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casual sex?

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by skiff, Nov 21, 2014.

  1. Fallingdown7

    Fallingdown7 Guest

    Yes, just like some people think that engaging in homosexual sex is an unacceptable behavior because it doesn't reproduce children, which is what straight people use against us all the time. And before anyone says something, they absolutely are comparable because casual sex also involves consensual adults and it hurts nobody. An being an aromantic sexual is a valid orientation that deserves as much respect as homosexuality and bisexuality does, to deny otherwise makes one a bigot.

    You miss the point where I say that I personally believe in being monogamous and saving myself for someone special only; but unlike people like you I don't judge others or force my lifestyle on them. I empathize with how they feel; I get people telling me all the time that I should force myself to like men or I haven't met the right man to have satisfactory relationship, but I know if I did that I would just hurt my 'boyfriend' and myself in the process because It's not for me. Just like when a person who likes casual sex feels forced to have relationship sex, they just hurt other people in the process because they have to fake feelings they don't have to be accepted.

    You have every right to be against casual sex for yourself but DON'T force your lifestyle and beliefs on anyone else, unless you're fine with them making fun of you and telling you how wrong and 'old fashioned' you are for wanting a relationship.

    Oh and people who like casual sex don't use ANYONE as sex toys normally. You're not a sex toy if you agree, consent to and ENJOY casual sex. That's like saying that anyone who wants rough sex is actually raping everyone they do it with.

    ---------- Post added 15th Dec 2014 at 04:44 PM ----------

    I also find it funny that people here go on about how casual sex hurts anyone who doesn't believe in it (which is completely true) and that's why nobody should do it. But nobody seems to get that romantic affection can be just as uncomfortable and even traumatizing for aromantic people who want sex; so hurting someone with discomfort is fine as long as they're the 'type who wants casual sex only' amirite?

    And I hope everyone who condemns casual sex on the account of it being their opinion also supports homophobia because "it's just an opinion".
     
    #81 Fallingdown7, Dec 15, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 15, 2014
  2. stocking

    stocking Guest

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    What's wrong with consensual adults having causal sex?:confused:
     
  3. Wildside

    Wildside Guest

    there are some wild times going on at bathhouses and adult bookstores, and I think that there are a lot of issues involved. One is that male sexuality is different from female sexuality. The fact that guys are just "using" each other to get off is a really far cry from saying that they are more likely to be rapists. Holy :***:, Batman, how do you make that leap!!! I think that you see a lot of guys at the ABSs who are there because they are in the closet. The problem isn't that they are potential rapists, but that there are still so many factors that contribute to them being in the closet and casual sex is all they can muster. And there are those who just get the adrenal rush of high risk. But none of those are anything like rapists. There are none of the power issues in play for guys in these places. They are not forcing themselves on anyone. Is it better to be in a committed relationship? Well, yeah, in my book, I would agree, and that's what I would prefer. So do you want to buy the Christian approach that sex should only be between a man and a woman who are married and are open to having children? I don't buy that, and I certainly wouldn't push that on somebody else. And I wouldn't carelessly throw around words like "rapists" for anyone who has a more casual attitude than I do about sex (though admittedly, that would have to be an extraordinarily casual attitude to shock me) :confused:
     
  4. Fallingdown7

    Fallingdown7 Guest

    I agree. We have so many people condemning casual sex here and likening them to rapists or morally corrupt, and they forget to a lot of people you shouldn't be having sex at ALL unless It's reproductive sex inside a heterosexual marriage.

    So if any of you have non-reproductive, pre-marital or homosexual sex, your morals are just as 'wrong' and 'monstrous' as everyone else and maybe you all should stop what you're doing and stick your dicks in the vaginas of a committed wife where it belongs.
     
  5. all paths

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    cheap·en \ˈchē-pən\

    verb

    : to cause (something) to be of lower quality
    : to cause (something) to have or to seem to have less value, meaning, or importance


    What do both of these definitions have in common with regard to the matter of sex? They are both matters of human judgment/interpretation/perception. That is true.

    It is also true that where human beings are objectified or dehumanized (i.e. perceived to be cheapened or in fact cheapened by being treated primarily as means to personal ends), rape potential goes up:

    "Men who dehumanize women as either animals or objects are more liable to rape and sexually harass women and display more negative attitudes toward female rape victims."

    The question seems to be then, what "cheapens" (according to the dictionary definitions above) sex between two people, or cheapens an individual in another individual's eyes?

    Ease of access? Lack of consequences? Lack of meaning? Lack of attachment, communication?
     
    #85 all paths, Dec 16, 2014
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2014
  6. Fallingdown7

    Fallingdown7 Guest

    I agree, but this can happen between people in committed relationships as well. There are plenty of men with long term girlfriends who have zero respect for them as a human being (especially if they come out as bisexual and all of a sudden they are a walking porno for the boyfriend's amusement). No correlation between dehumanizing someone and wanting casual sex with them (Especially since many women also love casual sex and hate commitments, and women can prey on both men and women for casual sex as well).
     
    #86 Fallingdown7, Dec 16, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 16, 2014
  7. Clay

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    Pretty much this.

    Sex is sex. It's not mystical and magical, it's not evil, it's just sex. It's just a thing people do.
     
  8. all paths

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    Can someone make the case for how using someone for casual sex (even if it is mutual use) is not objectifying to one or both parties?

    If so, please explain.
     
  9. OnTheHighway

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    Casual sex should be each to their own. If two adults are comfortable with it, they both consent, then that is their business. Regardless of whether or not either party is objectifying one another.

    As I have stated, I would much prefer engaging in physical intimacy with my partner, whom I love; and where there is emotional attachment. So for me, casual sex is not desirable nor needed.

    If I were single, that thought would most certainly evolve.

    But, to reiterate, its two consenting adults.......
     
  10. OGS

    OGS
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    To be honest I don't really understand this notion that it somehow is in a blanket sense--nor do I see why somehow doing this one thing without agreeing to stay together forever somehow means you are using each other. Back in the day I would on occasion meet someone at a club or at the gym or whatever, we would talk for a while, hit it off and we would spend an evening together and sometimes that would involve sex. Most of the time we would stay up all night afterwards talking. I remember one guy we actually spent most of the next day laying around his bedroom reading his comic book collection. One guy brought out the book he was writing afterwards. Oftentimes we would listen to music with whoever was "hosting" trying to come up with the most awesome music they owned that the other might not have even heard of. I had two guys send me flowers the next day--a bit much, but a nice gesture nonetheless. Several of these guys ended up being good friends--most of them we would just smile and nod when we saw each other out and about. No it wasn't mystical, but it wasn't cheap either--it was nice and in it's own way it was very intimate and very human. This notion that it somehow takes years and a commitment to try to stay together forever to have a genuine human experience with another human being is just sort of mystifying to me.

    The fact of the matter is that there are people who use each other as objects and people who don't--across pretty much all activities, sex being one of them. There are people who use people for an evening and people who use people for a lifetime--and there are people who do neither. It's in the mindset not the activity.
     
  11. greatwhale

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    The highlighted sentence above indicates an unfounded assumption, and falsely equates "casual" with the pejorative "use". It's that word: "use" which leads to the idea of objectification, one "uses" objects...but what does one do with people in a relationship?

    Certainly, there are people out there who are vultures and look for sex as a means of self-gratification, this happens. But to automatically equate all casual sex with this is incorrect. I have had wonderful but temporary encounters with guys, it is almost never about self-pleasuring, it has always been about relating to another human being with intimacy, sensuality and kindness.

    Let's face it, there are "selfish" (that awful word again) reasons for being in any relationship, otherwise why get into them? There is a mutual benefit, but there are also mutual responsibilities; it comes with the territory. I would argue that casual relationships also involve certain responsibilities to go with the mutual benefit of sex, such as respect, playing safe, maintaining boundaries if it doesn't work out, and the possibility of a longer-term platonic friendship...not a bad bargain.
     
  12. biAnnika

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    OGS and Mr. Whale, thank you...this is the kind of exploration I needed to hear. My question is whether the kinds of encounters OGS describes meet the "typical" definition of "casual sex".

    The word "casual" means relaxed, yes?...so wouldn't the alternative to casual sex simply be uptight sex? Shouldn't sex within even a long term committed relationship be casual? Clearly this isn't what is meant by "casual sex"...so what *is* meant? I feel like we're all arguing from a "know it when I see/judge it" basis. Can we find a better/more descriptive word? At least for the purposes of discussion?
     
  13. OnTheHighway

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    From Google: Casual Sex, Noun, Sexual activity between people who are not established sexual partners or do not know each other well.
     
  14. biAnnika

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    Sorry but this is ultimately unhelpful. I know plenty of couples who have been married over 10 years and don't know each other well.

    And what is the definition of "established sexual partners"? That they've done it before? So every couple's first time is casual? This sounds like exactly what I meant by "know it when I see/judge it".

    I think we as thoughtful humans can do better than Google. Can we please stop hiding behind words and try to express what we mean by "casual sex"?
     
  15. OnTheHighway

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    Wow, seems pretty straight forward to me.
     
  16. biAnnika

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    "Know it when I see it" *always* seems straightforward.
     
  17. Choirboy

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    I usually think of it as "recreational" sex, which kind of takes in anyone who enjoys it, without quite the level of judgement. Maybe not the best word, since sex can be mighty recreational within a good relationship as well, but it's tough to come up with something that doesn't imply a level of sleaze which I don't feel is really fair. Kind of ironic coming from someone who has never participated in it, or likely ever will, but there you go.

    We all objectify people in some way or another for our own purposes. My eventual ex-wife has a friend of a friend who does car repairs for her. She doesn't even know the guy's last name, but whenever the van needs to feel better, she calls him. Non-relationship mechanical work at its finest. And my eventual ex-mother-in-law gets in touch with me whenever her computer has a problem, usually every full moon or so, and I end up going over and fixing it. (A "reboot"-y call? :lol:slight_smile: I don't see a lot of difference between those scenarios and two consenting, willing adults having sex, as long as it's clear that neither one is expecting something to come out of it besides feeling good for a little while. In fact, in the case of the car and the computer, the mechanic and I really don't get anything our of the deal besides feeling that we did something kind, whereas in a sexual scenario, both participants hopefully get some enjoyment out of it before moving on.

    Before I came out to my wife, she seemed to think it was my duty to beg for sex regularly and be turned down almost every time, and it was often a struggle for me because I'd have to set aside whatever snarky comment she had just made to me, or the fact that she was in a nasty mood or whatever, to do it. And that was long BEFORE I really accepted being gay or decided to come out. Not to paint her as a monster. But I was certainly being objectified, and the sex definitely wasn't cheap (particularly if you look at my financials!).

    I'm no sociologist, but it's clear that we have two conflicting bits of evolution at work here for survival of the species, procreation on the one hand, which would favor multiple partners, and stability, which would favor a more cohesive family unit. Both are part of our nature, and I think we really need to have some level of self-awareness and not place ourselves in a position to become "objectified" in a way we're not comfortable with. Casual hookups would turn me into an emotional stew pretty quickly, and I'm responsible enough, and know myself too well to go trolling for a one-nighter because it wouldn't be a healthy thing for me. But as long as the parties involved are on the same emotional footing, and do it in a responsible way for the sake of physical health and well-being, I just don't see it as any big deal.
     
  18. Black Raven

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    From Raven: Casual Sex - Sexual activity between an unspecified number of people not in any established relationship, mostly done solely for the sexual pleasure and enjoyment of (hopefully) all participants without strong emotional ties, although those -might- form or exist, no matter how casual the sex is supposed to be.
     
  19. HunGuy

    HunGuy Guest

    OGS and Fallingdown7,

    I see what you're trying to say. We're talking about casual sex (vs committed relationships), and not in any way about homophobia. But since you both mentioned it, I'll address it here.
    As for accepting homo/bi/whatever-sexuality, I'm all for that (I wouldn't even be here if it wasn't the case). I see nothing wrong with loving any gender you want, meaning I'm tolerant in this matter. What I'm not really into, is the 'universal tolerance', that I have seen several times here and there.
    What I mean by that, is the idea that if one is tolerant towards an aspect of something, he has to be tolerant towards the whole.
    You're both implying that if someone is condemning casual sex, he/she is also okay with homophobia. Or in the other way, if someone accepts homosexuality, he/she has to accept all forms of consensual sex.
    To say a theoretical (and extreme) example: based on the above, someone who spanks his child for misbehaving is also supporting and advocating murder (“if he's okay with hurting a child, then he surely doesn't have problem taking another life”). How does that sound to you?
    Having an opinion about a topic and arguing in favor of your opinion is pretty far from forcing others to succumb to your views, or persecuting those who does not. So please, don't extrapolate my disagreeing with casual sex to homophobia.

    So back to the topic!

    Thanks to greatwhale, I realized that I haven't even define what I mean by casual sex, and why is it unacceptable for me. This may clear up some things. To me, casual sex means two things:

    1. When two total strangers meet for a quick fuck (or any kind of sex), and neither of them wants anything else from the other. They don't even know each other. They just need another body with which they can satisfy their physical urges. They never meet again, and don't ever care about each other, because they are just disposable holes and sticks. They would substitute the other one any time with someone else. As one of my acquaintances said, after he couldn't pick up one of my classmates: “A pussy is a pussy. A hole is a hole. They are all just sluts, I'll find another one.”

    2. Meeting for sex regularly. Though it's a bit more humane (maybe it's not the best word) than the above hook-up, because they get to know each other over time, it's still the “you are just a hole” thing. It's just more convenient, because they don't need to go through the pick-up process over and over again.

    So I guess that's it. I see sex as a completely intimate and exclusive gift that you can give to a person you love. Opening up totally to your partner should be a meaningful experience. Letting the other enter your body (or the other way around) should be regarded as the ultimate means of showing trust and love, not just a way to satisfy your body's needs.
    Those who have sex as I described it above, destroy it's unique and extraordinary qualities, and make it some kind of ordinary, meaningless activity. And THAT is why I cannot accept it, that is why I'm attacking it so vehemently.

    This is my point of view, and I can't say “it's just a thing people do” and such. If some people like to have casual sex, good for them, enjoy it. But don't expect acceptance from me.
     
  20. OGS

    OGS
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    Actually I didn't say or even imply that--what I did say was that your particular argument for saying it (basically that it's just opinions and everyone's entitled to state their opinions in any forum or context they choose) could also very easily be used to countenance homophobia. It wasn't actually your stance that I found alarming it was your line of reasoning that I found rather odd in a forum like this.