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Considering an open marriage...

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by Lamarr, Apr 26, 2020.

  1. Lamarr

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    I'm a 39 year old bi+ guy. I've been in a committed monogamous relationship with my wife for nearly 10 years. I've always been open with here about being queer and she knows that I dated / slept with men before we met. She is very supportive. I'm out to my kids, some of my closer friends but not at work or to my parents and siblings.

    Despite her support and acceptance I've never been comfortable identifying with or discussing the part of myself that identifies as gay. I find myself editing what I say (and think) a lot, I don't point out men I find attractive on the street or in movies. I make it a point not to talk about any of my ex boyfriends but I will bring up ex girlfriends. I know this us due to my own internalized bi-phobia. If you read my introduction post on the welcome page you'll understand why. Lately with a lot of extra time I've been reading as much bisexual literature as I can. Reading other bi peoples stories and experiences has really helped my understand myself better and know that I am not alone. I'm not armed with language and stats to help me when I experince bi-phobia from others. I have started to feel more comfortable identifying as bi or queer, it's really helped me come out to myself and to know that I'm not stuck in some "phase."

    The more comfortable I become with this identity the more I want to express myself. There has been something in the back of my mind for the past 10 years with my wife, a nagging feeling that something is missing or incomplete. I know it's cliche, and it's the stereotype that a lot of bi people hate but I need to express myself sexually with both women and men to feel complete. I miss being with men.

    I want to talk about my needs and the possibility of opening up my marriage. I don't quite know how to bring it up. And I don't really have any good models of what that would look like. I need help navigating this. Any advice from other bi men in mixed orientation marriages would be amazing.

    Thanks!
     
  2. DecentOne

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    Hi Lamarr,
    My situation is a little different, since I’ve never had any experience with guys. I don’t need to be with a guy, though I fantasize about it. You say “I miss being with men” so your memories are a part of your dilemma, whereas they are not in mine.

    If you are finding your wife supportive of you, and it is your own internalized BiPhobia, then I’m glad you are finding stories of others to help you. Seeing others embracing themselves is very empowering (I find it helpful too, even though I don’t feel internally homophobic/BiPhobic). Therapy might be too. I urge you to remember your wife was the person who helped name “bi” for you, and seemed great about you being you. I think that is wonderful, and hope you can be brave enough to communicate your love for her, and show your acceptance of yourself more often in your conversations.

    For me authenticity means joining a LGBTQ hobby group, being on EC, and marching in the Pride Parade. That is a way of saying “this is the invisible part of me!” Perhaps some of those things would also help you feel more comfortable with yourself? I know that groups are not meeting because of COVID-19, but think about it for when it is safe to be socializing again.

    Others in the Later in Life section have talked about how they communicated with their spouse and negotiated a way to have more than monogamy. Perhaps they will chime in, or you could just look around. I don’t have experience to speak to that.
     
  3. Lamarr

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    Thanks for your thoughtful reply DecentOne. I am very thankful that my wife is so supportive. The fact that I'm still having so much trouble with internalized biphobia goes to show how powerfully we can be conditioned by society. I have been in therapy before, in fact I spent the better part of my 20s being therapised and medicated for anxiety and depression. We never go into my sexuality though. I agree that it would be helpful talk to a professional about this. Perhaps when we're out of lock-down I'll go back. Before Covid I was looking into a bi support group. There's nothing in my city though I'd have to drive an hour or so. Heck there isn't even a single gay bar in this town! Joining a hobby would be nice, maybe I'll have to get something going myself. I'm sure there are loads more guys like me around here that would like connect.

    I wonder what it's like for you DecentOne having that attraction and not being able to act on it? I sometimes just crave touch and affection more than the sex. One of my best friends is gay and we took a trip to Montreal together last year, nothing happened (we're more like brothers) but we had some really nice moments just cuddling on the couch. It felt really good to be held by another man.

    I will spend some time looking through the later in life section for more stories about open relationships.
     
  4. Nickw

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    @Lamarr

    I saw your post a few days back and sorry that you were left hanging for awhile on this forum. It's a strange time right now and it is sometimes hard for me to gather my thoughts together to respond...

    I'm a marred bisexual. I have a wife of 35 years and a boyfriend of 18 months. So, I have, I guess, a somewhat open relationship. I came out to my wife about 5 years ago. I had never experienced intimacy with another man before and was in a monogamous marriage. I, too, felt I needed to express my entire sexuality and that involves the intimate aspects of my bisexuality.

    In my case, my wife asked me if I needed to experience gay sex. At first, I only really NEEDED to by with other gay or bisexual men in a platonic environment. So, I sought out the LBBT community here where I live and started attending events such as Pride and a social group for gay men. After awhile, my wife and I discussed me having limited intimacy with other men. This was her idea. We set up some rules for what I could do with other guys. No intercourse...basically. I had a few friends that I fooled around with casually this way. Then I asked my wife if I could go further with one of my friends. She agreed.

    Communication was the key. And, not moving too fast. At every step of the way, I agreed that the marriage was the most important thing we had. So, my wife built up a comfort level with what I was doing. About 18 months ago I met a guy that is a lot younger than me that I developed a friendship with. We started becoming intimate and now he is part of the family. My wife and he have a friendship that is separate from mine. In fact, they spend more time with each other than I do. We have all three been together as a family unit during this pandemic.

    You never know how things will go. I never imagined this would be my life. It is great but takes a lot of work and sometimes balancing two relationships can be overwhelming. Last night my wife and my friend left me for a couple days to go to his place to do some errands. I am having a such a relaxing day not having to be there for two people. The biggest issue for me is finding my time alone.

    Every relationship is different. Your wife may be threatened by something like what I have. Or, you may find that it really isn't for you after all. What I would advise is just talking it out with your wife in a non-combative way. Good luck.
     
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  5. DecentOne

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    I crave the male friendship. It turns out my best friend from my teen years came out as gay. We never did anything sexual, nor was I a cuddling friend. But we understood each other, trusted each other, could talk about what was important to us, and hung out through thick and thin. I miss that.
    I love to think about physical stuff with a guy (from cuddling to sex) in my fantasies. But when one of my friends complemented my body and patted my chest I didn’t relish it. Maybe just a wrong moment? Or maybe I really am ok with just my imagination.
    I do like being around gay and bi/pan guys. If we could, I’d be with my hobby group and the men’s discussion group, etc. This COVID-19 enforced distance is leaving me feeling like the bi part of me is dead.

    @Nickw mentions wives may be threatened by the kind of relationship he has with his friend. My wife would be, so it is good I’m not seeking that.
     
  6. Robyn mac

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    I had a moment at a nude beach with my girlfriend present. Way home we discussed my sexuality. She arranged a date with a gay friend of hers. We had sex. We talked about it and now she arranges dates for both of us with bi males. We share some , some we dont. She can see other men also. She had us join a bisexual group of people. She goes also but is straight. They all know and are fine with it,
     
  7. Lamarr

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    Thanks for all the thoughtful replies. It's really helpful to hear everyone's experiences. I've been avoiding coming back on to EC lately. I think I'm trying to avoid thinking about this. Especially during this time, it seems to be adding to the general anxiety :frowning2: HOWEVER I also acknowledge that nothing is going to change unless I do something about it.

    DecentOne, the first few guys I was with back when I was identifying as gay left me feeling strange. I wasn't totally comfortable with the experience because I wasn't comfortable with myself. I felt like I had done something wrong. A lot of men are brought up thinking that there is something bad / wrong when it comes to any kind of physical connection with other men. I am still trying to wash off that feeling. Now that I'm in a monogamous marriage I am ALWAYS thinking about being with men. I don't really fantasize about sex, what I want is more "innocent" for lack of a better work. I crave connection: I want someone to cuddle with, and make out, someone who can just put his arms around me.

    NickW and Robyn, I really want to explore these types of relationships with my wife. I don't know that I'm interested in group sex with my wife. I think I would prefer to connect with one person. And I'm 100% OK with her exploring as well. Robyn it sounds like your situation happened quite naturally. Do you guys have any advice in regards to rules? I'm curious how people make open marriages work.
     
  8. Robyn mac

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    Our ruless are very simple . We both enjoy kissing and oral with others. While my only limitation is she only wants me to bottom. I have no compaints about it as i enjoy it very much.She can do anything she wants. We have a seperate bedroom with toys for play when only one of us has a date.
    At the bi club she has sex with the men. When we find a man for us togther we share and have a very enjoyable time. In the beginning there were times when one or the other was jealous of the other about who they were with and how they enjoyed it. Most of all communication is the answer.
     
  9. IslandMama

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    So, not DecentOne here, but I felt the need to reply. Late 30's married bi lady here. Having that attraction, and not being able to act on it, feels like torture most of the time. If I stop and let myself think about it I will probably just cry. It feels like something is missing that i never knew i had, and now it's too late. It might not really be, but it feels that way.

    Going to do something about it, as soon as I figure out how. Good luck to you.
     
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  10. Robyn mac

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    Hi Mama, why can't you act on it. If married talk with your husband maybe ask about a threesome. You will have to share but you get to try it for yourself. Invite a close friend over have a couple glasses of wine watch a movie cuddle on the couch. My straight female friends do that all the time. They drink to much they stay over and share a bed, nobody thinks anything funny. There are ways to do things to get that closeness you are longing for.
    I wish you luck on your journey. remember communication.
     
  11. Nickw

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    @IslandMama

    I was 58 before I was completely intimate with a man. I have been married 34 years.

    if you are bisexual, you may be able to have a life where you may express your full sexuality. This takes work. It takes communication. It takes commitment and it takes honesty.

    I think many of us get to the point of hopelessness and we start to blame our spouses. I reached that point. I would recommend engaging your partner before you feel this sense of despair. Maybe someday you can have it both ways.

    But, you won’t ever get there on your own. You may need to have an open an honest conversation with your husband.
     
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  12. LostInDaydreams

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    It’s not clear what you’re suggesting...it seems a bit deceitful to the female friend, when the other person is potentially getting more out of the friendship than the friend is aware of, and to invite them over mainly for that purpose.
     
  13. Robyn mac

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    Daydreamsyour getting me wrong. drinking to much and spending the night is pure innocent. my ex wife used to do that with her friends .drinking pajama party. Went on vactions 4 people in a room shared beds. all innocent and nobody thinks anything about it but they had a great time.
    About a thresome its all out in the openshe askes him about it. if he agrees nobody getting hurt.
     
  14. IslandMama

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    I can't act on it because my husband wants to stay monogamous. He feels like I'm trying to "change the rules of the game" since I agreed to monogamous marriage. He also says I should "do whatever I need to do" and that he doesn't want to hold me back... but it seems like basically instead of negotiating in detail beforehand, he'd rather wait till something happens... then be mad? And I'd be the obvious bad guy then, wouldn't I.

    Though I've spent the past year hoping we'd reach middle ground here, it feels increasingly clear to me that I need to make a choice, and I can't have both. Bot easy to leave, and I don't want to leave, but I also don't want to feel incomplete, like I'm out of touch with fully half of my sexuality.

    Any other bi people who can relate?
     
  15. regkmc

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    I can relate. It doesn’t feel great for me (or my wife) knowing that I probably prefer sex with a guy. I can enjoy sex with both, but the preference makes a relationship with her (or another woman) feel unsustainable. Luckily, I’m at a point where I feel a little more comfortable that separation doesn’t mean the end of our family/end of my world. Wishing you peace and love on your journey.