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Vulnerability of the newly gay

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by greatwhale, Mar 23, 2013.

  1. greatwhale

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    It has been stated elsewhere that coming out later in life is like a second adolescence, and that one must go through initial awkwardness and make some mistakes...

    I have also learned about how our relationships while closeted usually imply a certain holding back or reserve with regard to closeness and emotional (and of course sexual) intimacy.

    This has been no less true for me, and my wife has sensed it long ago, that I could never get that close to her.

    With guys, on the other hand, I have already sensed in myself the desire to fully open my heart to another human being, and this is extremely new (and scary) to me. In my encounters with men so far, there have been two patterns, those before coming out, and the one after.

    Before coming out, I sensed the potential of emotional intimacy, but held back because I could not commit to anything, but after coming out, it felt natural to be able to love without reserve...natural but very vulnerable too!

    I had spoken elsewhere of a "sort of" relationship with a guy I have been seeing, he is closeted so I have not insisted on going further on an emotional level, but I easily could have. Well he hasn't texted or communicated with me in over a week, it just suddenly stopped without explanation....I suppose it is over, and I am just glad I had wisdom enough not to open the emotional floodgates with him...but I am confused...just like some teenager...
     
  2. Italy or Bust

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    Sorry to hear that. Good analisys...I suspect he and you are in vastly different places, him being closeted still. He may be burying it and thinking he "got his fix" for now.
     
  3. skiff

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    Hey Great,

    What you just went through was what drove me to marriage. I will repeat it again...

    After a15 year gay relationship with a closeted man, where I had opened the emotional floodgates but lived closeted because he was, I got dumped when his mother applied the slightest pressure as to "why aren't 't you married yet?". Without hesitation I was dumped and he married the first woman to open her legs. I was ejected to protect his closeted status. This situation played out twice more I came to the conclusion that closeted gay men could not commit emotionally. (These guys are now recently out)

    Sadly by age 28 my closeted lie had become so large it was self perpetuating and I naively never thought to come out of the closet. I learned that closeted men live with one hand on the eject button and do not hesitate to use it.

    I told myself woman don't do this and stupidly found one thinking I could beat being gay.

    I would guess (WAG) that you sent this fellow a text or email and his wife simply asked "who is that from?". Eject! A guess but a reasonable one.

    In my experience closeted gays are dangerous to invest in. Their secret is paramount in their life.

    That is how I see it.

    My other concern is that coming off a LTR, even one as lopsided as yours or mine with my wife, we will over invest with the gay men we meet. Needing the security of an LTR we will try to whip up an instant one. A "rebound" relationship doomed to failure.

    Those are my thoughts.
     
  4. Dalmatian

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    I always thought how weird it was that all the people around me went (to some degree) crazy when we entered puberty, while I was completely in charge of my life. Well, it turns out that "in charge" actually meant closeted. So now, twenty years later, I'm finding that when it comes to insecurities, emotional floods, episodes of bipolarity (no offense to people actually suffering from it) I now have all the symptoms of puberty, even finding, for the first time in my life, my parents somewhat annoying :slight_smile:

    The thing is, these closeted emotions were never free. Now when the glimpses of what it might look like in the future are starting to show, it's scary; the potential, the level of openness and emotional nakedness in front of another person, a man, is both frightening and exhilarating.
    The thought of opening up so completely to a person who will himself shut in back in the closet is worrisome. Sorry to hear about your situation with the guy.
     
  5. lionel

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    great thread gents, not that its of any help, but I think as humans we owe one another a bit of campassion . I recently had a great dinner date with a gay man my age who has been out since his teen years. i actively participated in the date, and presented my self as a gay man , really an amazing night, super flirty and sweet and nice. I called him the next day, thanked him for a great time and the sweet nice kisses, and i layed it on the line , true and honest, i told him where i'm at in my availiability and bowed out of taking a future date cause i'm just not authentic in my gay life yet. he's a great guy, he thanked me for my honesty , and offered his friendship. sorry to ramble on, I hope the take away is, we're not kids, and we should be treating each other better. i love your perspective GW, i'm glad you have a handle on it. thanks for being a good teacher, your friend Lionel
     
  6. PeteNJ

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    I'm seeing that living a closeted gay life for many years, in general, from being involved in various real life groups and EC, is that most of us men have not had boyfriends, long term relationships, etc.

    I've been hearing that from my IRL gay friends who are coming out later in life, so often -- "but I've never had a boyfriend."

    So then, being out, its about figuring out (at least for me!), am I going out with a guy to be friends? because I want sex or a relationship? are we buddies or are we dating?

    And then its pretty clear to me that no strings attached sex, friends with benefits, are all in the mix, too.

    To be frank, in the hetero world, if I had drinks or dinner with a woman (other than a colleague or something), it was a "date" -- and the meaning of that was pretty clear.

    With men -- I find myself confused about all that. I've decided that's really kind of stupid. Ok, so if I meet a guy for drinks or dinner... why not just go with the flow? If we're flirty, physical, well then that's one direction. If not, well, don't make it more than it is.

    I've talked about this is therapy a couple times -- how do I navigate my world as an out gay man? Is it only my straight male friends that I rule out for sex/relationship ? (ha?!?)

    I yearn for the emotional closeness with a man. And I yearn for great sex with a man, too. I don't think both need to be present at the same time, actually, now that I write this, they definitely don't need to be there at the same time at all. The romantic, hetero-world me thinks it would be nice for both to be there.

    But I'm beginning to get -- that I can have intimacy with a man I'm not sexual with. And I can have sex, if I want it. And with some luck, maybe both together.

    Its a journey, gents, a journey. We'll all figure it out for ourselves I'm sure.
     
  7. bingostring

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    ..this resonated with me...
    I'm not authentic
    parts of my brain are still undeveloped like a 14 year old but my body is several times that age
    how to bring this to a resolution so late in life
    how to even start...???
     
  8. greatwhale

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    I found your reply quite accurate and funny, especially the part about your parents :grin:

    The fear is quite real, and being gay means being sometimes with closeted guys. I was one of them and there were times when I knew that I was breaking someone's heart, because I could not commit. I wasn't equipped to handle it, I could not accept that I would have such an effect on other guys. It was all supposed to be "just casual" :icon_sad:

    ---------- Post added 24th Mar 2013 at 07:56 PM ----------

    It sure is Pete, and I see what you mean about a certain flexibility about defining our same-sex relationships, great sex and great relationships may not necessarily be in the same person, but yeah, we expect that of hetero relationships (why is that I wonder??)

    I guess we need to keep trying to find that one guy who has both qualities, quite the challenge!
     
    #8 greatwhale, Mar 24, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2013
  9. Jeff

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    This drives me absolutely crazy! I can handle rejection and know that I am not everyone's type. But when the line goes dead on me after I was nice and considerate, it really bugs me. Because I don't expect every encounter and friendship to get all the way there. And some of them may go very far and then we realize it is just not meant to be.

    But to just drop out and not send even a short message, is mean and cruel. I think these guys are going to get what's coming to them back. Maybe I am overly sensitive in that way, but communication is so important to me. My mind reading is just never been as good as I would have liked.
     
  10. greatwhale

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    You are welcome, I guess what I'm teaching are some hard-learned lessons, so much pain that I would like as many as possible to avoid in their own lives as gay men.

    Congratulations to you for your honesty with that sweet-sounding guy, sounds like quite the sacrifice for your integrity! Do not forsake his friendship, he himself has already found in you something powerful and rare!

    As for my guy, nothing lost really, it was never more than a hope, and I will move on..

    ---------- Post added 24th Mar 2013 at 08:13 PM ----------

    Thanks, Jeff, for the sympathy :slight_smile:

    I must confess that in my neo-adolescent state, I did expect that he has some 'splainin' to do, but my maturity has taken over (and as the days pass, he becomes less and less a concern to me) I realize that he is still where I was. Perhaps karma is sticking it to me too for getting into these kinds of relationships in the past! :help:

    But yeah, he called himself my friend...friends just don't drop off the face of the earth, especially since he seemed to be supportive of me during the divorce I am currently going through...so I am definitely confused....and definitely a poor mind-reader!
     
  11. 1859guy

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    Boy this really rang true for me! Because of some family trama (losing lots of family members in a short amount of time) and responding to stress with deep repression (of sexuality but also emotions, opinions, etc.) I feel about 17 sometimes. Occasionally this feels freeing and exciting but more often then not I just feel like someone who has totally missed the boat of his life. It is nice to be reminded I'm not alone!
     
  12. IrishEyes1989

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    greatwhale, I applaud your courage and strength in coming out later in life. It makes perfect sense that you're feeling conflicted with this shift in your emotions. You've lived a large portion of your life one way and now you are navigating a whole new world. A second adolescence, indeed. But remember, with the awkwardness of those teenage years there is also the unbridled joy of pure abandon. Best of luck :slight_smile:
     
  13. Cool Bananas

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    Threads like these are one of the reasons I have been visiting EC daily since I found the website. So many stories or parts of stories ring true with me and I thought was I the only one going through these issues, maybe I was imagining it. Sometimes you can blow things out of proportion so it can distort reality but finding a website like this means that you aren't alone but also you get another perspective.


    Lucky you decided to not get to emotionally involved, although it is still annoying when you don't hear from someone, not even a I am busy I get back to you when my head is in a better space, just nothing.

    I have read that a number of times the worst thing is that their secrecy then effects other parts of their lives as they don't know what to reveal about themselves and so they either make no comment or decide to lie about it.

    That is what we should all strive to do; at least be honest with the other person and I am glad that you were able to do that, and everyone learns from it.

    Wasn't there a joke from the past, and it went something along the lines of trying to find someone with both qualities but making sure the 2 never met. :icon_wink

    The lack of communication just driving me crazy, even my brother and my parents do it. :bang: