Crimes of Grindelwald discussion thread

I did not really like the movie. Adults are absolutely illogical. For example, Quinnie. She knows that Jacob loves her, why leave him? Why in the film Nicholas Flamel, I did not understand. Why Leta decided to die so stupid is also incomprehensible. In general, for me, this film is a collection of absurd actions of all the characters.

 

As far as I was concerned the jury was still out on Grindelwald until he said he hated Paris. What kind of monster doesn't love Paris? Seriously I quite enjoyed the movie.

 

I agree with what you said but all the same I must say that I was disapointed by this movie. Being a huge potterhead, I found it most delightful to dive back into the wonderful world of harry potter and enjoyed seeing/ discovering the past of certain characters. Sadly the most delightful moments, where we saw hogwarts or discovered an interesting fact about someone, seemed to come out of nowhere and added to the feeling of « too much, too fast, too little time to develop the idea »
While I know why the movie left so many possibilities for development, I found the movie and story disapointing compared to the first fantastic beasts which I really enjoyed. The first movie gave many facts about how the whole wizarding world in America goes, the different beasts and ended in a way that left ppl wanting more without forcing them to watch a second movie in order to reach an acceptable ending.
The whole second movie gave me the same feeling as infinity war: how are they going to give an ending to all these open story plots in an hour? WTF? Wait what? How did ut end like that? It can’t end like that!
Hence you need to watch the sequel in order to reach an end which screams money machine.
Plus I didn’t feel as thrilled, exhilarated and amazed as i did when watching the first one (and if anyone has seen it « bohemian rhadpody »)
Also I was upset about how dumbeldore was represented (actor and « gayness »)
But in the end no matter how much I criticised this movie, I was so glad to have seen it, I will watch the next one and will rewatch this one. Harry potter is and will always be my all time favorite book and movie.

 

I actually consider Dumbledore's gayness there but very subtle. I mean, this isn't a love story between Dumbledore and Grindelwald. But you can hear the emotion in Dumbledore's voice: "We were closer than brothers." And Grindelwald appears for Dumbledore in the Mirror of Erised...indicating that Grindelwald is what Dumbledore desires most. Not vanquishing him...him. If Dumbledore's greatest desire was taking down Grindelwald, that's what would appear but it's not. He just sees Grindelwald and the memory of their blood pact. He loves him, but he knows that it's unrequited and nothing will ever become of his love.

The McGonagall plot hole still bugs me, I'm not going to lie. She's not even supposed to be born yet. And Dumbledore canonically taught transfiguration, not DADA.

I will admit I geeked out hardcore when there was the Eulalie Hicks cameo with Flamel. I think I was the only one in my theatre who knew who she was.

The Zouwu is adorable and I would love it if Newt took the Thunderbird route with her and took her home to China at some point. Not FB3 but maybe FB4?

Poor Antonio the Chupacabra. He deserved much better. I wish Newt could have saved him.

More beasts please. The fact that the first wizarding war was global means future movies will be more likely to explore other countries and therefore more beasts. So more beasts. At Newt's heart he is a magizoologist.

I'm curious as to when we're going to get the big time jump. Crimes took place in 1927 and FB5 will take place in 1945 (the year Dumbledore took down Grindelwald). That's an 18 year time jump somewhere along the line.

I enjoy knowing that Tina and Newt will end up together. I wasn't a huge fan of Tina here as in FB1, but she starts to warm to Newt again by the end.

The Newt/Theseus hug was amazing. It showed so much about Newt, being a person who hates hugs and his brother loving them and knowing that his brother was hurting and a hug would help. I hope for a greater exploration of Newt and Theseus' relationship than Tina and Newt, honestly.

Queenie broke my heart. She has such good intentions, she's just in a place where she's so lost. She knows what she wants and truly believes Grindelwald can give that to her...hence how she was able to get through his fire. She's a huge player in the game, being a Legilimens and could definitely see her not swapping back until the end of FB3 or FB4, honestly.

Who is Credence? I'm sorry, but Grindelwald isn't the most trustworthy fellow in the world. He's manipulative. I feel like the boat scene where the swap between him and baby Corvus will be revisited. We briefly saw Credence's birth mother and she had to have been a witch. Maybe a woman Dumbledore's father had an affair with? But how would Grindelwald even know this? Credence was able to use a wand...but the magic was still chaotic, which to me says that his Obscurus is still there.

When does Nagini turn permanently and what happens to her? She seems so nice and kind and has control when in her snake form. Does an event make her darker? Does Voldemort? How does she get to be so old?? (By the time of her death, she is in her 90s, assuming Nagini was born in the early 1900s.)

 

I believe I read somewhere (I don't remember if it was by J.K. or theory) that he saw Ariana in '91. However, if it was theory, it's very possible he could have seen Grindelwald. My guess is though that Dumbledore being Dumbledore, he may believe that Grindelwald can still be changed at this point. He's done horrific things but he hasn't done the worst yet. By '45, Dumbledore steps in and takes down Grindelwald for the greater good.

My guess lies in he desired Grindelwald and that his deepest desire changes after the imprisonment.

I considered it being her mother, but looking at her mother's bio that's unlikely. She married a muggle around 18 and never told him the truth. Her actions with that one student Leta cursed were very McGonagall-esque as well.

Beauxbatons would have been wonderful to see, especially since Flamel went there, but yeah Paris is a distance from the Pyrenees, it would have been a jump to justify going there.

The end of the movie already has her seem rather comfortable with him at Nurmengard, which was disturbing. My guess is that Queenie will get close with Credence. I saw that a line of the script indicates that an Augurey caws behind Jacob when he's at Newt's house which is...foreboding considering the nature of Augureys. I'm hoping that neither Queenie nor Jacob dies. I've been trying to look and find confirmation that they end up together (like there is for Newt and Tina), but no luck yet.

I'm feeling partial. The phoenix chick "confirms" that he's a Dumbledore but there are branches of family trees. For example, Leta is probably only distantly related to Bellatrix. Radolphus Lestrange isn't directly related to Corvus Lestrange but they're both Lestranges.

Voldemort will be 19 by the end of the series, which means Nagini could possibly join him by then but...who knows.

 

Just checking in to say I saw the movie this Saturday! I loved it. It was much better than the first imho and I would happily see it again. I really loved that this one was more focused on character development and less on constant action. I actually enjoyed the fact there was less emphasis on the beasts themselves, since in all honesty, the beasts are not the main attraction to me. I really loved how Leta and Newt's backstory together was finally shown though I was extremely disappointed she died so quickly. I would have loved to have seen more development. I also though Queenie's storyline was interested and not entirely unexpected. I was irritated the Dumbeldore/Grindewald relationship wasn't more obvious. Though I did think the scene in the mirror of erised was probably the best one in terms of illustrating the true nature of their relationship. I want to see how Nagini becomes evil, and I'm curious if anyone remembers Modesty from the first movie? I thought she had potential to be an interesting character so it would be cool to see her grow up and progress, especially because of her relationship as being almost like a sister to Credence.

 

I think it's interesting that everyone seems upset that the Dumbledore/Grindewald thing wasn't more obvious. My husband and I were both surprised it was as apparent as it was. I also quite liked Jude Law in the role, but then again I quite like Jude Law in general.

 

That's true. I was pleasantly surprised. From the trailers I was a little concerned we wouldn't be getting much. I guess I just wanted more!

 

I'm just SHOOK by the end. But I thought it was good, other than the fact that Dumbledore wasn't dumbledory enough for me.

 

I sort of get the irritation but at the same time, Dumbledore isn't the main focus of the movie. Newt's the main focus so if there's any love story, it should be his and Tina's. Like I totally get the desire to see LGBT Dumbledore on screen...but I feel like it would just be forced in at this point. It's subtle and that's pretty much how it will most likely stay.

I'm conflicted here because the franchise is based around the beasts. And the main character is a magizoologist. Beasts have to be a part of the franchise, there just needs to be a balance. Too little and the initial focus is away, too much and the storyline isn't advancing much.

This franchise has a great opportunity to explore the greater wizarding world...they just need to do it right.

 

To be fair, people change as they age. I know how we know Dumbledore, but this is a very different part of his life. He's 46 now and when we know him, he's over 100 (he dies at 115). The reason he seemed like a completely different character is because, well, he is a different character. This is closer to Ariana's death and the turmoil with his family and young Grindelwald. This is pre-Grindelwald's Downfall. Pre-Voldemort. A lot happens in Dumbledore's life, so it makes sense that he in the 69 year span from Crimes to HBP, he would change as a character.

Completely agree that Grindelwald's rise to power is now a main focus as well, so yeah, a balance is necessary. Personally? I'm liking the movies because of the beasts and exploring new parts of the wizarding world that we haven't seen before. Beasts have to stay in the franchise, it would be one thing if Newt were to become an Auror and stop being a magizoologist but he literally turned down being an Auror, he loves what he does. He wants to help Dumbledore and Tina and Credence (true Hufflepuff, this man is), but at the end of the day his passion lies in his beasts.

 

This is actually one of the reasons I'm really excited for FB3 since Eulalie Hicks has been confirmed to have a sizable role. She's the witch that Flamel talked to in his cool book and is a professor at Ilvermorny. I feel like if we don't specifically go to Ilvermorny we could possibly see flashbacks about Tina and Queenie's time there, similar to Young Newt and Young Leta. Eulalie easily could have been one of their professors or maybe a classmate depending on her age.

Yes! I totally agree! Like sure, Luna and Neville would have been cute but they contrast. Luna's meant for travel and finding new things and beasts and being quirky. Neville's more quiet life, which explains how he married Hannah Abbott, now owns the Leaky Cauldron with her, and teaches at Hogwarts. Luna deserves somehow who fits her quirks and a Scamander would undoubtedly fit her quirks.