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Only gay when horny

Discussion in 'Sexual Orientation' started by blagh, Sep 22, 2019.

  1. blagh

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    I'm identifying as a bisexual male right now, but I'm really doubting it.

    I only fancy messing with guys when I'm horny, drunk or when I wake up first thing in the morning. The moment I'm done, it all goes away - and when I do, and I find a quiet moment, I dream about being with a girl, completely unprompted and without any conscious thought.

    I don't find myself fancying guys in the street - although I can be struck by how handsome someone is, or how confident they walk, or their tree-trunk legs, it's not the same level of intensity that a girl's soft, radiant skin will create in me. Guys don't make me go all wobbly the way girls do.

    I didn't have any of those sorts of intense infatuations with guys when I was young - it was always girls. If I was infatuated with a guy, it was because I thought they were cool and I liked them as a friend. My attractions to girls weren't abstracted or distant or fake - it was wanting to be around that fire that girls created in me when they were next to me, or when I was holding their hand, or when they were kissing me. Guys simply don't replicate those feelings for me.

    Are these all signs of denial? I'm starting to suspect that people are either just gay or straight, and that everything in between is just some kind of bizarre, horny extra-curricular activity (not to imply that it's invalid or wrong).

    For those of you who went through this process, did that fire ever emerge with the same sex?
     
  2. Chip

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    Nobody but you can know for sure, but my guess is that there's a fierce resistance/denial at the conscious level that's getting in the way of acceptance of the core same-sex attraction. It's actually quite common for guys in the early stages of self-acceptance and coming out to be super horny for same-sex experiences, only to be completely disgusted and grossed out after orgasm.

    The perplexing part is the dreaming about girls. This could indicate bisexuality, or it could also indicate conscious mind's attempt to push away the gay thoughts.

    Contrary to the common narrative, there are lots of people who go through childhood and adolescence blissfully unaware they're gay or bi, only to have it all come crashing through at some point later on. Twenties and thirties are common, but some people literally remain in fierce self-denial into their 40s or 50s or later. What's interesting is that usually, once they break past denial, they can usually look back at their earlier years and realize that, in fact, there were a lot of signs or indicators in retrospect, but they were oblivious to them.
     
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  3. blagh

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    Thanks, Chip.

    Nothing about the dreaming about girls feels conscious - it just bubbles up on its own. The best I could probably guess is that maybe it's learned, and it's almost like muscle memory almost? But that's a massive shot in the dark.

    I know I'm attracted to girls / women physically. I'm not all that emotionally invested in being in a relationship with a woman, mainly because I don't want that complication in my life - nor am I really interested in sex with women, because I don't feel the need to see what's there or proove it to myself.

    It's tough - is it the idea of having sex with men that's fascinating me, or am I actually, honestly attracted? And how do I know whether I'm repressing / in denial, or I'm just running away with my stupid imagination?

    I've tried out all three labels:

    - calling myself straight doesn't seem to sit well. I'm always checking out ###### out of curiosity in bed, I like speaking with guys online and swapping pictures. The other day I noticed a handsome guy at the gym laughing and having a good time, and in an unguarded moment there was a physical urge (not thought, but a physical urgency) to walk up and kiss him on the lips.
    - calling myself gay doesn't sit at all, due to my attraction to women that I simply can't deny. Plus I don't feel about guys the same way I feel about girls.
    - calling myself bisexual doesn't sit, because I feel like somehow my "attractions" to men simply don't count, as they're not true attractions (due to it not being the same feeling as I get around women/girls), and that they're something else, but I'm not sure what.

    Honestly, who the hell knows?! Sometimes I think I just enjoy confusing myself...
     
  4. Joolz66

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    "t's actually quite common for guys in the early stages of self-acceptance and coming out to be super horny for same-sex experiences, only to be completely disgusted and grossed out after orgasm."

    That's me, when I first had gay sex I wanted to run after orgasm. I now have a patient lover but is is still an issue after orgasm...but I'm learning slowly to accept.
     
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  5. out2019

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    According to Joe Kort, a gay therapist who has written a lot of books that help gay men, it is possible for a straight guy to have gay sex:
    https://www.huffpost.com/entry/why-...-to-other-men_b_3670740?utm_hp_ref=gay-voices

    Anything fit?
    Many gays disagree with Kort and say that stuff like this prevents acceptance (oh i am not gay, I just have a father issue) but I think the 'acting out' of childhood sex abuse might have some validity.

    For me, personally, I looked at the list and realized that I was doing just that, searching for a reason to deny being gay. I might have some of those issues, but thinking about being with a guy romantically is 100x more intense than what I think about women and that ONLY started to happen when I started to accept that I was gay.

    That said, I have a lot of similarities to you:

    I haven't had gay sex yet (I chickened out drunk a few times a decade ago) but yes after masturbating I feel this way - and the gay thoughts only come in high horny states, lower level horny I fantasize about women.
    But prior to ejaculating during gay sex, I achingly wish that I could just keep my attraction to men.

    Same. No sexual arousal no wow, but when I see beautiful woman I get that all over tingle in my body more than just sexual.

    same
    Yes, I might try to say I am straight, but bi just doesn't seem right.
    same.
    When I first came here people suggested looking into the mirror and said "I am gay" . When I did it I wasn't prepared for the beautiful rush of warm emotions... how can just looking at myself and saying three words create such a firestorm of emotion?
     
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  6. blagh

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    It still blows me away that you identify with everything that I'm saying, but still consider yourself gay.

    I'm currently struggling with the fact I know, deep down, that I don't want to be gay. Perhaps that's blocking me and I need to work on being comfortable with the possibility that I'm gay. I've tried the mirror technique, to no avail.
     
  7. out2019

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    Am I "100%" gay? No. few people are...but my fantasies are 100X intense about men and come naturally. As I mentioned on another post, once I started accepting it and posting here , the romantic fantasies flowed too they are way more intimate and natural then my m/f ones which quickly faded.
    I am not at the point of 'maybe it's all in my head' ...

    I am still struggling with coming out and I go through periods of denial but each time it swings back to gay I am a little bit more out..
    It actually is helping me to acknowledge I don't want to be gay - because that helps point out my denial.
    It could be you're bi or a straight guy with a gay fetish (see link) I tried to convince myself of that but the mirror was pretty hard to deny! Not saying you're me .. it could very well be have a different path...
     
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  8. out2019

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    The mirror and the rush of emotions just saying 'I am gay' was unlike anything I experienced in my life. I can still do it - over a year later and get the same feeling.
    EVEN with that though I have a ton of denial and baggage....
    and if I masturbate now I might go back into denial/closet.
    But I am slowly beginning to realize that the ONLY way I will ever experience true romantic and sexual intimacy is with a man. Not any man- I don't want to be sex addict/hook up -but when I really let myself just naturally think about it, it's what I want emotionally and sexually...
     
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  9. out2019

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    You might want to read up Joe Kort's site http://www.joekort.com/
    and his articles on pys today and huff post.

    Accepting being gay is not a passive act- so in that sense it's a choice - I have to actively dismiss some theories or reasons for my sexual desires - on the other hand during low sex drive times, I admit I feel pretty hetero -- to get through those times takes a leap of faith - which I have not had so far...
    That said I still try to keep an open mind so for example if you found another answer or solution, I'd be open to that.
     
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  10. Chip

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    I have a lot of respect for Joe Kort, and I've spent some time with him talking about these issues. I agree with most of what he says, but I don't agree with the business about straight men liking gay sex and still being straight. Joe's work and perceptions are based on his clinical experience, which is certainly valuable, but sometimes doesn't generalize with what we know.

    At a certain point, discussions like these start to really muddy the waters of what any label means. If having sex with a guy, and liking it, and wanting to do it again, and feeling connection to the guy doesn't mean one has same-sex attraction or that one is gay, then we need to look at what *does* mean that, because the meanings are essentially interchangeable.

    This business of unrecognized labels, straight guys who love gay sex, and this sort of thing have a tendency to do nothing other than fueling uncertainty and confusion among people who are having difficulty accepting themselves. It doesn't do anyone a service, and we've seen that here repeatedly... people who previously adopted the unrecognized labels promoted by a small-but-vocal contingent with no data or study or broad acceptance to support them, coming back months or years later frustrated that they lost so much time being stuck in a "neverland" of uncertainty, masked by labels that have no solid basis on which to ground them.

    Everyone is free to label him or herself however s/he wishes. What's important from our (ECCS) perspective as a nonprofit public charity focused on accurate education is that people get the best, most accurate, evidence-based information on which to base their decisions.

    As I said, I have a lot of respect for Dr. Kort, and I quote him on a number of things. This is one place where I think he's missed the mark.
     
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  11. out2019

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    I am someone who tried just about every form of denial possible - and I as I mentioned above I started to go through the list and realized that at the core of it, I was still gay even if I had some of those issues.

    Yeah, at some point it is almost a Monty Python sketch.. "Well, so what if I like to give blow jobs and love looking at men's asses, that doesn't mean I am gay".

    I agree with you on the straight men who have gay sex -but I do thing there is some wiggle room for men who had childhood sex trauma from an older adult male who are acting out and possibly sexualizing other needs. .. but i would say, in my non clinical personal experience :slight_smile: that's about as likely as a full blown alcoholic who could return to normal drinking for the other 90% of us, getting past excuses and to acceptance information like this can hinder progress. I put it out there though because I think he is a legitimate resource and its important to have a 'counter theory' because a lot of times that can bring clarification for some people .
     
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  12. JaymzR1968

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    This really speaks to me on a personal level - I was one of those who never even considered that I was gay or bi until, as you said it “came crashing through later in life”. I grew up in a very conservative military church going family, I ended up spending a career in the military myself and was (as I guess the stereotypes go) very masculine and “straight acting” and never felt any type of sexual attraction towards men. It wasn’t until I was 34 that I experienced a small taste of sex with men when I was still married to a woman. Long story short, we played with others a couple times to spice things up and one things led to another...and here I am today at age 50 and happily gay and enjoying life to the fullest.

    So, my response to you is to not over think it. We can over analyze things and make ourselves even more confused. Being BI is real and whether you are that or gay, you’ll find that answer in yourself when the time is right. But NEVER think poorly of yourself and that there is anything wrong with you.
     
    #12 JaymzR1968, Sep 22, 2019
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  13. Chip

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    The issue of men with a history of childhood sexual abuse is a different animal entirely. Sexual abuse can cause a lot of confusion. It doesn't fundamentally change underlying orientation, but it can really confuse what someone things they want, what they value in terms of connection, and a number of other factors.

    It's also a mess because many gay men that were sexually abused as children have that much more difficulty coming to terms with and accepting that they're gay, because they (erroneously) convince themselves that the abuse made them gay. I've seen some discussion communities for male abuse survivors where men will on the one hand describe strong erotic/sexual attraction to men, zero attraction for women, and swear they aren't gay, but are instead "men who enjoy sex with men" or "men with unwanted same sex attraction". (For the record, "men with unwanted same-sex attraction" describes every gay man before he was ready to come out.) Unfortunately, many of these folks remain stuck in their trauma, and their denial, sometimes for decades. And that's really sad.
     
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  14. cjmiller

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    I felt exactly the same, never found men attractive until I was horny and want gay sex. It wasn't until I come out to myself as gay that I have really started to look a men closer and the urges I've had for women has almost dissipated. I really believe it was denial I was going through that stopped my brain from noticing same sex. Good luck
     
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  15. blagh

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    It's interesting to hear people who self-identify as gay relate to what I'm posting. But when I try to self-apply the label "gay", it just doesn't seem to fit. My physical attraction to women feels too real, and has my whole life, whereas any attraction I have to men feels...well, not.

    Maybe I'm in denial, maybe I'm just astonishingly, overwhelmingly blind to it...in which case, what do I do to remove the veil?
     
  16. cjmiller

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    I think labels are just labels and what you feel is yours. Don't try to put yourself in a box. Meet people you are attracted to and let nature take its course.
     
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  17. SiegeWolf7

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    Hi Im Siege Nice to meet you!
     
  18. Chip

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    It's probably a bit of both. One thing you can try is to make a decision and say "ok, Im going to accept, for the mment, that I'm gay." For the next week or something, pretend that you have accepted the idea. Go out and look at guys on the street. Notice their bodies. Masturbate and think of guys, and after you ejaculate, remind yourself that it's OK to be attracted to guys. Envision yourself with a guy. And see how all of that sits after a few days. That usually gives a pretty clear picture and helps crack the shell of denial, if there is one.
     
  19. SiegeWolf7

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    Hello Chip my name is Siege how has your day been so far?
     
  20. SiegeWolf7

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    That is very interesting because I'm bisexual and I dont know why but I have always been treated as a outcast in the LGBTQ community and I need some friends...