1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Wanting to be a man, dose that count?

Discussion in 'Gender Identity and Expression' started by Idiot Alex, Jul 6, 2018.

  1. Idiot Alex

    Idiot Alex Guest

    Here's the shortest version.
    I'm very very new to actually seriously considering being trans. Until a month ago I thought that being trans meant that people just knew from the minute they were born that they were the wrong gender. Now it seems to me far more complicated and that questioning without knowing is okay.
    But I'm still not clear on when am I allowed(?) to be trans? I just have this feeling like I'm not suffering enough or something. I always wanted to be a man, I used to fantasize about one day just waking up in a world where I was male. But I never felt like I needed to have a dick and I don't feel particularly inclined to boyish activities (mainly sports) if anything I want to be a man and wear make up, and dresses and be beautiful (I don't wear make up now because I don't want to be girly, but I also don't wear baggy clothes, basically not really a Tom boy)
    So dose that count? Is wanting to be a man the same or enough as feeling like I am a man? I'm sorry if this is really stupid or rude in any way. I hope I didn't over share
     
  2. Cailan

    Full Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2017
    Messages:
    293
    Likes Received:
    31
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest
    Gender:
    Other
    Gender Pronoun:
    He
    Sexual Orientation:
    Bisexual
    Out Status:
    Out to everyone
    The majority of trans folks do NOT know as children. Yes, some do, like Jazz Jennings, but most figure it out when their hormones come in, during puberty or fairly soon after. For many, the understanding of what they are inside is buried so deep because of social conditioning it doesn't emerge until some kind of stress or trauma later in life, as a young adult, or even in middle age, makes it painfully obvious to even the most oblivious.

    Many of us are miserable, or simply know something is off, without understanding what or why. We keep plugging along, looking at everything else as the "problem." I personally blamed my off feelings for being too tall, not feminine enough, slightly socially awkward. I would walk down the street totally killing it as a woman, with perfect hair, cute skirt/heels outfit, big boobs... and I had no idea why I kept expecting someone to call me out as a "fake."

    When I finally put 2+2 together and got 4, I was 47 years old, but looking back, hindsight being 20/20, I realized I had been having trans feelings/symptoms since about the age of 12, I just didn't have a name to put to them, because I'm non-binary and back when I was a kid no one ever heard of wanting to keep your own gender AND be the other gender too. Also, as a kid I never thought much about gender, I just was. Sometimes I identified totally as a girl, but I never felt like I fit in with the other girls, and had no idea why. I also wanted to join the boys socially, and was utterly mystified as to why I didn't fit. NOW I know I was bi-gender, transmasculine, the entire time.
     
    Hanyauku likes this.
  3. Cailan

    Full Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2017
    Messages:
    293
    Likes Received:
    31
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest
    Gender:
    Other
    Gender Pronoun:
    He
    Sexual Orientation:
    Bisexual
    Out Status:
    Out to everyone
    Also, you don't "become" transgender. You *are* transgender. Transgender simply means "not cis" - meaning your sex (body/DNA) don't match your gender (whether you feel internally like a guy, a girl, neither, both, or some mix). "Cis" simply means your gender and body match. The only thing you get to "choose" is whether or not to transition.

    Many people who are transgender choose to not transition due to the high social price of transitioning, or the high monetary price of transitioning. For some, their dysphoria is less severe, and the potential pain of losing friends, families, job, or simply their social status, is greater than their need to transition. For others, the cost of hormone therapy, surgeries, a replacement wardrobe, legal expenses (name changes, etc) and other factors of transition are more than their income can bear.

    Body parts/configuration/appearance = sex
    Internal identity = gender

    We are "transgender," no matter what we choose, but a person who is transitioning medically is sometimes known as a "transsexual" because they have made the choice to transition their body - their sex. In some communities the term "transsexual" is reserved for those who have *completed* a medical transition.
     
    Hanyauku likes this.
  4. denouement

    Regular Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2015
    Messages:
    225
    Likes Received:
    38
    Location:
    Riften
    Gender:
    Male (trans*)
    Gender Pronoun:
    He
    Sexual Orientation:
    Gay
    Out Status:
    All but family
    Yes, wanting to be a man counts. Questioning is absolutely okay... I would say in almost all cases, questioning is necessary to figure things out.

    While some trans folks know who they are from a very young age, not everyone does. I only realized something was off when I started puberty. Until that point, I had assumed I was a girl; however once female characteristics started to develop, I started to question my gender and realized I was male. Many trans folks have a similar experience, where they don't begin to question until puberty, or until much later in life as adults.

    Being transgender does not equal suffering. There is no arbitrary amount of angst or despair you have to experience before you are "trans enough". Trans people experience a wide range of dysphoria. Some have very severe dysphoria over their body or how they are seen by society. Others find it is so mild they can live with it for years without taking steps to socially or physically transition.

    I also feel it's important to point out some people don't realize the extent of their dysphoria. I experienced years of depressive/anxiety symptoms, general apathy to life, etc. not realizing how my dysphoria affected me because to me, it felt "normal". I assumed everyone else felt this way too. I only realized how badly I had been affected once I began medical transition and had a truly "happy" baseline to compare my past experiences to.

    I think you'll find a lot of men, both cisgender and transgender, aren't "masculine" or "boyish" in the steretypical way you seem to be thinking of. None of my cis male friends play/watch sports (unless you count video games or marching band). Most only know basics of home and auto repair because they learned growing up, in the same way many of my female friends are familiar with cooking and other household tasks, regardless of their personal interests (yay gender roles... /s). And there are many, many men who are interested in fashion and grooming, including more feminine/women's fashion and makeup. If cisgender men can be like this, and are still men, why can't you or I?

    While you are questioning, my advice would be to not worry so much about labeling what you are feeling, and instead focus on your future. Picture your "ideal self" regardless of what your gender is, or how you think your friends/family/society would react to you... What do you want to look like? How do you want others to refer to you? Then consider labels, and what steps you may want to take to achieve that ideal. I wish you luck in figuring your self out, whether you are transgender or not.
     
    Hanyauku likes this.
  5. Nimmer

    Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2017
    Messages:
    115
    Likes Received:
    26
    Location:
    UK
    Gender:
    Other
    Gender Pronoun:
    They
    Sexual Orientation:
    Bisexual
    Out Status:
    Some people
    I don't believe it's necessarily something you know from the beginning. Social pressure, in my opinion, can play a big part on making us unconsciously repress those feelings of being a different gender, or realising that 'something's wrong'. We're conditioned from our birth to view ourselves as the same gender as our apparent biological sex—I was dressed in pink, received gifts like baby dolls and little plastic vacuum-cleaners (and even plates and cutlery when I was 9-10, to start my 'marriage trousseau'... what a load of poppycock)... Add traditional family's peer pressure, and it can smother our real feelings and keep them hidden, or disguised as something else, until later, when we're older, get in touch with other trans people, and so on.

    (I feel that currently, with places like EC, Tumblr posts, etc., there are many more opportunities. Where I grew up, a small village in the 90s, with no internet at home and not even at school, there were literally no resources, no one to talk to and compare experiences with, so whatever feelings of inadequacy I had, I chalked them down to 'it's puberty, it's normal to feel off'. -_- )

    Also, I know it's hard, all the more as FtM (because of the whole pressure—again—on girls from a young again, teaching them that they're the ones who have to make the efforts, that if you don't conform then you HAVE to suffer, that if something wrong happens then you were 'looking for it', etc.). But try not to think of it in terms of 'I'm not suffering enough'. Nobody should demand that we 'suffer'—as if being born in the wrong body was our fault and a sin and we had to atone for it! The whole questioning process is already complicated enough as it is...
     
  6. Idiot Alex

    Idiot Alex Guest

    It's exactly because I think I've "unconsciously repress those feelings" that this is so terrifying to me. I've explained my desire to be a man to myself in so many different ways. When I was a kid I thought all girls wanted to be boys. Then when puberty hit it seemed even more obvious because who wants to get periods? I accepted that I hate my body, because all girls my age seemed to hate them too. When I read more into feminist I deduced that I'm just so unconsciously sexists that I want to be a man because I think they're 'better' in some way (even though I never actually thought that). My latest thing was thinking I had a second repressed personality who was male (bullshit). In comparison being transgender seems so obvious, I feel like I don't deserve that answer. Like I've had all these other ridiculous notions before how do I know this isn't one? That I'm not just copying the real experiences of people who actually struggle with this as an attempt to explain myself.
    I really wish I could just present as man and see how that makes me feel, but every time I think about my family and my friends and how I might have to admit I've lied to them or how disgusted they might be or how maybe I'm not transgender at all and I'd just put them through all that for nothing. I freeze up and cry, just thinking about being trans is so miserable, I've read that people feel relieved when they finally figure it out, I just feel sad and scared all the time now. It's like I feel like I can't do anything remotely masculine anymore because someone is going to catch on and expose me and everything I've ever built as a woman, all the respect I've gained will be meaningless.
     
  7. Crisalide

    Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2016
    Messages:
    624
    Likes Received:
    339
    Location:
    Italy
    Gender:
    Male (trans*)
    Gender Pronoun:
    He
    Sexual Orientation:
    Bisexual
    Out Status:
    Some people
    I never felt relieved while questioning. At most happy (gender euphoria) or scared, confused, sad ("what the hell is going on"). There wasn't a moment of "illumination" when "everything comes into place" and I "find myself - and my gender too". When your questioning will go on, maybe you won't find a single moment of big relief, just little changes that will gradually bring you from confusion to knowledge.

    People usually tend to see us "continuously": acquaintances interpret our personality from the first impression even months after, older relatives see us as a child till our twenties... This makes it hard to transition socially, but at least nothing that you "built as a woman" (?? - please explain better) will be forgotten or will loose value.
     
  8. takemeout

    Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2017
    Messages:
    85
    Likes Received:
    27
    Location:
    Eastern Europe
    Gender:
    Other
    Gender Pronoun:
    Other
    Sexual Orientation:
    Other
    Out Status:
    A few people
    Hey, my experience is somewhat similar to yours. Right now I'm in such a state that it's quite hard for me to live as a girl (I've never actually related to that word much). There were hints from teenage years that I'm not cis, but I'm generally a late bloomer, so I'm only coming to terms with my trans identity now (I'm 21).

    I haven't peen suffering all of my previous years, but there were bits where I thought that I would like sooo much to live in this world as a man, and it seems much more fitting to my persona. I thought that many people think so, but apparently there are not so much AFAB who would like to get rid of their boobs and have more masculine-like body proportions.
     
    Chris87 likes this.
  9. Idiot Alex

    Idiot Alex Guest

    The "built as a woman" thing was more of a spur of the moment thought. I think I was trying to convey this feeling that I've somehow lied to the people around me, or that some of my thoughts, especially the ones concerning women issues, are less valid (I know that's not true)
     
  10. Idiot Alex

    Idiot Alex Guest

    Yeah, it was really a shock to me when I finally understood that most people don't want to be the opposite gender at least not completely change their body proportions as well.
    :sweat:
    I hope you can find a way of getting thought this and end up happier than before
     
  11. takemeout

    Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2017
    Messages:
    85
    Likes Received:
    27
    Location:
    Eastern Europe
    Gender:
    Other
    Gender Pronoun:
    Other
    Sexual Orientation:
    Other
    Out Status:
    A few people
    Yeah, that's tough. And I also feel stuck because I'm not entirely sure whether it will actually help (even though I know that I'll have to put a facade all the time). And there's whole another matter with subjecting myself to humiliation from others by making myself look like a fool.

    Same goes to you!