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Being bored in relationships

Discussion in 'General Support and Advice' started by IronGospel, Sep 5, 2019.

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  1. Chip

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    Can't help you as long as you're unwilling to look at the core issues. Another way people commonly describe shame is "being chained or caged."

    Since you're (wrongly) convinced it's not shame and isn't vulnerability and you know better than everyone else in the field... I honestly don't know if you're going to find any help here, or anywhere else, for that matter.
     
    #21 Chip, Sep 16, 2019
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  2. IronGospel

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    How can shame be the same as being caged or chained? It doesn’t make sense. It’s like the same thing about calling someone repressed when it could be something else.

    I’m trying to say that it feels like being chained up because I can’t just do what I want anymore and have to think about the other person and what they want and need. If anything I begin to view the person as a chain limiting my freedom and actions.

    It would be right, and I’m starting to see it too, that I love the idea of a relationship but not the reality.
     
    #22 IronGospel, Sep 16, 2019
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  3. IronGospel

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    It’s like when you mentioned in the other post that most muscle men who work out a lot are gay, that’s just not true (or at the very least a gross generalization).
     
  4. Chip

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    For the record, I didn't say 'most'. I said "a lot of them'. If you ask any gym owner or sales manager, they'll tell you... gay men, on the whole, are major consumers of gym memberships and fitness services. That might be less true in rural areas that have fewer gay people (because most have fled to the cities) but it is certainly true in metropolitan areas.

    As for shame, if you bothered to actually study the literature, you'd understand. But you don't. You just pull stuff out of your ass and insist it's truth.

    What's really sad here is there are so many things that you're just flat-out wrong about, and you simply dismiss so much good information that's helped tens of thousands of men exactly like you, because "you don't think it's that way" or other conjecture based on nothing, while at the same time slamming the psychology field because the quality of the field's science doesn't meet your (apparently dichotomous) standards of rigor.

    Again, if you are arguing with virtually all the input offered, why are you even here?
     
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  5. sublimeprincess

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    Piggybacking off of Chip, your writing is not only circular but also contradictory. You mentioned you do care about having a long-lasting relationship yet indicated not having any values tied to relationship. If you don't notice inconsistencies in yourself, address the thought loops, or believe you know what's better than many years of research, you will continue to suffer. That is, of course, if none of this actually matters/holds value/is something you care about in the first place (as I mentioned in my first post to you).

    If written discourse isn't helping you be more mindful of what has been written throughout this forum, then I'd suggest speaking to a professional, whether that be for support for your internal struggle or if you're wanting more attention/relevance in your life. Good luck
     
    #25 sublimeprincess, Sep 18, 2019
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  6. IronGospel

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    It's not contradictory, it's based on real experience. I crave something that once I get into makes me feel chained and restricted, yet when I am out it's all I want. It's likely based on what I was fed as a kid by the media about relationships and that makes me believe that I just have to keep going until I get "the right one".
     
  7. Chip

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    ... which is exactly the sort of unconscious/conscious double-bind that happens when there are issues with vulnerability, which results in challenges with emotional intimacy... which is driven by shame, according to the voluminous literature out there on the topic.

    Which is again consistent with the above, as it feeds back into "not enough."
     
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  8. sublimeprincess

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    <3<3
     
  9. DangerAlex

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    It sounds to me like you're just not ready for a long-term relationship. And that's okay.

    Here's something to keep in the back of your mind: When you find the right person for you, you won't want to find anyone else, even after a month or a year. Your feelings will be stronger than any need for excitement you may feel, and you won't want whatever kind of life you'd have without that person. I'm sure at this point you're just young, having fun, and gaining experience with sex and dating. You have plenty of time for committed, long-term relationships. Trust that you'll know when you've found the person who you do actually want to be with for many years to come.

    However, if you do, in fact, get strong feeling for these people and still feel the need to find something else, then you might want to consider finding a counselor to talk it out with. Because if that's the case, you could be the sexual equivalent of an adrenaline junkie, and you'll need to get to the root of that issue before you're able to settle down.
     
  10. IronGospel

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    I’m sorry but I don’t believe in a “one” anymore. I wanted to, truly but I just didn’t see anything to support that idea.

    Even then what you describe sounds kind of unhealthy, that I wouldn’t want a life without them. It’s similar to the soulmate thing, I want to be ok with someone and ok without them.
     
  11. OGS

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    I think not everyone is a relationship person and even those that are may not be when they're younger. My husband and I have been together for well over 20 years at this point. I'm definitely a relationship person, but even I really genuinely enjoyed actively dating around for several years when I was younger. If a long term relationship doesn't seem like something you want right now, pursue other things. Maybe that'll change, maybe it won't--and either's alright. Pursue what you want, not what you think you're supposed to want..
     
  12. IronGospel

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    It's not really that, it's just that I don't really get the chance. The last time I was in a relationship I learned a lot about what not to do in one, but the biggest concern I have is that I am not enough for the person. I've mentioned before that I don't really do much, kinda joking that I'm not that different from a plant. So I guess maybe it's not boredom but more like me breaking it off early before they can do it to me when they realize what they signed up for.

    I've been insecure about living a simple life. While I like it because I have enough it isn't conducive to holding friends since I don't provide enough "excitement or entertainment" (that's the only words I have to describe it). It's honestly the BIGGEST thing that has held me back from connecting with people. I'm afraid that I'll have to keep performing and "keeping up with the joneses" just so they won't leave. That I don't make enough money to afford the latest titles in games or events or items, I don't meet anyone who is into just a quiet lunch or something like that. Sometimes I feel old or something like that, maybe a monk. All I can see is how MUCH everyone else has in their lives and then looking at me I just see a burden or a bore, who has nothing to offer besides his company. To me just hanging out with someone else is enough, but for everyone I meet apparently that isn't the case.
     
  13. DangerAlex

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    Maybe you misunderstood me, or perhaps I misspoke.

    I don't believe in soulmates either. I think for any given person, there are plenty of people in the world who are "right" for him or her. It's just a matter of finding them. When I said "the right person for you," I didn't mean to imply that it was just one person in the world. In this case, it was a matter of poor phrasing on my part.

    I also didn't say or mean "couldn't live without that person". That's codependency, which, I agree, is unhealthy. What I actually said was "won't want whatever kind of life you'd have without that person," which, admittedly, is a somewhat sensationalized way of saying "life is preferably/better with that person than without." I feel that way about my own boyfriend: When I image what life would be like without him, I don't like it and don't want to live that way. But that's not to say that if something happened and we weren't together anymore that I couldn't live a fulfilling life without him.

    My background is in psychology and I have had more than my fair share of unhealthy relationships, so none of what I said was intended to encourage an unrealistic or harmful view of relationships. In my own way, I was just trying to say that, at least in my experience, people who get restless in relationships usually need to find someone who's a really great match for him/her before that restlessness subsides.
     
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  14. greatwhale

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    So, what then are relationships for? The excitement of a conquest? Not being alone? Is there nothing more to all this relationship business?

    Getting into a new relationship is almost always exciting and new, right? It's all about what you are getting out of it. What you appear to seek in a relationship is merely and exclusively the opposite of your own boredom, and for a while you get that rush; the emptiness subsides, but only for a while, you start feeling trapped, but more to the point, afraid that somehow, by committing yourself to someone, you are losing out on the possibility of future excitements and future thrills with someone new. We hate losing anything, including our options.

    And yet, you state that this is a problem. Why? You appear to be getting exactly what you want, and avoiding what you call the burdens of being in a relationship.

    You are presently living on the merry-go-round of some vague notion of freedom, but it.s just a word, like love, it's a concept, an abstraction. Freedom, on its own, is meaningless. Freedom is something that you have the ability to exercise, including the freedom to choose to be in a committed relationship. But this isn't what you value, not really. It troubles you but is it only because you see others, including your parents, who appear to be able to be in a long-term Relationship? They love without necessarily calling it love, or living your abstract conception of love?

    You stated that despite it all, you want more out of a relationship. Perhaps it may help if you understand that what you get is in exact proportion to what you give. Love is a verb, not a feeling. Love is something you do, it's about caring, respecting, helping, but most of all, knowing that person. Boredom in a relationship comes from thinking that you know the person you are with. May I submit that a couple of weeks to a month is not sufficient time to know anyone, and more to the point, part of love is knowing the person you become when you are with this person.

    I find it interesting that you spoke of the self as an illusion, and to a large extent, I agree with you, but there is still a you that I am responding to here...here's an idea: you may do well to entertain the notion that who you are really does depend on whoever you are in a relationship with. Long-lasting relationships are about two people committing themselves NOT ONLY to each other, per se, but to this third entity, the relationship that exists between them. They love each other yes, but they love the space between them no less.

    Long-term and successful relationships have one thing in common, neither partner is ever sure they know the other fully. In other words, they are able to maintain a certain distance, they are able, from time to time, to see the other in a completely different light. In this way, they see their partner as from a distance, as someone new, and therefore just as attractive as the day they first met. They are somehow able to maintain this sense of mystery about the other. Most curiously, the longer they are together, the more mysterious they become to each other...it takes a lifetime to really know (i.e. love) another person and that is not a burden, but an adventure!
     
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  15. IronGospel

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    I wish I could believe that but people are actually far more predictable than we give them credit for, all it takes is simple observation.

    It doesn’t take a lifetime to know someone, just a week of mindful attention. It’s like with my family, I only fully knew them after I reviewed their behaviors for a week (by that I mean also their past behavior), and knew them instantly. You’d be surprised how much people give away if you only pay attention to them.

    But what I want is the kind of depth that people talk about, the deep relationship, someone you confide in and that they can too. Not these surface interactions about trivial nonsense, I’ve had plenty of that. But again it goes back to being “boring”, my life is just not exciting for other people and that holds me back. I’m afraid people will leave so I BS a lot of things just to add entertainment value to my life, but it only goes so far.
     
  16. IronGospel

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    What you are describing is still dependency. What I heard is that a good relationship is when you’ll be ok with or without them.
     
  17. Chip

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    That's totally not true. Keep in mind that what follows is for neurotypical people; I don't have enough experience with ASD to generalize, but depending on where someone is on the spectrum, it would apply there as well.

    When a neurotypical person is dating someone, he is going to (theoretically) put his best foot forward. He's going to moderate what he says, He's going to seek to appeal to the other person's desires. Additionally, when two people first meet and feel something between each other, oxytocin, known as 'the love hormone' fires. This has the 'rose colored glasses' effect in which neither person can see the other's flaws... or more precisely, they may see them but discount or minimize them. The oxytocin effect stays around for anywhere from a few weeks to several months. (This is a large part of why many people date dozens of people and say "I don't know, but the spark wore off after a couple months and I wasn't interested any more.) And there are some attributes of others that it simply takes time for them to show up. Sometimes good, sometimes, bad.

    None of that is possible with 'a week of mindful observation."

    This requires time, patience, and especially, mutual vulnerability. Another part of getting to know neurotypical people is that a reasonably emotionally healthy person (generally the only people who understand and are in touch with their vulnerability) is going to hold back on sharing a lot of things until they really get to know and trust that person. And that doesn't happen in 'a week of mindful obeservation' either. It generally takes months, sometimes longer. As Brené Brown says, emotionally healthy people share their stories with the people that have earned the right to hear them. And earning that right takes time. Another quote of hers that is relevant here is "Vulnerability is the last thing I want you to see in me, and the first thing I want to see in you." So the dance of vulnerability, and the dance of emotional intimacy (similar but different) both happen in relationships over time, and require patience, self-disclosure, and mutual trust.

    The fear that people will leave is a deep insecurity driven by shame. The BSing to add entertainment value is hustling for worthiness. Both come from a place of not believing you are worthy of another's love, that you aren't good enough to keep them interested, that there isn't enough in you that will keep someone around, engaged, and connected. And as long as you hold that belief, stubbornly refuse to look at the shame that drives it, and work on letting down the shields of vulnerability that keep you away from others, the existing pattern will continue.

    If you want to start to change, one of the first things you can do is to consider that most everything people are telling you here actually has value, actually is correct, and at least consider that it may apply to you, and what you think you know about the world isn't the end-all, be-all of how it works, and you don't actually know everything.

    You could, if you choose, sit back and, with curiosity, simply say "Hmmmm. What if what everyone is saying has some truth to it? What if I've been looking at things one way and maybe that's not the only way to see them? What if I simply started exploring some of these issues and trying on these new behaviors".

    If you were to actually do that, instead of rejecting every suggestion posed to you, denying why any of them apply to you, and insisting that because of your psychology background (which, I assure you, has enormous gaps and a whole lot of misunderstanding within it) you know everything... you can actually start to see things change for you.
     
    #37 Chip, Sep 28, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2019
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  18. silverhalo

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    Whilst you believe that the honest you isnt enough for someone you never will be because you will stop yourself. You have to let others make the decision about whether or not you are what they want and for some you will be and some you wont.
     
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  19. IronGospel

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    I don’t stop myself, which is the problem. I do show it eventually (and that eventually isn’t very long after) and their decision is pretty clear then. I assure you everyone has left after that
     
  20. silverhalo

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    As per your below post you say that you add BS because you feel like the honest you isnt enough, so how do you know that the people leave because of the honest you or because they realise that before the honest you, you weren't being honest.

    The kind of deep meaningful relationship you talk about below takes time to develop, it is not something which anyone walks into immediately, it takes time. Trivial interactions are all part and parcel of developing the relationship.

    Do you see your life as boring, or you just perceive that others will think it is boring?

     
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