General News A plot twist in the Ferguson police case...

(*hug*)

 

Yes Aussie, lack of respect. It goes both ways. And in this case it would appear that both parties failed.

If he hadn't been breaking a very minor law, this interaction wouldn't have happened. Hence the lack of respect in regards to the law.

 

Jaywalking is morally equal to shooting someone?

 

Absolutely not and I never implied that. That's just where this scenario started.

 

I find my self in agreement with Aussie, and share (what I assume) is his utter lack of disbelief. The direct insinuation here is that disrespect and committing a minor offense such as jaywalking makes murder acceptable.

I mean, hell, are we really going to stand here and say: "Hey, if Eric Gardner in New York hadn't been selling loose cigarettes on the street, then he wouldn't have been strangled to death by the police! That will teach people who sell loose cigarettes!"

It's absurd. What does a cop have to do to earn your disapproval? The bar has been set so absurdly low that there are virtually no standards. Any violent action against a citizen becomes acceptable.

I just can't believe it.

 

I never once said that his minor offense is justfication for him ending up shot. I don't appreciate you putting words in my mouth. I mearley said that it was the cause of an interaction that clearly spiraled out of control.

With that dude in New York. The video clearly shows the officers performing a banned manoeuvre which resulted in a very unfortunate death. Don't think there is much wiggle room there. The officers were clearly in the wrong.

 

Words aren't being put in your mouth; you're assigning mutual blame to the situation with no consideration for the fact that the officer has a duty of care and the responsibility not to act purely for his own interests. It's not a mutual fault; police must behave in a different way from the general public, and he went far below what the general public are doing.

You're implying that disrespecting the law is justification, or you're just not interacting with the discussion at all. But I'll give you the credit you know what's being talked about, and that's something which can't be assigned as an issue of mutual disrespect. You can scream and hit and otherwise harm the police, but unless the policeman is certain to die or be extremely harmed by your actions, the police should not even consider shooting you.

 

Exactly. I really have nothing to add, and will just say that I agree with this completely.

 

There was another shooting and video was taken the cops there are trigger happy and there's something called a TASER.

 

Taser is not always effective, especially against larger people. Tasers are also not always non-lethal.

 

A Taser is actually mostly effective against those with a lot of muscle^

 

unless clothing blocks electrical contact, or time did not permit using a taser, or if the officer did not even have a taser on him...

A taser allows only 1 shot, it took six bullets to stop the attack, and when Brown finally collapsed he was only 3 feet from the Officer, after having charged from 35 ft.

 

:bang: they couldn't possibly be referencing the other black kids who have been shot by cops recently.

Who knows it probably was self defense. fine! But we cant be surprised by the slight irritation in the black community.

tHIS child was shot 6 times..! :dry: because that was necessary.

 

They're more non-lethal than a gunshot to the head, let's just say that.

Either way, I'm pretty sure he didn't have a taser on him, or at least the gun already came into play because it was reached for. That I'm not sure of.

 

Perhaps I'm choosing the wrong words to express my opinions.

I am saying that flouting the law is justification for the officer to initiate contact. What follows, according to Aldrik's chain of events, is mutual disrespect. After that, the whole situation goes sideways when the officer is physically assaulted. This assault resulted in a fractured orbital socket for the officer. This, to me, seems like extreme harm. The potential life altering damage that could be inflicted with just one more blow, is enough to alarm anyone and raise hackles. It's not a stubbed toe or broken finger we're talking about here. After this is a very grey area since all we have is verbal accounts. If he was indeed charging the officer, then by all means stop him. If he was truly surrendering, he shouldn't have been shot. Without video, we will never know the full truth.

 

One could of had a gun and the other had a TASER.. And I can see why Commonwealth countries don't have their patrol cops armed like they are in america...

 

On the heels of this incident, there was a story in the paper this morning that was worth sharing. I'm staying with some family in Avon Park, Florida right now, which is located in Highlands County. The local paper reported that this week, the Highlands County Sheriff's Office purchased a tank through the military surplus program for $2,000 as well as 55 assault weapons. For the same price as a 1995 Mercury Villager minivan at the local dealership, the Highlands County Sheriff's Office bought a tank. This is an area filled with almost nothing but old people. It's time to end that program for good.

 

I never thought I would agree with you on anything. But here I stand, humble with agreement. :smilewave

Unless the government knows that they are going to face something other than normal citizens, this stuff is overkill.

Send it to the recycling plants to make something beneficial to society. Just don't leave it in a conflict zone for the nutbags to use.

 

Most people don't know what being a cop is like. Nor do they understand what it's like to carry a gun and be able to defend yourself with lethal force. Nor can they relate to it.

Personally, I think the whole situation is a disaster. A man who robbed a store, managed to break part of the officers face, and allegedly charge him down... That's lethal force in many cases. If I was going to lose consciousness in a violent situation, I'd draw and fire too (I carry, but of course I wouldn't put myself in that situation, ever).

The big problem here is the lack of information released. I fully understand protecting the officer, but the lack of transparency from the police station was a PR nightmare. This could have been much easier to contain if they had been more transparent. From what I have seen of the autopsy reports, the shots match the defense situation described.

I'd also like to know how many shots in total were fired, I know that 6 hit, but I personally know soldiers who served in Iraq/Afghanistan that had shot people more than 15 times before they went down. So, as someone who has actually studied bullets and "stopping power" (which doesn't exist mind you), I am not concerned with this as much as I am with how many shots total were fired.

Given the officer received damage to the eye and a broken orbital socket, you can see where I am going with his aim. That said, adrenaline does a lot to effect ones shooting..

All in all, I am disappointed not only with the way the police handled their communication, but everyone else. I've heard more about race than I have about the actual shooting, which makes me feel like people just want to re-convict Zimmerman more than they want any real "justice."

The officer and his record gives me no reason to think that he is one of those trigger happy cops that exist. I know a few cops myself. I'll be waiting till I hear the results from the Grand Jury personally. Given the facts that exist and some of the "alleged" testimony that they will hear, I am guessing the officer will be exonerated by not only local investigations, but also by the independent and federal investigations.


Where I will critize the officer in question however is here:

This entire situation could have been avoided if he had just not decided to take on a 6 foot 4, 300lb robbery suspect alone. Calling for backup and having multiple officers on scene would of avoided the whole issue. Most officers go their entire careers never firing their weapon because of that.

Unless of course you end up with the stupid officers from New York who suffocated the large man selling untaxed smokes. At least in that case they are charging the officers though due to what is a clear cut homicide.

Just my .02.

 

This whole thing is a trajedy and the victim is a victim and the cop is a criminal like a million of other cases in this country. If the police are not held to the same standards as the people they are trained to protect than there will be no respect left for them in this country. But yet we take away a private citizen's guns and here a cop comes armed with guns and speeding down roads pass the speed limit when there are no sirens while they enforce the speed limit on their citizens. They are hypocrites which I have little appreciation for.