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How much of gender identity comes down to looks? How much does it matter?

Discussion in 'Gender Identity and Expression' started by Redbud123, Jan 21, 2021.

  1. Redbud123

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    Hello all!

    As I get older, sometimes I rue the fact that I have such a distinctly masculine body. From the (quite thick) body hair, to even some light hair loss in front and back, as I get older, my desires to dress more gender neutral seem to be drifting further away, as it seems like fashion is best suited for the young and androgynous, and it feels more and more out of place, (or even inappropriate) for me to even try.

    But then I was wondering, because I've always thought that behaviorally, men and women have a ton of overlap, and if looks weren't considered, I could see similar personalities acting mostly the same regardless of gender.

    So how much of gender identity is simply about looks?

    And when those looks fade, when we all get old and wrinkly, and we aren't trying to find mates, how much do looks matter as we get older?

    Moreover, how much did it matter in the first place?


    Even if I had certain experiences and avenues of expression closed off to me in life, I wonder whether I'm really missing anything important. I generally am surrounded by people who are open to deep thoughtful conversation and are fine with expressing emotions, so I don't feel like being a man really impacts my ability to express my feelings much, but maybe just prevents me a little from being as close or "touchy-feely" as I might otherwise be. Since I never felt that I could express or embody any sort of beauty or specialness through my looks, I sought to focus on my mind.

    Anyway, I digress, the question is really about how important "looking like you want to" really is, and how important it remains to people over time.
     
    #1 Redbud123, Jan 21, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2021
  2. QuietPeace

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    None of it. There are many people who identify opposite of their birth assignment who will never pass. Their identity is still valid even so.

    Less than I used to think it did. I am 58 and due to so much stress for so many years I look older and yet I have still found someone who I can at least share some of my life with (he is sleeping in my bed right now as I type this).

    Again, less than I thought it did. As I look back and think about the people who have been in my life, those who cared most about frivolous externals were not meaningful in my life and I would have been better off kicking them out of my life without hesitation. Those people who only care about looks do not care about people.

    Even though I know that looks do not really matter that much I do find it quite comforting that I do "pass" but as far as looking classically "pretty" I have accepted that I never really was and never will be a model. I still have friends and a significant other and I am glad to have the life that I have.
     
  3. Redbud123

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    Thank you for your kind answer and taking the time to read my post. As my thirties are right around the corner and people I know are getting married, I worry sometimes about my worth and why I have been alone for so long. Things like my looks frequently come to mind, even though I know it's not the most important thing. Sometimes I wish people weren't so distant and it was easier to really get to know someone.

    I'm studying in college, and as an older student I see so many of the people around me and they look beautiful and young, but this time around, I feel like an outsider. As if I'm too old to be of interest. I don't know how I look to their eyes, but mentally, I feel older, more mature than a lot of them, yet, no more secure (career-wise) or further along in my life than them.

    I'm tired of worrying about being left behind relationship wise. Of being lonely into old age. I really long for the intimacy of another human. I want to be seen and understood. But I don't want to jump into things if they don't feel right. But things haven't felt right for almost a decade. No matter where I go and who I see, I see people who make fine acquaintances, but never someone who I want to be in a relationship with.

    A relationship is something I want, but something I'm not sure I'm ready for. And I worry that if I keep waiting for the right person to come along, I'll be waiting forever, but I don't want to hastily settle for someone who isn't right. And I'm terrified, with such high rates of divorce these days, of committing to a relationship for so long and just having the other person, even years into the thing just... change their mind.
     
  4. Commenza

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    Hey, Redbud123,

    I understand a lot of your worries and fears about not finding anyone, high divorce rates etc. Especially our generation seems to always be on the lookout for something better, to not feel satisfied unless someone fulfills all our expectations perfectly... But still, I assure you there are people who are willing to commit to a relationship and who understand that no one is perfect and who are not all that superficial.

    You say that your thirties are right around the corner, yet you sound like, I don't know, maybe someone who's in their 90s. Your hopelessness is honestly sad to read. Dude, you have all your life to live for! I mean I guess I get it how your in college and most people are somewhat younger than you, you might start feeling a bit insecure. But that doesn't mean you're a grandpa or that your life is over or that nobody wants you. Today many people take more time for their education and you don't have to be married at 30. Heck even people in their 60s or 70s or oldee still find a partner and have a happy relationship.

    I don't know if that helps but maybe looking for somebody online in your area could be helpful. And no I'm not talking about that famous one where you swipe people but one where mainly your interests are matched to that of others. I feel like talking online first and see if there's a possible deeper connection can help with finding someone who's on the same page.

    It might also be very worthwhile to see a counselor or therapist to work on your self-esteem and self-worth.

    I honestly wish you all the best.
     
  5. Redbud123

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    "But that doesn't mean you're a grandpa," - That made me laugh. You're right. I think I was doubling down on the doom and gloom a bit. Things probably aren't so bad. Seeing a therapist would probably be good. Internet dating seems kind of daunting, but maybe I should look into it.

    Thanks for your reply! It makes me feel a bit better. I'll try and look on the bright side while keeping open to opportunities. Sometimes I forget how young I am in the big scheme of things, and have to remind myself that I still have the rest of my life ahead of me.

    I guess it's better to appreciate what you do have than waste your life mourning what you don't.
    It was good to hear some outside perspectives, thank you everybody for your feedback!
     
  6. QuietPeace

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    I have been in two disastrous marriages and one that was simply a bad fit. I have also been in shorter but also bad relationships and I have spent time alone over the past several decades. I do not really like being alone but I have found that being alone is thousands of times better than being in a relationship with the wrong person.
     
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  7. RosieHeart

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    I'm pushing 50 and looking like I want is still important because of the way I feel when I dress my best. Never overlook the importance of clothing and how you present yourself externally. We typically feel better when we look our best and, IMO, we're better accepted by others when we feel good about ourselves.

    I married in my mid-thirties and divorced in my mid-forties. I blame myself for the divorce because it was a marriage that never should have happened - I didn't listen to that inner voice that screams, "RUN FOR THE HILLS". I met my current wife six years ago, and I know people who have gotten into relationships well into their 60s and 70s. It's never too late.

    "How wonderful it is that nobody need wait a single moment before starting to improve the world."- Anne Frank

    I would add to this quote... ", and to live their best life."

    Well-said!