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General News Fire at Notre Dame cathedral in Paris

Discussion in 'Current Events, World News, & LGBT News' started by BothWaysSecret, Apr 16, 2019.

  1. BothWaysSecret

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    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ny...ld/europe/why-notre-dame-fire-spread.amp.html

    A fire damaged the ancient cathedral and iconic Parisian landmark on Monday. Current reports attribute the blaze to restoration work that was going on at the church.

    The fire destroyed most of the roof, and caused the spire to fall.

    The cathedral housed several pieces of priceless art, artifacts, and relics, including what is believed to be the crown of thorns Jesus wore during his crucifixion. Many of these items have been saved, but not all.

    French president Emmanuel Macron has vowed to rebuild the famous church within five years and hundreds of millions of euros have been pledged towards its restoration.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-europe-47943705
     
    #1 BothWaysSecret, Apr 16, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
  2. Hawk

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    That's too bad. Hopefully they can restore most of it. I went there in 2012, it's such a beautiful cathedral.
     
  3. ThatBorussenGuy

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    That was heartbreaking news to wake up to. I'm not religious by any means, but I've wanted to go there since I was kid, and that building is a work of art. :cry: Hope they can restore her to her former glory.
     
    #3 ThatBorussenGuy, Apr 17, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2019
  4. BothWaysSecret

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    I'm Catholic and an artist, so it was doubly hard for me to watch. It's always a place I've wanted to visit if I ever went to Paris.
     
  5. Emmareld

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    It's such an unfortunate thing to happen.
     
  6. Reviskova

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    to be honest, i never really heard of this place before but its such a amazing building. its going to be a real shame if they cant restore it to be the way it was before, i hope the damage isnt too brutal (but it kinda seems like it is). churches and cathedrals are beautiful in my opinion and i really hope they meet their goal of fixing it in five years. its also horrible that not only the building took a hit, but historical artifacts too. hope they could save most of them.
     
  7. brainwashed

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    The ~800 year old oak beam roof support structure of the attack was "labeled" The Forest . (per NYT article) To not have a sprinkler system in the attack is negligent.
     
  8. BothWaysSecret

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    I agree with your statements.

    However, I'm kind of surprised you've never heard of the church. Did you ever read the book or see a movie version of Hunchback of Notre Dame?
     
  9. BothWaysSecret

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    Perhaps it's possible that the way the attic was built prevented a sprinkler system from being installed.
     
  10. PatrickUK

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    Reports suggest it was thirty minutes from complete destruction and that really would have been terrible. Quite apart from the fact that it's a significant place of worship and architectural masterpiece, Notre Dame is weaved into the history of the French nation as much as Westminster Abbey and St Pauls Cathedral are weaved into ours. We have numerous old churches and cathedrals in the UK and each and every one of them has unique and stunning features that are irreplaceable.
     
  11. Andrew99

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    A lady I work with went there almost 40 years to the day before it burned. Very sad.
     
  12. Lin1

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    I am French and while I find the fire sad from an historical and art/cultural point of view. I am bemused by the amount of mourning that seem to have occured for the cathedral, not saying this is a bad thing per se but looking at my feed you would have thought it was the worst thing that had ever happened since 9/11, I am in the US and since the fire everyone who figures out I am French, give me their condolences like I have lost a member of my family, I appreciate their thoughts but I find it utterly ridiculous. In the Grand scheme of things it is only a building, yes I know how majestic it was, the history behind it and the art/cultural aspect of Notre Dame but come on, the fact that 800 million was gathered in less than 24hours to build it back up is mind boggling to me and something that just doesn't seem quite right with me.

    Personally I am not for it being rebuilt. I know why people want it rebuilt but it's going to require thousands of trees and millions of dollars, the planet need those trees more than the cathedral, and the money could be much better spent else where. I also find the simple fact that 800 millions are going to be spent on a building which religious teaching is all about helping the poor and living in the most modest conditions, slightly ironic to say the least.

    I know it's not the popular opinion, but it's the opinion of a lot of other French people I know.
     
  13. brainwashed

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    The attic, aka The Forest, would have been easy to put sprinklers in. Reference pics of it online. It's getting water pipes to attic that would be hard. Water pipes are ugly as hell - pun intended.
     
  14. PatrickUK

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    I'm not sure how it works in the Catholic Church or in France, but to install a sprinkler system in an old Anglican Church/Cathedral in England would be a nightmare process. Even the smallest alteration or modification to the fabric of the building requires the trustees to go through a multi-layered process of consultation, revision, public notification and approval from a consistory court. The process of installing something on the scale of a modern sprinkler system in an 850 year old building of architectural significance would be exhaustive and fraught with difficulty and might well be rejected in the end on heritage grounds.

    Maybe I'm looking at it through the lens of British bureaucracy and consent rules, but it is notoriously difficult to obtain approval for works on churches and cathedrals here. I know of one church in London that had to convene a special sitting of an Ecclesiastical Court after they decided to change their altar.
     
  15. Nordland

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    Really upsetting, I hate it when history is destroyed like this. I really think it should be cherished and rebuilt as it is a testament to those who have gone before us and its beauty is sublime.

    I just wish there could be a similar outpouring for what has happened in Iraq and Syria where ISIS have destroyed hundreds of amazing artefacts dating back thousands of years and have even demolished many incredible historical sites, such as Palmyra. [​IMG]
     
    #15 Nordland, Apr 19, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2019
  16. smurf

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    It has taken me everything to not lash out with anger to the amount of money thrown at this one church owned by a billion dollar church.

    Its the importance given to only European culture as being seen as needed or significant. Its so painful.

    Here in the US we had 3 historical black churches burnt down by a racist. These are churches of monumental importance for the local community, yet the US will be sending money to France and not invest in out local history first. Its just.... agh!

    Okay, so how did I put that anger to work?

    The churches mentioned above put together a fundraising page.

    I invested my money and time in making sure all my friends knew about it, asked them to help, and at least felt like I could do just a little something. Made it more manageable
     
    #16 smurf, Apr 19, 2019
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 19, 2019
  17. Filip

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    Yeah, in a way it's infuriating. And I say this as someone who sat in front of his TV until 2.30 AM shaking. I couldn't get to sleep until I was sure the fire was under control.

    But... I don't think the injustice is that so much money went to this particular case. It's a large building. Funds are sorely needed to restore it and to fix other parts that have sorely deteriorated.

    The injustice to me is that the world's wealthy talk a big deal about how it's completely unreasonable to expect them to donate more to charity, but suddenly have no qualms donating hundreds of millions for this sort of high-visibility projects. Let's also not forget that the biggest donors are people who are suspected of billions of tax fraud (or, well, tax loophole abuse) and have a vested interest in playing nice with the French state. Not to mention how nice it is to have a plaque with your name on the entrance to a multi-million tourist attraction.


    While it was burning, I vowed to donate a sizeable chunk of money to the rebuilding. But I can see it'll be a drop in an ocean.
    So I like your suggestion of investing it in a good cause that needs it more, right now. So I'm wagering it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for me to donate it for those burnt churches in the US. Or to places like Palmyra when they eventally do restoration work on it.



    Also, as an aside: simple solutions like "let's put sprinkers!" are not that simple in practice.
    Ss someone with at least SOME training in the matter, I do feel compelled to mention that sprinkler systems aren't perfect either. They can only spray so much volume of water. They can't sprinkle every inch of exposed flammable surface (especially not in a forest of beams as the roof of Notre Dame). You need a lot of water to wet beams like that to their core. And you can't keep them pre-wetted all the time or they rot.

    That much wood puts out A LOT of heat once it starts burning. These fires reach thousands of degrees (when you're talking about those numers, fahrenheit vs celcius loses all meaning, even).

    Sprinklers can put out a small fire. Or delay a larger one. But if you have a really hot fire starting from a really hard to reach corner? It's like expecting a light rain to put out a forest fire. Most of it is already evaporated before it's near the burning wood.
     
  18. Tightrope

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    I felt sick when I read about it and saw the photos and videos. While we know it has happened, many are probably asking how it could have even happened. This ought to serve as a wake-up call for culturally important buildings to assess risk. I am all for putting it back together. I have been there when in Paris. If people and organizations want to donate, it's not anyone else's business. You don't have to. People spend big money for unhealthy vices and in many wasteful ways.
     
  19. Reviskova

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    i did see the movie quite a while ago, but i never realized it took place in a real place. i didnt even know it took place in france. it either flew over my heard or it was never pointed out to me when i was younger. i dont remember much about the movie either, that might be why.
     
  20. PianoKeys

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    I saw this French girl on tv, and I am like...girl..its just a building. She is crying. Added that this cathedral has seen fires before. It it is not completely authentic. It is sad, but the way the response is....It made me feel weird.

    Nothing to do with the French, its just those people that have the camera that get shown, and thats how it works with everything. Images and reputations are formed in seconds, where the truth is usually different. I believe many people are way more sensible. I wish symbolically they would spend it on a more world improving beautiful cause. But alright, lets see what happens.