthday go? Did you guys hang out for it? What did youget him?

Sean sounds cool. I like that name. Some people call me that only they spell it differently. Too bad its not his real name .

I think its good you and Sean are hanging out to. Keep social, have other friends and even making new ones. That's all good. Now, I could go bitchy scanner here...and suggest you might be using Sean a little bit to make Corey jealous. I could also point out how this is a perfect example of what happens when you're stuck not able to move on because you didn't lay it out there to Corey. How everything is still unresolved.

But I'll stop there. Yeah I can respect you're still not ready. It is what it is. If you're happy with the way things are now then why screw it up. Would I play it that way now if I were in your situation? No. But it took me a lot of years to get to that point. Corey already has a clue how you feel about him. When the time is right you'll tell him.

I think that why we all get on here every week and enjoy hearing you recount your happenings with him over the previous week and when you miss a week, we miss hearing about it. I think we'd all like someone in our life who is as special and profound to us as Corey is to you. We really do only get a shot at someone like that maybe once in a lifetime....and for them to be sexually compatible with us and become a soul mate...well that's a third act worth waiting for.

That's why so many of the best stories end with the second most utilized literary device:
"And they lived happily ever after...."

Good luck and many positive vibes for the job you're seeking! Hope you get it!

Rock On Scanner

 

I'm really happy that you've decided to undertake this new approach and that you've used the upcoming new year as a way of airing out the old and refreshing your perspective on things... I was always worried that this would drag on for even further, and that one day, with Corey and CG becoming increasingly more serious in their commitments, you would be left on the sidelines forever waiting for something that would most likely never happen.

At the same time however, I feel as if there should be a less dramatic way of dealing with your residual feelings for Corey. I agree with Scanner that, with this way of doing things, no conclusiveness of feelings could ever be offered to you. I feel as though less damage would be done if you had just admitted to Corey your feelings and then asked for some time apart so that your feelings would have a chance to settle and maybe fade away. I can tell that deep down you must feel incredibly hurt for you to go to such lengths of pushing him away. The only problem is, with no communication, on Corey's end, he may see it as you simply losing interest in him- as you replacing him with Sean.... We both know that is not the case- everyone here understands that you are doing this for yourself and so that you can one day have a healthy relationship with someone special without constantly comparing them to the benchmark that has become Corey...

I fear that one day, you may look back upon your friendship with Corey, and you will try to reach out to him- but the lack of communication between you two, the unresolved feelings and the lack of conclusiveness will irrevocably hinder the friendship from having the same intimacy as it once had. That there has been too much hurt on both sides for it to resume as they were. Of course, this may simply be my own pessimism with things, and I am sure that your friendship is such that nothing could ever come between the two of you...

Once again, great read, happy to hear your new resolution of moving on and finding romance once again, and wishing you the best of luck for the next year to come. I guess just be weary of falling for Sean unintentionally if he really does end up being straight like Corey...

 

NoClue, I've been wondering, do you think that you and Corey will have a serious talk about each other's feelings? Do you think he's happy more with you or CG? Sean seems like a nice guy. I'm actually shipping you guys.

 

All the best in 2015 to everyone reading this thread.Noclue is their a possible update soon and Sean sounds very interesting,please let us know,thanks!

 

I wonder what happenned

 

Can we have an update please?