Would you date a bi/pansexual person?

You said that this is a guys opinion in a relationship with a bi woman:

---------- Post added 22nd Oct 2014 at 11:46 PM ----------

All you have done in your posts is lump all guys together.

I can only imagine the reaction I would get if I would have said that to you...

 

I suggest, huh? You can take that as me talking about every single man on earth, you can take that as me talking about a man I met at the supermarket, you can even take that as me talking about a hypothetical man that I conjured up from observation for the sole purpose of being used as an example in my argument.

It's so telling that people can say that lesbians dislike bisexual women and have that be agreed upon as a collective opinion of the lesbian community, but if you dare point out something that occurs in the male community, then here go, hell come. The number of times I've heard people just say "lesbians hate bisexual women" and no one says shit. Imagine my surprise when a man replies to my post in objection. I was expecting a lesbian.

---------- Post added 22nd Oct 2014 at 06:50 PM ----------

Except I'm not easily offended. The same obviously can't be said for a lot of people on this forum.

 

Yes, I would date bi/pans.
If someone loves you, he/she will love you for who you truly are!
I know a lot of people think bissexuals will cheat, they will leave you for a man, and other mean things.
People: Not everyone is equal, some bissexual as some straight people won't never cheat you.

 

Okay, I think we are getting too angry at each other when, in reality, we probably have the same aims (acceptance, fair treatment, etc).

 

Lol you're a complete hypocrite. Why is it okay for a woman to sleep with other women but not men? There's literally no difference whatsoever and no logical reason besides "I'm sexist and I think that lesbian sex is inferior to straight sex/All women need a dick to be satisfied in their sexual relationship so if there's no dick I'm not threatened'.

The only other explanation besides sexism is a guy trying to 'understand' that a bi girl might have different sexual needs that he can't fulfill, but that happens with men too, whether your dick isn't big enough, or you aren't masculine enough, she would need to satisfy that elsewhere with someone else.

 

This again :icon_roll

 

If we both agreed, to be monogamous, and my partner cheated -- I'd be a little irked, be it male or female. The cheating should be the problem, not who it was done with.

It'd be like, to me, sleeping with somebody of a different skin color, just because I'm not that skin color. It's... silly at best, asinine at worst.

 

Let me just address this first, aside from the fact that my entire education in within the field of behavioral science and when I make claims about the effects of inadequacy and self-projection they come from a place prior knowledge and experiences, the fact that I am male should have never been referenced within your posts because that is a topic that you know absolutely nothing about. Gender inequality, misogyny, and femiphobia are birthed from gender archetypes and social distinction. Not sex. I have not disclosed my gender, nor form of expression, in this discussion.

Additionally, being female does not make you knowledgeable on LGBTQ topics surrounding women or feminist concepts anymore than having a brain makes you more knowledgeable in the field of neurosciences. I am not at all misinterpreting what you have said, in reality I have address specific sentences throughout your posts quite directly. What you meant is an entirely different story; however, we communicate thoughts through words and concepts, both of which almost always have explicit meanings. Which is exactly why we should take the time to truly comprehend them before we stick inaccurate terminology on things left and right.

Case in point:

False. Misogynist values and mindsets can effect both men and women. This is not what this statement says. Prejudice directed at both sexes (As there are more than two genders) in the same form is not misogynistic in nature. This is equally as illogical as claiming that prejudice towards all people is racist, homophobia, ethnocentric, etc. The whole point of these terms is that feelings of superiority and mistreatment are disproportionately placed on a certain subgroup. Again, what you might have meant could be different, but it is what you actually state that matters.

Finally, I truly want this to sink in so I'm going to reiterate it one more time for complete clarity. You know nothing about my gender identity so do not regard my opinion as inherently equatable to that of men. If you truly want to established a greater sense of leverage and credibility within a discussion, then do it with actual substance. Open a textbook and become more familiar with the concept you are using; preferably a feminist textbook because the fact that we are having a discussion on gender and misogyny and you wonder why I reference feminism is very telling of the degree of prior knowledge you having on this subject; however, assumptions and condescending generalizations will get you nowhere.

For the record, you might be new to this community, but this is the last place to make swiping generalizations and judgments when it comes to gender. This is not the community for that type of ignorance. Fortunately, I am more apathetic when it comes to gender, rather than suffering from any forms of insecurity or dysmorphia, but there are still plenty of people within this community, reading these threads who do, so lets put an end to this "male=man" "male opinions" "men are this way" nonsense immediately.

 

I agree with you too Nightswimming , but I'm very insecure when it comes to this I've seen threads on here and else where , with bisexuals saying they were having a hard time with monogamy ,and I also heard some bisexual people saying that monogamy can't work for bisexuals . I'm sorry if my comment hurt you .:icon_sad:

---------- Post added 22nd Oct 2014 at 07:21 PM ----------

She never said all males , I saw that no where in her posts .

 

People always use this excuse as a way to backtrack prior statements, but the laws of the English language say otherwise. When a plural pronoun or addressing a group, statements directed to the group are defaulted as all-encompassing. The use of "all", "every", and similar terms is optional, but never required.

For example, the statement, "Americans are fat", is all-encompassing. It references every American. A speaker can throw in a "all" or "every" if they please, but the statement is automatically all-encompassing. When addressing specific members under the same noun, using "some", "a few", "many", or even "most" is a requirement. She has been referencing males and men in condescending statements all throughout this thread without even attempting to make those distinctions. Habitually in fact:

All of this would have been settled long ago if we were all just able to acknowledge the fact that words having meanings and those meaning matter. Ironically, she has been ranting about the inability of males to acknowledge misogyny all while perpetuating sexists mindsets by making blanket generalizations and condescending statements. Not to mention, inaccurately using sex and gender terminology in a way that is blatantly transphobic on a forum for the LGBTQ community.

 

I agree with what you said about English language ,and that other words would have prevented this but I don't see her statement as sexist ; For stating something that is true for some men but not all . I think the way she worded it came off that way ,but she didn't mean it that way .
I'm not sure about the whole misogyny and gender thing I'm a bit confused on that one

 

Honestly, that is what I have been trying to say from the very beginning and things have spiraled out of control. Despite the fact that I do believe that a few of those statements were blatantly condescending, I continue to give the benefit of the doubt and openly state that I believe there are a number of things that she might have meant differently, mentally, but they are being vocalized problematically. There is nothing wrong with poorly phrasing and vocalizing an opinion; we all do it at times. Though rather than becoming defensive and throwing out claims about how everyone is misunderstanding the statements you have made and ranting about how this demographic or that demographic never understand what you're saying, go back to the original statement and reconsider the way in which you are saying them.

I completely agree with many of the things that both FallingDown7 and you has said. Many people are assuming that those who have disagreed with her in this thread are debating whether the existence of misogyny when it comes to bisexuality and women. No one is doing that. Many of the examples being brought up are absolutely valid and misogynistic; however, no one is arguing over the examples. Nightswimmings posts are being argued against because of her claims that biphobia is based in misogyny fundamentally when it clearly isn't. The claim that prejudice proportionately distributed between both genders is misogyny, which is goes against its literal definition. That is how this discussion began and that is how we have gotten to this point.

 

Ohhhh I see now what you meant

 

I'm not seeing what's controversial in the claim that homophobia finds common roots in sexism. And I think the only reason people are finding it "misplaced" in a thread about biphobia is that biphobia is just homophobia plus a complete breakdown of compassion and solidarity within the LG communites.

In other words, I posit that it's being supposed that sexism has nothing to do with biphobia, and "trust issues" have more to do with it. However, I think the extent to which so-called "trust issues" arise can be at least partially explained by sexism. Countless times at EC, we have seen gay men and lesbians express "worry" (read: be total fucking assholes) and say that they would be afraid their partner would cheat with them on the opposite sexed person or simply leave them for the opposite sexed person, in an effort to "be normal." And this "trust issue" is simply being advanced as a perfectly valid reason not to date bisexuals, when in fact this "reason" does nothing to interrogate why gays and lesbians feel underprivileged compared to "normal" in the first instance. Well, the norm, folks, is heterosexuality, enforced by (when it's directed at men) insults that undermine their masculinity and imply femininity (and it's an insult because women are "lesser") or by (when it's directed at women) in the best case condescending remarks about "not having met the right man yet" or about how lesbians can "be converted" and in the worst case, actual corrective rape (because lesbians are an affront to the idea that men have sexual access to women.)

 

Pret, I read the wall message as well, so I'll just through it all in here I usually consider homophobia to be prejudice towards all forms of homosexual attraction, rather than just homosexuals, since it almost always is widespread across all orientation. I would say that biphobia is in an entirely new category because there are very specific and unique assumptions and generalizations that come from biphobia. We could rid ourselves of all homophobia and the prejudices towards polysexuals would still remain.

Sexism, in its many forms, can be found everywhere. It is so deeply-rooted in our society that it can be found in basically any subgroup. We will never reach a point where someone, somewhere won't be shouting out sexist, racist, etc, values and mindsets. Biphobia is no different. There will be traces of sexism in biphobia as there is in essentially everything; however, it is the belief that the vast majority of monosexuals today derive biphobic values from a sexist standpoint that I don't believe is realistic. Where they derive them from is what I will connect to the part of trust and inadequacy.

With coming out becoming more and more standard, I don't believe the bulk of biphobia within the LGBTQ community comes from a fear of bisexual partners running off in search of normality. I believe the reason these fears continue to be popular is that homosexuals, specifically, tend to suffer extreme feelings of romantic inadequacy in their youth. From watching crush after crush, or even love after love, running off with members of the opposite sex. Objectively, these events occurred because the person they desired wasn't homosexual. But subjectively, which is how we often view ourselves, it was because "I wasn't female/male"; "I wasn't what he/she wanted"; "I wasn't enough". It can be a very painful pattern to experience during adolescence and developing fears as a result of those experiences is very natural.

The problem is that many of these emotions are never confronted and addressed. Most just look forward to the day when they can find a partner that is just like them and they know they can please. Though when the partners happens to also be attracted to the opposite, all those repressed emotions come pouring back in. Many people within the LGBTQ community aren't completely aware of scars that might have been left unhealed from their pasts but nearly all have them. My viewpoint is that educating LGBTQ about the affects of their past would go a long way in regards to biphobia (Well, truthfully gender phobias as well, but lets not get to deep right now).

Long story short, I wouldn't be surprised if the vast majority of vehement biphobics held sexism values as well; however, when speaking on the heart of common biphobia I don't believe that it is as much about malice and superiority/inferiority so much as the single most common psychological practice: projection. I believe that sometimes we want everything to be much more about hate and judgment than it is at times because it is easier to demonize and combat, but there are so many things about humans in society that are honestly driven by basic emotions such as fear, uncertainty, and insecurity.

 

I actually prefer to date a bi/pan individual like myself. The way I see it, they know and appreciate that beauty comes in many forms and that they love each one and appreciate its uniqueness as much as I do.

And plus, I would totally just enjoy sitting with them and just eyeballing everyone.

Me: God....Do you see his jeans? I wonder where he got them.

Partner: Mm-hmm. Also got a nice butt too.

*shamelessly high fives each other in agreement*

That would be awesome!!! XD

 

Why not?

 

Im not sure. I think the relationship will not working well

 

Of course I would. There's no reason not to. I don't really get her line of thinking.

 

Hypothetical scenario: What if you had a boyfriend that cheated on you with another man? Would you dump him? What if he cheated with another woman?