Experimenting - how do I help my son open up

I think we all understood that you were well-intentioned with your thought of an app, we were all just giving our own personal reactions to "What if our parents had done this to us?" I know that for me, apps like those are always blaring to me because of how much I value personal privacy and respect. There are a lot of parents that think of using these apps, and almost always it's with a good intention, they just don't always consider how doing that impacts a relationships with their kids. The fact that you were able to take feedback and look introspectively at that is wonderful.

Apps that monitor can be used for safety, of course, and that's a crucial role if something bad were to happen, but your son seems like a good kid and not one to get into trouble, at least from what we've been able to tell.

 

You are his parent but he is not your puppet - anymore. It's time to start cutting the puppeteers strings.

Ya I learned to walk, now I'm apt to get hit by a car when I cross streets.

Explore and discover is part of life. I'd invite your son to tell you where he is going to be at. Him telling you invokes trust and respect. Invite him to tell you who he is going to be with. You have to "show him" you trust him. You have to show him, he's going to make mistakes, and when he needs help, he can contact you. Thats the kind of trust you want to build.

 

MamaIcePup,
Thanks for being a loving parent.
My kids are adults now, but when they were kids we told them we might check their phones. We did so only rarely. One time we found a string of texts from an adult, not crossing a line but it felt... questionable? We let the adult know we had seen the texts, and they stopped. Maybe we overstepped in the eyes of some here on EC, but I think we halted what might have been early grooming behavior, and I'm not sorry about that! The other thing we did was tell our kids they could share anything with us, even if they were embarrassed or it broke a rule, that we'd listen and love them.

 

MarmalcePup, you fail to see that communication is an iterative process. Understanding is refined as the process continues.

I think a very good goal for you would be to get "the dad" on board with who your son truly is.

Thanks for coming to ECs and sharing your thoughts.

 

No, see, I'm pretty sure everyone agrees with what you did, no one here would see that as overstepping. You encountered a potentially dangerous situation and shut that down real quick. That's great.

However, for all intents and purposes, her son seems like a good kid from the various posts most of us have read. That's why we oppose monitoring and controlling. Now, if he had been acting shady and sneaking out and meeting strange men, we would agree to monitoring and apps.

If there is a clear cause to be concerned, we all should support controlling parenting.

Those of us, at least me, that have been responding have been the ones that grew up with this looming risk of our parents monitoring our every move. You're a parent. Your kids are adults. You didn't grow up with the threat of monitoring apps and whatnot. When I was closeted, I was terrified of any of my family using any of my things in fear that they would find something out (not that I was doing anything bad, I just wanted my secrets).

If you're suggesting she out her son to his dad, that's a solid no. Like, the most solid of no's.

Coming out is a very personal experience and that should be something he does on his own. His mom should not come out for him.

 

I shouldn't but I'm going to. May I ask why it (the text messages) felt questionable?

What is grooming behavior?

People (some) here in The States think "I'm to friendly". I can see hesitation as they interact with me. Having traveled the world extensively, I thankfully acquired, reacquired the skill of being human towards others. What does travel the world extensively mean? I hitch hiked quite a bit (boy do I have stores about these times), took local trains and buses, stayed with local people when ever possible. I did not travel via tourist sight seeing companies. To me the real unforeseen joy of international travel was/is getting to know local people.

So I wonder am I perceived as a groomer here in The States? Looking back at The States from outside The States, I can clearly see to much paranoia in American Society. One is more likely to be molested by a Catholic priest than anything else, and how likely is that? There are a lot of very good, hard working Catholic priest out there, so molestation by a priest is very RARE.

I personally think the paranoia is very sad. I actually theorize it may be a cause for some of the sadness in American youth.

 

My mother always wanted to me to "open up" to her and was quite prying. I am naturally introverted (and I don't think she fully grasped that) so this caused a lot of arguments between us when I was growing up. I lived in a remote location, so it wasn't just a case of walking to a friends house or catching the bus to get some space. Being both introverted and closeted, my mothers "good intentions" actually served to knock down my self confidence until one day I just gave up and stopped fighting my corner,

I later realised as a young adult that my mother was suffering from both personality issues/codependency and alcoholism as a result of a distant/dysfunctional relationship with parental/authority figures in her life when she was growing up, essentiall she ended up passing the buck of dysfunction from her own childhood/adolescence onto me. It's an intergenerational problem. Obviously that has manifested differently in me. I also realised that her wanting to be my "friend" and have me "open up" to her was actually something called 'enmeshment' (a form of codependent dysfunction.) It's like she wouldn't let me develop proper personal boundaries. It made me feel powerless and like I had no control over anything in my own life, like nothing was really mine.

I'm nearly 28 still living at home, I have no friends. I've dealt with anxiety for as long as I can remember and moderate to severe depression for well over a decade now. I've cut myself off from the world because I couldn't juggle the responsibilities and pressures of growing up and my mother's paranoia at the same time. Once upon a time I had friends and I had opportunities but I just feel overwhelmed by everything now. I don't hold much hope for my future.

I'm not saying you're that bad at all, but you really don't want him to end up like me, do you?

 

Having said all that I don't hold anyone else accountable for how my life turned out. Ultimately is was my responsibility and my failing.

 

The thing is, you can’t really get him “on board” really without outing your son to him. Getting him on board means telling him everything about your son. I’m not sure if you can honestly tell things about your son to his dad without talking about him being gay. The things you would be telling him are rooted in him being gay, that can’t be easily detached.

 

Not in any given order
a) Let your son set his own course.
b) Young adults love the new feeling of independence. When they enter "explore and discover" they want independence.
c) Become the "catcher" when they fall down. Help them back up. Send them on their way, walk beside them for ~10% of the time.
d) Substantially reinforce values which is something all parents should do from day one.

Seems to me this barrier was set built long ago. So how to tear it down? You need to work on your husband. Go to a gay themed movie then sit down and talk to your husband about this. Go to other types of movies, then talk about the movie. This may tell you where he is coming from.

Second find out why your husband is so closed off. It's like fadestar says, (not exact quote) behavior is passed onto the next generation and can manifest in different ways. My guess is your husband has had some form of trauma in the past or never learned how to be warm towards people. How can I make this bold assertion? Simple actually. My dad was emotionless towards all his kids. So I can say I've had OJT - on the job training. Secretly read the book Coming out of Shame. There are so many sections in this book that address exactly what you are facing.

Join a pro acceptance church that supports all people, meet friends from said church and start coffee shop conversations with said friends. Or maybe the church has abdicate groups, to support a cause. Join that group. Unitarians and some Lutheran as well as others are good places to start. Avoid churches that champion control and domination. There may even be a young adult group in the church for your son. (being a member of this type of group would be a very positive environment to grow.)

Me. How can I make all these suggestions? Fortunately I've acquired the skill (to some degree) of observation and reflection. One of my favorite things to do is go up to the Grand Canyon (I live in AZ, the Grand Canyon state) and hike a bit and people watch - mainly summer months. I see European dads hug their teen sons quite a bit. I see many peoples of the world be very close to family members. When I hitch hike back to my car after a long day hike along the rim, it's Europeans who pick me up and take me back to where I've started. Sometimes I have dinner with these people, we talk and enjoy each others company so much. I've never had Americans pick me up, ever. This tells me a lot. So why is this important? Americans miss so much by being so afraid of other people. This way of living permeates into their way of life, they become cold and do not connect well with others. They inadvertently erect walls around themselves without knowing it. Sometimes this wall building process channels into wall building between family members.

Few. See what morning coffee does!

Good luck[/QUOTE]

 

Concerning this matter stated in this thread. I would do a general search on ECs and look for blogs and previous post on this subject. There is a lot of very good info on this sight and I do not think your son, father, your situation is so unique that others have not written about it already.

Thank you for coming to ECs, giving me the opportunity to learn and reflect and say my say, on this subject. Write on my wall if you have additional questions and concerns. (what we really need now is a virtual online "coffee shop" so we could have deep coffee shop conversations.) There's only so much one can do via written text.

Later