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Former lurker wants to say his piece

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by razorsharp, May 10, 2014.

  1. biAnnika

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    Yeah, actually I'm learning a lot about you too, because of the contrast with the OP. Thanks for engaging.
     
  2. razorsharp

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    I think the obvious difference between myself and others in this forum is that I'm not afraid to say how I feel about homosexuality. I think there are many others on here who deep down are not comfortable with homosexuality but are afraid to admit it (ironically, it's a similar fear to admitting being gay). Most people don't choose to have SSA but we can choose whether or not to embrace them. I've chosen the latter and just as much as it is someone's choice to become a practicing homosexual, my choice of not doing so should be understood and respected. Some people (minority if you look around the world) like homosexuality, I disagree with it based on sound reasoning.
     
  3. Benway

    Benway Guest

    Bro, no.

    While you may be right that some here aren't comfortable with homosexuality, you're kind of going about pontificating that it's a sin based on some divine interpretation. While I do admit that there are some people for whom being homosexual is a choice (and they're never the kind of person anyone, heterosexual or homosexual wants to hang out with) you seem to hold on to this idea that externalizing your own internal prejudices is going to make it better.

    Hell, we're all a little bit prejudiced, we're all a little bit racist, we're all even a little bit homophobic-- the first time I walked into a gay bar I felt homophobic. You, however are either trying to play people on this forum with something you're making up as you go along in an attempt to rile people up or you're so incredibly dense that you've dipped into a gay community forum in hopes of finding people who support Exodus International.

    And I'll admit, we're not so different, you and I, but you're angry. You may not seem it, you may not even realize it, but you're angry about something. You gotta let that shit go, man. If you want to go around thinking homosexuality is a scourge of the world I can't stop you, but don't come onto an openly gay forum and start preaching because you're going to be disagreed with, you're going to be argued with and you're going to be shunned because you're basing your "sound reasoning" on the archaic writings of loin-cloth toting proto-rabbis who died six thousand years ago.
     
  4. PatrickUK

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    The whole purpose of this forum is to help people come to a point of acceptance and self respect and I think the overwhelming majority of members join because they want to arrive at that point, some day. So whilst you are entitled to your opinion about homosexuality, you are going to get little mileage from us if your purpose is self denial. I'm sorry, but that's just how it is here.

    I dislike the term practising homosexual, but I will concede that we make a kind of choice to practice (by being sexually active). Even so, I would suggest to you that it is incredibly hard to deny your sexual desires over the long term... many 'good' men have tried. You can suppress it and refuse to act upon your feelings for a while, you can go into chatrooms to bring some kind of relief, you can even dabble with pointless or dangerous conversion therapy, if you are so unwise, but I truly believe the pressure will tell in the end. You can't marry it away either. It's for all of these reasons that I urge people to journey towards self acceptance. I believe it's the only healthy way.
     
    #164 PatrickUK, Nov 29, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2014
  5. OGS

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    Wow, I can't believe I never noticed this thread before. Kind of wish I never had to be honest, although it was a fascinating read--and it makes me feel more kindly toward Benway (so that's definitely worth the read).

    As far as the OP goes--I have no argument with most of what you say. You have the right to be as unhappy as you want to be. You have the right to never experience true love as I believe you were created to do. You have the right to live a life of fundamental deceit, hiding yourself from everyone who might care for you. You have the right to lead as small and meaningless and miserable of a life as you would like. You even have the right to congratulate yourself for your honesty and courage (although from where I sit this is beyond the pale perverse).

    You do not have the right to drag some poor unsuspecting woman--especially someone who you would ostensibly care about--into the pit with you. Your question:

    Anyone could and should ask more from you--especially a wife. She could expect someone who is honest with those around him--especially her. She could expect someone who loves her in the way she loves him. She could expect someone who would not willfully ruin her life because he is too small and cowardly to simply live the misery he has chosen alone.
     
  6. Benway

    Benway Guest

    One of the things I'm slowly learning lately that it's not my sexuality (or, in the OP's case, SSA, a term I'll admit I've used in the past) that's my enemy-- it's my anxiety. Anxiety is a thief and it's robbed me of countless experiences.

    Now, in the OP's case, I'm ruling out the possibility that he's serious, but the more I look at his syntax and the context he uses language in the more I'm inclined to believe he came here with an agenda, whether it's a "serious" one, (that is to say, a missionary one) or a not so serious agenda (coming here to cause trouble for his own amusement) I cannot say. He's obviously not a big fan of the gay community, which is the most damning piece of evidence for me that he's one of the latter.

    I joined this site to get feedback from people without prior prejudices, religious or political agendas and thus far it's working- slowly but surely. However you don't just walk into a gay bar wearing an Exodus International t-shirt-- you just don't do it.

    That said, the aberration isn't homosexuality itself, it's anxiety or depression or anger. And like I said, you need to let that shit go, no matter how hard it is to do.
     
  7. biAnnika

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    *more hugs*

    You've found it, my friend. Anxiety is the enemy. I'm not saying the fight is over...but from that realization, the struggle is no longer uphill. Of course it's been said to you before...the important thing is that this time, *you* found it; *you're* the one saying it.
     
  8. OnTheHighway

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    This is probably the best explanation I have yet to come across (and, boy, it took a lot of reading through this thread to get here).

    ---------- Post added 29th Nov 2014 at 11:47 PM ----------

    I just took the time to read this entire thread, and Benway, I think you hit the nail in the head with razorsharp. To go a step further, seems razors harp is possibly having a laugh at everyone's expense.
     
    #168 OnTheHighway, Nov 29, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2014
  9. biAnnika

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    Could be...though "sound reasoning" had me in stitches, so it's at least mutual.
     
  10. razorsharp

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    I think some of you are being unfair and childish now. I came here for advice, and got some. Because you've discovered that my views are different to the majority of yours you've started attacking me. I thought this was a help site for people struggling (like me). Some of you would certainly not make good counsellors, I can tell you that.
     
  11. Wildside

    Wildside Guest

    I can only speak for myself, but I definitely have to disagree with you. I am not at all afraid to say how I feel about being GAY (not SSA); and that is that I am very happy for the way that God made me, very grateful. PLEASE don't assume things about other people. If you hate being gay, OK, I understand that is where you're at. But don't think that I'm "afraid to admit being admit being uncomfortable with homosexuality [sic]". I do understand and respect your choice to not become a "practicing homosexual" but I also ask you to understand and accept my choice to celebrate being gay! :kiss:
     
  12. greatwhale

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    Hmmm..."practicing homosexual"...is there a manual somewhere?

    Maybe there's a course one could take, like "Homosexuality in the Modern Era", or "A Practicum on Bottoming", or "How to be a Cunning Linguist"... Is there a professional homosexual accrediting organization?

    Indeed, does one need a license to practice homosexuality? Would it need to be renewed on an annual basis, with the need to pass some kind of a test or some such?

    ---------- Post added 29th Nov 2014 at 07:51 PM ----------

    Hey RS,

    Your views are not only different, they are anathema to the entire purpose of this site. If you are exercising your right to say what it is you feel, we have no objection to that, but don't expect us not to respond in any way sympathetic to what you are saying. We also have the right to express our feelings about what is, to most of us, deeply offensive.

    As I told you earlier, you are dealing with something that you do not like about yourself, this can't be easy, I know. But we have told you every which way from backwards to forwards that involving a woman in your struggle will not end well for either of you, not to mention any children that might be born of your relationship.

    If you are seeking help in justifying this course of action, I'm afraid you won't find it here. If you are seeking help to better understand yourself, we are here for you.
     
  13. OnTheHighway

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    :roflmao:

    ---------- Post added 30th Nov 2014 at 01:13 AM ----------

    [/COLOR]
    Amen :bang:
     
  14. biAnnika

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    We do not pretend to be counselors, dear. You, on the other hand, pretend to be a community member here for help, while accusing us of denying our own feelings about homosexuality...like you somehow know how we feel about ourselves and others better than we do. That isn't the tone taken by one who considers himself a community member looking for help from the community that has genuinely tried to offer you help. It sounds like someone jerking our chain.

    If this is a serious issue for you, and not just an opportunity to jerk chains for whatever reason, then I suggest you seek a real counselor.
     
  15. Wildside

    Wildside Guest

    here's what a "counselor," a licensed psychiatrist told me, WS: "we're as sick as our secrets." and I will add that there is no worse secret than the one that you keep from yourself.
     
  16. Aldrick

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    I would argue that you are not basing your judgement on sound reasoning.

    Here is the reality of your situation: You are a homosexual. You are romantically and sexually attracted to other men. This is your nature. Nothing you can say, do, or believe will change this reality about you. It is entirely up to you whether or not you want to act on your feelings, but whether or not you become the worlds biggest whore or remain celebate the rest of your life you will never be more or less a homosexual than you are today.

    There certainly are others here on EC who are struggling with their sexuality. That is why they are here, and the same is true about their sexuality as it is true about yours. You are what you are, whether you like it or not, it is the way nature spit you out into this world, and you are going to be this way until the day that you draw your last breath.

    This leaves you with a choice: You can either choose to live your life miserably, as you are living it now, or you can choose a different path. If you want to keep doing more of the same, then I have to ask you: What are you expecting from the people here? No one here wants to see you suffer, and you are clearly suffering. So, you have to make a decision on what you want, and then ask for it.
     
  17. Benway

    Benway Guest

    No, you see, you're the one who came into a an openly gay forum and started preaching the word of a god that doesn't exist. You're the one who promoted Richard Cohen, who is gay even by my standards, you're the one evangelizing and getting all up in arms about your own religious insecurities. And now you've got the balls to say that the people you came in here trying to change are trying to change you? No, dude. I see your angle.
     
  18. razorsharp

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    Thanks Aldrick. You seem to be one of the few who understand my point, probably because you come from a similar background to myself.

    As I'm sure you all understand, I don't have anyone to talk to about this problem. Therefore I rely on forums such as this one. Otherwise i'm pretty much on my own in what is a difficult situation.

    I would have thought that this forum is non-discriminatory more than it is 'openly gay'. I thought that it's remit was to help people who are struggling with their attractions, such as myself. If i'm mistaken and you guys feel that I have come to the wrong forum, then please tell me so that I won't bother posting here anymore.

    I have got answers to the original questions that I asked on my post a few days ago, so i'm happy with the feedback (although I admit I was hoping for different takes on the matter). I didn't come here to upset people or get into arguments, which is what is starting to happen now.
     
    #178 razorsharp, Nov 30, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2014
  19. biAnnika

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    Razor, you were fine (tenuous at times, but at least within bounds to me), and received solid if difficult advice and good intentions and understanding from us, until this little unprovoked gem of a post hit the board:

    This is sheer provocation, not self exploration, not an attempt to grapple with your issues. This is putting yourself and your views (which are not based on reasoning, but on religious bias) above the rest of us. I can't imagine what, other than provocation and proselytization, you could have meant by posting this. Basically, it's a statement that it is obvious how in denial we are about *our* feelings around this topic.

    Now you dare to play the victim and accuse us of not being supportive enough. I strongly suggest you make up your mind whether you're a troll or whether you want our help, because playing for both isn't working.
     
  20. Benway

    Benway Guest

    That's fine with me. Where's Chip? Or any mod, get somebody to lock this.