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Trying to figure this out

Discussion in 'Sexual Orientation' started by Rupert30, May 7, 2018.

  1. Rupert30

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    Hello, new here - I’m not sure if this is the right place to be posting this - I’m not really sure where to go with anything here but was hoping for some advice/help - sorry this is long as hell


    I’m a 31 year old male, intermittently throughout my life I’ve been worried about being gay - I experimented as a kid with other boys (but also girls) and was teased about that - then at like 12 I started just having these unpleasant images of every male I came into contact with naked. Like it would flash in my mind and cause me great distress.


    Most of my platonic relationships are with men - I’ve only had female romantic relationships - but I’m not sure if that’s due to repression or what. Due to my confusion I have at points forced myself to experiment with men as an adult - but I’ve always been too freaked out by the situation to enjoy it.


    I’ve watched a slight bit of gay porn which doesn’t do it for me - and recently started watching porn with trans women which is arousing currently. My main go to in my life has been lesbian and blowjob porn - but I often feel like maybe I instinctively imagine myself as the girl.


    During my long term relationships, the first one I stopped being interested in sex about a year and a half in - the second one I never did and that lasted around four years but that was partly because of how tumultuous the whole thing was. But I’ve always had like a nagging feeling - every now and then - like anxiety that Id turn out to be gay. It didn’t bother me really while in the relationships - but when I’m single for awhile it starts to.


    Now I’ve been single for a very long time and I’m the past month or so have felt like I’m gay or bisexual - and it’s tormenting me 24-7 - I’m trying to embrace it as I do not care if others are gay at all and don’t feel anyone around me would be super freaked out about me being gay - (I’ve come out as bisexual in the past and reneged on it later.) but the anxiety now is unbearable - it’s like I wake up with what feels like an oral compulsion to suck like a disembodied penis or something - it’s not a pleasant thought tho it’s really anxiety inducing.


    I have thoughts like these throughout the day - to touch guys inappropriately at inappropriate times as well - any guy - doesn’t matter what they look like or who they are and this distresses me a lot. I started watching trans porn and whacking off to it to try to relieve these thoughts but they don’t go away - I’m trying to just try to enjoy them? So they don’t cause me this distress? But that’s very difficult to do for me perhaps because of rewiring my brain for so long.


    Anyway I think what I have to do is get physical with another man and make myself comfortable with that - I am not at the moment mentally attracted to men and don’t want to do this technically but I think I need to maybe devote some time to trying to make myself comfortable with it and defeat my internalized homophobia. I’m single, no one has any expectations of me and have all the time in the world so really this is the best time to do this.


    Does anyone have any advice on how to do this safely and healthily? Or has anyone felt the same way?
     
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  2. Rupert30

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    Any advice at all would be appreciated
     
  3. I'm gay

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    Although I think other gay men here will agree with me, I will only speak for myself and my experience.

    It isn't about the sexual acts themselves. They're great, mind you, but understand that the sex is only the physical expression of what's happening in the mind. That's where the real sexual arousal happens. It's also why you've had unfulfilling sexual experiences. What you are missing in this is the intimacy that goes with sex and sexual arousal. A lack of acceptance of being gay, combined with internalizing the homophobic messaging you've received, creates a barrier to accessing your true sexual arousal patterns - as you said not being "mentally attracted to men." Using trans porn probably isn't helping you here either. Self acceptance allows you to give yourself permission to feel your attractions rather than burying them, which leads to you being able to imagine yourself with a man in a fulfilling relationship, with intimacy and with sex.

    I would suggest that you stop porn altogether and use your imagination only. Create scenarios in your mind and see where it leads. I think it will help you to be in a better place mentally if you start actually using your thoughts for stimulation and not porn.
     
  4. Rupert30

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    Thanks for the advice - I've been pretty unsuccessful in stopping masturbating to porn in the past - difficult because my mind usually just goes to past sexual experiences which I have mainly had with women (I also had a problem with female hookers for a second and my mind goes there as well). I will try it again though - the trans porn I'm over already for some reason. I'm just struggling with this concept of self acceptance - like I just want to be okay with whatever. My main "fear" I guess is that I would have to give up women and a lot of my identity I feel like I've built to attract women - but other than that there's legit no reason for me to have this severe case of inability to accept myself I feel like. Maybe there is some mental exercise I can do? Or some sort of specific type of therapy? Also a problem is I don't have any sort of romantic feelings around guys, like Ive never crushed on a specific guy or anything it's just these random sexual impulses - Its causing me to have like panic attacks and shit.
     
  5. I'm gay

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    I think it's ok for your mind to go where it wants to go during fantasy. Sure, maybe it will be about past experiences at first. But you'll eventually tire of those specific fantasies. If you can, try directing your fantasies to sex with men. Those fantasies about disembodied penises, for example, is a good starting point. Try masturbating to that specific fantasy. If you're successful and it turns you on enough, repeat that fantasy and allow it to morph wherever it takes you. The point is, the longer you go without porn, and using only your imagination, the better chance you have at discovering aspects of your sexuality you didn't realize before. It may take a month of masturbation before this really begins working, so don't be discouraged easily and go back to porn.
     
  6. Rupert30

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    Thanks again for responding. I tried the disembodied penis thing but it didn’t work. I’m getting confused about that part of it because I’m not sure if that’s what I “want” sexually or if it’s something else, like it doesn’t feel like a “fantasizing” thing. It feels similar to I guess when you see someone on TV eat something really gross and you kinda feel like you’re eating it so it makes you a bit nauseous? Dunno if that makes sense. Like it doesn’t seem to be connected to arousal. Anyway I’ve come to the conclusion that I’m most likely bisexual - which is slightly annoying because I would like to be either gay or straight. I’m sure there’s benefits to it but I feel like it’s making this much harder as I am attracted to the opposite sex quite a bit and it’s tempting to just not put in the effort on the same sex end.

    The porn thing though, I haven’t given it too long obviously, but I’m pretty much entirely unsuccessful when fantasizing about men. I’ve been able to do it in the past a couple of times - I did that once on cocaine and like two or three other times. I’m having trouble maintaining the discipline and patience to see this through this particular way though. Is there any other quicker versions of this? That can get me to a more accepting place faster? Thanks
     
  7. PatrickUK

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    Can you just clarify if the teasing was in relation to experimenting with other boys? I wonder if the origins of all of this anxiety are rooted in your formative years, because you seem to have developed unpleasant feelings about naked males around this time and this issue seems to persist and manifest in different ways with acute anxiety about your sexuality. Maybe you can say more about the teasing and describe what happened and what was said? It might help if we know more about it.
     
  8. Rupert30

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    Oof - uh. I mean I wasn’t teased that much I guess in relation to that technically. I was like a small kid so I got picked on for that mostly. I got called worthless and that I had no friends and stuff mainly. I mean to be honest I don’t recall a whole lot of my childhood. I was kind of a weird kid, like a loner, but I guess the sexuality thing wasn’t singled out in any particular way? Maybe it was and I just don’t remember. I really don’t know why. I remember the first time I experimented with another boy was this neighbor kid who told me to do certain things - then I did that with one of my other friends. But I also acted out in terms of hurting my friends - like fighting them. Probably because I was hit as a kid. I wish I had more info believe me I’ve done a lot of self analysis - I just blank out a lot of my early years.
     
  9. Chip

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    Hi, and welcome!

    So I think you've gotten a lot of good input and insights here. It can be really hard to discern where attractions lie when there's a lot of self-judgment going on. And in your case, on the one hand, you're saying "I can be OK with it if I'm gay" and on the other hand, you're saying "Well, I've built a lot of my identity on attracting women". So that internal dichotomy is where the issue lies, I think.

    It's further complicated by relying on porn for masturbation fantasies (again, not an uncommon, especially among people in their 30s and younger.)

    So the truth is, there's no easy-and-quick answer. It's about taking time and having patience, especially, if you are closer to the gay side of things (which may well be the case) it's going to take a bit of time to get yourself to an accepting place.

    It may take some discipline to focus on masturbating without porn, and it may be frustrating and somewhat unfulfilling at first, but if you give it time, I think you'll eventually get to a place where it's pretty comfortable and natural. And then you can basically experiment with different types of fantasies in your mind. They don't have to be things you've done, it can be things you imagine doing, people you imagine being with (whether remotely possible or wild fantasies, doesn't really matter.)

    And I think once you do that, the picture will become clearer in your mind.
     
  10. Rupert30

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    Yeah I mean, look, if I’m “closer to the gay side” I actually am cool with that. I would just like to be comfortable with it. Like I just don’t want the thoughts to be distressing to me. This is not the first time I’ve experienced this - I thought about this in my early twenties as well and really tried to give it a shot and it didn’t clear my anxiety the way I hoped it would. Yes my identity - a lot of it feels based around attracting women. Like why do I want money and success - so I can get more girls. But the more I think about it the more I’m like - eh not totally though. Like I’ve said I’ve done things with guys. I’ve never like pretended to be completely straight - I say to people constantly that I’m bisexual cos I don’t want to have anxiety around it. If I do end up liking or wanting to have sex with men no ones gonna give a shit. The only person who cares is me and I don’t even care I just want to be comfortable with shit - I want to WANT to be with men. If that makes sense? So it doesn’t distress me.

    I really do appreciate the advice a lot - it’s just I feel like I already tried a lot of this (the masturbating) in my early twenties and it didn’t work. And trying it now it’s still not working. I don’t get why it’s so difficult, I really don’t get it. This can’t be the normal experience - it feels like there’s a vice in my chest - like I feel a general unease almost all the time the past two months and the only time it goes away is when I’m having sex (I don’t use drugs or alcohol anymore).

    Like, I do try to fantasize situations but I just can’t seem to come up with any that bring me to a certain point. I will keep trying though I just wish there was some other techniques.
     
  11. Chip

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    Well... one thing that would definitely speed it up is therapy. Finding a therapist who will gently but consistently push you to explore and understand your discomfort, and begin to work through it. Try masturbating without porn and just deciding that you're gay. Think about guys, being with guys, and so forth. See where it leads you. Do the same thinking about women. Usually one or the other will give you greater arousal and excitement, and that should help you get a clearer answer.

    And you're also in one of the best places in the country to explore yourself. I don't mean having hookups (though you can do that if it's what seems like it would be helpful to you). I mean checking out meetup.com and finding activities for gay guys that interest you, and trying some of them. Basically, putting yourself around gay guys in a non-hookup environment simply to see how it feels. The best way we desensitize ourselves to things we are uncomfortable with or afraid of is to simply... expose ourselves to them.

    I do think therapy would be a great first place to start, though.
     
  12. Rupert30

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    Thanks, yes I agree with Ny being the best place. I am also a member of meetup, don’t really know what you mean by gay activities. I have plenty of gay friends just in general we usually do the same stuff. Maybe I’ll go to more drag shows or whatever.

    I’m in therapy currently. It’s done nothing for me in this area though - maybe because it’s traditional talk therapy. Maybe I just need a new therapist. This started cropping up fairly recently though so maybe it’s just that I need to give it time (I am pretty impatient I realize). I do like the idea of just “acting as if” I’m gay for awhile. I’ve tried that before but maybe I need to commit harder to it.
     
  13. camillus

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    Maxman, you and I sound a lot alike. I'm 35 and in the process of coming out of a long-term relationship with a woman. I feel like I have to be gay now but I'm having a hard time accepting that because I still like women too and feel like I am going to lose part of myself. My therapist has helped me see that I can come out without losing my sense of self, that I'm just adding to the self I already know.
    I'm also going to start meeting weekly with a "peer counselor" who also had a struggle coming out. Sometimes I get angry with the label "bisexual" because I feel like "what's the point" of being able to be with a woman if I don't feel I can commit to one?? At the end of the day, I just want to be happy, but I know this process is going to take a while.
     
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  14. Love4Ever

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    Hey! I just wanted to chime in as a bi woman. If you want to date a woman have you considered dating another bisexual? She would be able to relate to what you are going through better than a straight girl. And if you want to be a woman you should still be able to do that and have your needs met by a guy if that's what you want. Not all women are looking for monogamy, you could always have an open or poly relationship. Just wanted to point out that there are options that some women would be just fine with, myself included.
     
  15. Rupert30

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    This has just started to get way dark for me. I really can’t accept myself I feel like - it’s freaking me out a bit. It’s like my depression has reached a whole new level - like I’m having a breakdown.

    The thoughts I’m having won’t go away they plague me 24/7 and I’m starting to wonder if this has always been under the surface or what. I really don’t know how to handle it. I started on Prozac only been on for a week but I’m not sure if it’s helping. I slept with this girl last night but didn’t reach orgasm. I analyzed the whole experience I thought to myself the whole time that reaching an orgasm felt effortful, like I have to work for it - when shouldn’t it just happen?

    I had a mental break when I was a teenager due to drug use. This almost feels like a resurgence of that - and I had to check myself into a hospital in 2014 because I found out my girlfriend at the time cheated on me - those are the two “crisis” moments I’ve had. This is feeling like the third.

    I just really, really don’t want to be with men. It feels antithetical to who I am. I don’t know why it does - it just feels like not a want, like I’m being forced to do it. The encounters I have had with men in the past I forced myself and it legitimately felt like I had raped myself. I have little to no fear about the coming out to others process but just for me. I feel like traumatized or something. I’m failing at the no porn thing. I don’t know why I was fine for so long and now these doubts have come back, stronger than ever it feels like. Right before this episode I was obsessing like this over my ex constantly. Now it’s my sexuality. What will it be next? Or is this it, is this the reality I need to accept and get over it. And if it is why the difficulty in accepting this? I’m half afraid after reading many of the topics on here that once I go full force into the same sex thing I will, like Camillus said, lose my attraction to women.

    I never for a second thought I was gay when I was with my ex, but I’m wondering if I was just distracted by all the crazy shit going on in that relationship. I acted out sexually but not with men. This is really a struggle for me - I can’t tell if this is all in my head or if it’s real. And I’m so done with dealing with it.
     
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  16. Rupert30

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    Just to add onto the above. When I was having my first breakdown as a teenager I had to accept that my thoughts weren’t always real - that I couldn’t trust my mind so much. So I don’t know if that’s why it’s been such a struggle for me. All I want is for the anxiety and emotional pain to go away - I am very much considering doing what I did before and finding a dude through ###### and force myself to hook up with him in hopes of alleviating my anxiety.

    I feel like I’m losing my mind. I’ve always prided myself on being exactly who I am all the time - that’s my main trait. I’m comfortable in my skin - I don’t keep secrets or hide parts of myself away. But now it feels like who I am was a total lie.
     
  17. I'm gay

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    Forcing yourself to hook up with a guy from an app for the purpose of "alleviating my anxiety" doesn't seem like a good idea to me. If anything, I think it will just add to your anxiety. Random hookups from the apps might be a way to satisfy sexual urges, and if that's how it's used, then it's a reasonable choice. Since you are still struggling with self acceptance, I would recommend that you work on that aspect before attempting to hook up with guys. The hookup culture is full of guys who are just looking for sex - and so it can be frustrating, unfulfilling, and a big hit to your self esteem. It can easily undo the progress you have made so far. I think self acceptance is the key issue for you.
     
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  18. Rupert30

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    But I’ve made essentially no progress in the first place. I am finding it impossible to believe that I’m gay and accept that. I don’t have a desire to satisfy any sexual urges - I really do not care about the particular person I would hook up with which is why I think that app is the way to go I’m not looking for some fulfilling romance or something and I’m not really concerned about my self esteem in regards to this. The opinions of whoever does not bother me. I just want to feel mentally okay and what I have been doing so far hasn’t worked - it’s just getting worse.
     
  19. Love4Ever

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    I do agree that hooking up with a stranger will not help you feel better. You need to find another outlet for you anxiety. Have you tried fantasizing and masturbating to a same sex fantasy? Have you considered buying a sex toy or something along those lines? There are better options than randomly hooking up with a strange guy you don't know.
     
    #19 Love4Ever, May 22, 2018
    Last edited: May 22, 2018
  20. Rupert30

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    I have tried masturbating without porn - I have tried to create a same sex fantasy in my mind but it never works. I don’t know what I’d do with a sex toy - feel like it needs to be a person so I can gauge what my reactions are to them physically.