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Unprotected sex with an HIV+ undetectable person?

Discussion in 'Physical & Sexual Health' started by tommycee, May 17, 2019.

  1. tommycee

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    so there’s this guy I’m thinking about hooking up with but he’s HIV+ usually that’s a dealbreaker for me but he’s undetectable so there’s supposedly no risk. He doesn’t want to use condoms though so I wanted to see your guys opinion on it. Is it safe to do it unprotected if he’s undetectable or could I be making a huge mistake? He’s not the type to wear a condom if I asked so it’s either don’t have sex or have it unprotected, and I feel like I would be missing out if I didn’t do it with him but I also don’t want to catch something serious. What should I do?
     
  2. Destin

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    There's literally nothing in the entire world of sex riskier to your health than having sex with an HIV positive person without a condom so... whether it's undetectable or not I'd say there's no way it's worth the risk. I'm an extremely open minded guy when it comes to sex, but I'd legitimately be offended if someone with HIV asked me to do that.
     
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  3. Chip

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    There is data from several studies that indicate that someone with an undetectable viral load cannot pass the virus on to another person.
    So the pro-HIV+ rights people are screaming from the treetops that there's no risk... which is partially true.

    BUT...

    The studies have a bunch of qualifiers in them:
    -- The person with HIV must be on medication which is taken absolutely consistently
    -- The person may, if s/he has other problems that potentially compromise immunity, see a sudden increase in viral load.
    -- Failing to take medication consistently can cause virus load to suddenly spike (as can other things)
    -- "undetectable" does not mean "no virus"; it means that the viral load isn't detectable. It is reported that transmission has not happened in any of the studies. But that does mean that it is impossible, just that it hasn't happened in any of the studies to-date, and those studies excluded people who were inconsistent with meds, had other conditions that could cause immune problems, and other factors that, when taken together, paint a less-than-complete assurance that there's no risk.

    UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES WOULD I BAREBACK WITH SOMEONE WITH OR WITHOUT HIV, whether or not they have an undetectable viral load. And (the following will sound incredibly judgmental, because it is): the very fact that the selfish asshole is asking you to to have sex without condoms is what got him where he is in the first place.

    You are 17 years old. I've talked to several people who at your age +/- a year or two, were convinced to bareback. In one case, it was a first sexual partner, who swore they were monogamous, and both were tested before they started having sex. And... my friend, in a routine test several months later, found out he was positive... because his "absolutely faithful" boyfriend had cheated, got HIV, and didn't bother to tell his committed, monogamous boyfriend... and infected him. Had they used condoms, this would not have happened.

    There is never, ever a valid reason to have sex without a condom. If you care about your partner, and your partner cares about you, the condom doesn't say "I don't trust you"; it says "I care about you enough that if one of us makes a mistake they aren't ready to tell the other about, the other will still be safe."

    I'm sorry, but any asshole who is so selfish that he doesn't give a crap about your concerns, safety, or healt, and can't be bothered to wear a condom... is not someone that is worth your time. This behavior, for me, is a red flag that likely predicts other selfish behaviors... and for me it would be an absolute no. In part because of the safety issue, but even more because of the selfishness.

    You deserve way, way better than that.
     
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  4. DirectionNorth

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    Yeah, even if the risk were incredibly low, the risk isn't worth it. And just like the two above, it's extremely awful he's "laying down the law" no condom or no sex. That is incredibly immature and douchy, and frankly, dangerous. Undetected doesn't mean not there, negative means not there. He should know better and know the seriousness of what he's asking and how risky that behaviour is.
     
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  5. DecentOne

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    I agree with the above. If a guy does not love you enough to use protection, move on.

    But, knowing there are folks who ignore this advice there is medicine: Truvada “PrEP”. Taken daily it can reduce the risk of contracting HIV. Look it up. You have to be on it for a couple weeks before it has built up enough in your system, so it isn’t something you start the day you decide to be sexually active... and by the way, combined with condom use it is better than just one or the other. Condoms are cheap and over the counter too, PrEP isn’t.
     
  6. MzMrAlexa

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    This might sound a bit harsh and I'm sorry but to me that is just insane (just my opinion).

    This may be over-simplifying it but to put what you are talking about in a different scenario stripping away all of the "maybe's" The way I see it is that when it comes right down to it having unprotected sex with someone who has HIV would be no different than if someone handed me a revolver and put one bullet in it that they said was a Dud (wouldn't fire) and asked me to play "Russian Roulette" with it (which is to spin the cylinder to land on a random chamber put the gun to my head and pull the trigger). It wouldn't matter how much I loved or cared for them them or anything else they tried to tell me I would still tell them to go take a hike! There are some things that you just don't play around with no matter how much someone sugar coats it and my opinion is that HIV definitely falls into that category.

    Which brings me to another point... If the roles were reversed and I had HIV no matter what the status was, the Last thing I would do is to ask someone who did not have HIV to have unprotected sex with me knowing what it might lead to. Now all of this is just my opinion and to each their own, but my feelings are that if this persons thought process is such that they would even entertain asking you to do this then are they the type of person that you would want to be with in the first place?
     
    #6 MzMrAlexa, May 18, 2019
    Last edited: May 18, 2019
  7. Chip

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    PrEP works, but only if you take it consistently, don't miss doses, and stay on it. There's actually some research that people who take it intermittently actually raise their risk of infection because (if I'm remembering correctly) it creates selective resistance, and there are varieties of HIV that have essentially "learned" to work against intermittent dosing. The people who produce PREP have always recommended it for use in addition to condoms, not instead of them.

    Again, I would still never, ever not use condoms, even if I and the other person are on PrEP, if the other person had a test 5 minutes ago saying he was negative, if he has undetectable viral load, or for any other reaosn.
     
  8. BMC77

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    Like others here, I'd say I'd consider having sex with this guy using no condom to be totally unacceptable. Period. End of story. It's a choice of "no condom" or "no sex?" Fine. It can be "no sex" and he can either change his position, or go and find some idiot to go along with his desires.

    I'll also add that I, personally, take a more conservative view than many here: I don't think I'd be willing to have sex with someone HIV+.

    A couple of other points. First, he says he's "undetectable." It's entirely possible he's lying about that. It's also possible that things have changed since the last test.

    Also: I think that his position of not wanting to use a condom is an incredibly selfish and self centered desire.
     
  9. johndeere3020

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    tommy, PLEASE have more respect for yourself that to knowingly put yourself in such ion such a situation. I know rural settings are hard. I know. Maybe you feel alone, that this is one of the only options to have the experience that you seek. Its not! This guy has zero respect for you or himself!
     
  10. tommycee

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    I decided not to do it. I never really talked about it with the guy, just kind of quit talking to him. There was always that nervous feeling in the back of my head because of him being positive. The whole thing is kind of weird to me because before then, I had told myself that I wasn’t even going to consider doing anything with anyone positive, but then this guy comes around and it’s not even that he was really attractive, he was just into some things sexually that I’ve always dreamed of so I made myself blind to what I had always promised myself. But I’ve decided not to go through with it because no amount of fulfilled fantasies are worth living a nightmare.
     
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  11. Mirko

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    I think you made the right decision. As others have indicated, the guy not wanting to use condoms even though he has mentioned that he is HIV+ is irresponsible on his part. Even if someone says the virus is undetectable, safety comes always first.

    It isn't worth it to put your health on the line to fulfill a fantasy. I would suggest to find someone with whom it clicks, where you can build a more trusting relationship that will allow you to not only form a meanigful connection with someone but also to experience the intimacy and fantasies that you would like to have fulfilled.
     
  12. EcoMan

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    Alternatively, instead of leaping to the “selfishness” of the guy, just say, “thanks for being honest with me about it” and move on. I’ve been there and appreciated the fact that guys were upfront BEFORE meeting. As long as he wasn’t pressuring you and trying to convince you to change your mind, no need to name call. Just my opinion.
     
  13. Destroyed

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    It's hard to come across such mature and caring minds on such a topic. Most times people with their own selfish motives take advantage and advice otherwise. Empty closets really has sober minds. :pray:
     
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  14. DirectionNorth

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    He was pressuring the op, saying i'll only have sex without a condem, no sex at all with one.
     
  15. EcoMan

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    Based on the way I’m reading the post, they were just in the discussion stage and haven’t met. Merely stating what you will or won’t do is not necessarily “pressure,” unless there was further attempts at trying to convince the OP to go against his own judgment. The OP has a choice here.