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The Wall

Discussion in 'Empty Closets Help and Feedback' started by Paul_UK, Mar 22, 2009.

  1. Martin

    Board Member Admin Team Full Member

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    The system set up in place is what the owners have asked for who got the system approved by lawyers. People can argue about the changes until they're blue in the face, point out flaws, kick and scream or even hold a protest but it won't change anything.

    You can look at any system and find flaws, but there is only so much we can do to make it safe. It essentially lies down to you not to silly and give out personal information to any person who asks for it. We just enforce the security we need to ensure the site isn't at risk of being closed if somebody does put themselves into a dangerous situation. The security is here for members, but the owners are covering their own backs at the same time and so they should. It's not fair they should be liable leagally for another members irresponsible actions.

    If we believe a predator is on the site then they won't get access to PM's. It's a case of somebody proving they are who they say they are, not us proving they aren't. Not only do we do pretty extensive background checks with the information we can access, but a shitload of time is spent monitoring communication. Yep, I could easily miss something, but if members aren't able to look out for themselves then the question then falls on whether PM's should even be allowed.

    You people also have to remember that these rules are not here because of the staff. None of us asked for the excessive workload that got given to us when these changes were introduced, but we went along with it because the alternative was that the site would be closed. If you people really want the restrictions reduced or removed then you're welcome to ask the owners for it, but I guarantee you will try and come here one day to either find the link is inactive, or there is a closed notice by the owners. If the mods and advisors thought there was room for negotiation we would be doing this and not trying to justify a system we hate just as much as you and affects our time even moreso than others. The reason we flip so much about rule violations is because the restrictions are only going to get more severe if we let it continue, and for the sake of seriously crippling the site we come down hard on all behaviour.

    As for the wall jargon, I have no idea what will be happening with it. I'm also busy doing college work to be analysing the Pro's and Cons of it all. The best thing to do to keep it is just carry on as normal and use it as you always would. Nothing is finalised and it would honestly be a waste of your time to try and argue for a compromise that consists of less restrictions. It's not an option the staff have, and the owners will not change it based on what the legal position on it is.
     
  2. Jim1454

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    And this is why we also spend a fair amount of energy watching the forum and requiring people to post and be active there BEFORE they are granted full member status. Until someone demonstrates that they are here for the right reason we won't give them access to private messaging.

    And before you respond, yes, someone could effectively 'pretend' to be someone they aren't to gain access to full membership. But we will - at that point - have done our best to protect the younger member of EC.

    Exactly. We can't possibly monitor every exchange of information that goes through EC - and eliminating the Wall would reduce the amount of data that would require monitoring.
     
  3. The Enigma

    The Enigma Guest

    True. But still, I really like the wall. Both sides have good points. xD So has it already been decided the wall is gone? Would getting more mods solve anything?
     
  4. Lexington

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    Our main problem is that, to put it simply, far too many people aren't taking the warnings seriously, and not using the Wall the way it was meant to. We figured it was a nice compromise to saying "You have to be a full member before you can talk directly to any one person here". But the response seems to be "we'll just use it to pass out our private contact information". And it hasn't been just in a "gee whiz, I didn't know we couldn't do that" sort of way, and it hasn't been just one person. It's happening over and over again, with messages attached proving that the people KNOW it's against the rules, but (to quote but one) "Fuck it - who cares".

    And to answer the now-banned member - WE care. We don't put these obstacles in the way because we enjoy seeing you unable to communicate with new potential friends. We do it because there's a real and possible danger. And if one person chose to say "fuck it" and flaunt the rules, that'd be something we could deal with. But it's happening over and over and over again, in a rather blatant fashion. And not to put too fine a point on it, but this bullshit has to stop. Not in a "let's give you a lecture and then get back to business as usual" sort of way, either. But in a "if it means yanking the wall, then yank the wall we will" sort of way.

    Could getting more mods solve anything? In a sense. But basically, you're asking people to volunteer to sit online and read hundreds of posts to each other looking for violations. I'm not sure people are going to be champing at the bit to do that. And even beyond that, it doesn't address the issue at hand. To extend the metaphor, we don't want to hire more cops - we want the citizens to start obeying the law. Capice?

    Lex
     
    #44 Lexington, Mar 23, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2009
  5. Sexiross

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    please dont remove the wall...i love it..especially because im new and that is the only way to talk to people ...please!....i dont know how to handle not talking to people like me. This site is my outlet for me to be free!!!!!
     
  6. The Enigma

    The Enigma Guest

    Well if it has to do with legal issues, then it'd be wiser to get rid of it. But, it sounds like the decision is already made regardless. So, why waste time? Why not just get rid of it now? There's no use in trying to argue if the staff has already decided.
     
  7. Lexington

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    The staff has NOT already decided. Had we done so, we would've simply eliminated it, and put up a notice explaining why. We don't "want" to get rid of it any more than anyone else does. The purpose of this thread is to try to get some ideas going. What other options are open to us? Your idea of getting more mods was a good one, even if I think it's not one that would work out in the long run...

    Lex
     
  8. Dazed

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    even if there was more Mods people would still post information.
    its not that its too much work for the mods to do now
    its that they shouldnt have to keep reminding people its against the rules to post personal information on there.

    as much as i would hate to see the wall go, its looking like they dont ahve much choice.
    and really posting for 2 weeks in the forum is nothing


    but maybe the wall should be took away for a while
     
  9. Paul_UK

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    As a first move we have increased the default ban period from one week to ONE MONTH. And you will note that it says "at least one month" which means if we think someone is deliberately flouting the rules we can make it longer.

    Whether that is any more of a deterrent remains to be seen...
     
  10. Shevanel

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    That was probably a good idea. I wish I could think of a way to explain my way to solve this problem, because I think it'd work, but it doesn't make sense in my head... so as soon as I figure it out...
     
  11. silas99

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    Mmmm...this is pretty tough. I can imagine how arduous it must be to trawl through everyone's wall messages. I suppose this wouldn't work either, but could you limit wall messages. What I mean is give people a certain number of messages for every hour they are on EC. So say 10 messages every hour. Then you wouldn't have as many to get through. I suppose that defeats the object of the wall, not sure???
     
  12. The Enigma

    The Enigma Guest

    That only helps the mods slow traffick, it doesn't stop them from doing it though.
     
  13. silas99

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    yeah you're right. But in that case the only way to stop it altogether is remove the wall and I think that a lot of members love their wall (especially after reading this thread...I'm not quite so attached to mine). I mean at least reading 100 posts rather than 300 will make a bit of a difference....although I'm just speculating...I actually have no idea?
     
  14. Zac4

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    dont get rid of the wall. it sux not being able to pm anybody as a newbie and to talk to some1 u gotta put it all out there for every1 to see as it is.
    i hardly use the wall but its good its there, hope u can find a way to keep it.
     
  15. Martin

    Board Member Admin Team Full Member

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    I refer ye to thisssss:
     
  16. s5m1

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    EC staff has an incredibly difficult job. We should all thank them for the hours they spend so that we have a place like EC. There are no easy answers to this question. The potential legal liability issue is significant if something happens, not to mention the terrible things that could happen to a member if a predator were able to get to a younger member. No system is foolproof, but that does not mean that steps should not be taken to protect members.

    The real issue here is the incredible lack of respect for other members exhibited by a small minority on EC who flaunt the rules. These rules are here for a reason. They are spelled out clearly and specifically. Those who violate them are responsible for the potential loss of the Wall, or the loss of EC entirely. If you are intentionally violating the rules of EC, it is time to stop it. If you know of someone who is violating the rules, do not just accept it. We all should call out other members who violate the rules. If someone posts information that is not permitted on your Wall, let them know they are not allowed to do that and report it. If we expect the staff and owners of EC to allow something like the Wall, we have to be responsible enough to follow the rules and self-police others who are not.
     
  17. Just Adam

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    my wall keeps telling me ive an unread wall message i cant find it :S
     
  18. Shevanel

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    *points to the Notification Bug thread in this section of the forum* This sorta thing belongs there
     
  19. Just Adam

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    i found that after lol i didnt know it was a bug i thought id just gone mad :S
     
  20. Kenko

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    Can the <blink> HTML tag be implemented in the warning?