Bottom shame

Wow, there is a tremendous amount of courage and honesty in the initial post and the responses. I am dealing with some similar issues and its good to know there is a place to talk about these things where you will receive a caring, thoughtful response.

 

I really do love this site. I think it’s exactly what the Internet is at its best, and when we’re at our best.

Patrick

 

It's courage and honesty that helps to drive us forward, and this particular issue (the issue of bottoming) is one that really can pull us backwards into the closet. There's an awful lot of shaming and stereotyping that goes on about gay male sexual roles and I distinctly remember some offensive references to anal sex during my own coming out process that added to the layers of shame and drew me deeper into my own closet. Assumptions were made about my sexual preferences in a very personal and derogatory way, and even though they were often wide of the mark, I couldn't shake them with any sense of ease or without support. I actually think people who obsess over what we get up to in bed are dealing with some issues themselves, but I digress on that point.

We have to be sex positive as well as sexuality positive to cast off the heavy weight. Accepting and appreciating our sexual preferences goes hand in hand with accepting and appreciating our sexuality. We really can't have one without the other. If we can talk about these issues sensibly and rationally we stand a greater chance of making those forward moves.

 

Since I have accepted my sexuality one of my most romantic fantasies is being with a guy in that way. I think is it is one of the most intimate romantic and vulnerable expressions of physical love there is.

But in the straight world, 'getting it in the ass' is a sign of weakness, I think it might be problem of conflating the horrible act of male on male rape and two men making love.

Almost everyone can recall a negative image about man on man rape - midnight express, Lawrence of arabia, deliverance, numerous prison jokes.

I can't think of one popular culture image of men making love. Imagine a beautiful romantic scene of two men showing their love for each other in that way...

 

-> I distinctly remember some offensive references to anal sex during my own coming out process

I also remember back when anal was distinctly "gay" as no straights did that to their girlfriends. In that context, it was much easier to shame anal folks. Fast forward 40 years, and now anal is common among straights (though I can't imagine why), so for gays it no longer has the same shame it used to have. Can't call the pot black when straights do the same things.

-> We have to be sex positive as well as sexuality positive to cast off the heavy weight.

Touche. I remember being nothing more than a sexual object to a guy. I didn't like it and told him so. I was put down for it, but inside I always knew I was right about it. I ended that relationship and never looked back. Today, I'm much more about making friends first. I don't go hunting for sex. I don't currently have any gay friends (my new year's resolution), but we'll see if my plan works. Friends first, sex later.

 

Amiready you absolutely correct it the most sensual, romantic and erotic expiernce I could ever imagined. Two men making love passionately , not the gay porn style, but real man to man intimacy including anal is the best expression I can think of. No matter what the straight world may think, we gay men know the emotional high and real connection that most intimate of acts provides us.

 

I couldn't agree more. Very well said. For me it needs to be someone I know like and trust. Also for me it's very freeing.

 

I hope you are doing okay. Wherever you are at with everything in your life, I support where you are now and where you are going. Sometimes it takes some time to understand things better. Whatever happens going forward, I am glad you posted.

 

Hello, I'm new to male to male gay sex. It's taken years to accept I'm gay. And longer to accept anal sex. I've only accepted it this past 12 months. I recently tried it, I met a guy on a hookup, second meeting, I had sex with him. I didn't feel any guilt and if I'm honest I really enjoyed it and I felt incredibly close to him. He's a bottom, not being crude but he likes cock. The sex came later in our hookup and he spent alot of time being close with me before the act so it felt balanced. It felt natural to try and it was incredible....
Jon

 

Yo, bottoming is pure and good.

 

Bottoming fuckin rips!

 

Yeah...but when your newly out, it takes time to feel comfortable and for me to do anal it needs to be someone I feel comfortable with. Luckily with the guy it felt natural to try it.
I'm still at the start of my sexual revolution....

 

This entire thread really resonated with me. We are taught by society that sexual relations between two men is wrong, sinful, shameful, etc. Is it any wonder that many of us have issues with male to male sexuality as we start the process of accepting our homosexuality.
During my initial stages of coming out the idea of intimate relationships with another man was repulsive. Of course this was due to the life long programming we all endure about now a “real” man acts. Even as I started to engage in gay sexuality I was embarrassed and ashamed. Not during the sex acts but after. There was the internal conflict, I absolutely enjoyed oral and anal sex with my BF but afterwards was embarrassed that I was into it that much and ashamed that I wanted more. After all real men didn’t want another “man’s penis in their ass”. Yet here I was craving that intimacy that had alluded me as a straight male.
It took me a while to realize that sex shaming was a real thing. Even in the gay community we down play the fact that we have oral and anal sex with our partners because it makes straight society uncomfortable. Frankly one of the main reasons I am gay is that besides the emotional attachment to men, I prefer men as sexual partners. I am not advocating wearing our sexuality on our sleeve but I think we have to braver and more open about our sexual practices. It will ease the shame and confusion for those that are still coming to terms with their homosexuality. Leave the heteronormative wrongly stereotype ideas on gay sexuality in the trash bin where they belong. Top, bottom or in between its is all perfectly fine as long as you enjoy it. There is absolutely nothing to be ashamed of, gay sexuality is just as normal and healthy as anything hetero. Not to be salacious or provocative on EC but for record I like cock whether orally or anally with my BF and I don’t care how that offends the straight world. It took me awhile to get here but I am not hiding anything about my sexuality ever again.
Wishing everyone EC a Happy , Healty,very Gay New Year. Peace!️‍

 

Another note...

I haven’t seen it mentioned elsewhere, but it might be worth mentioning that anatomy helps make bottoming pleasurable, and there are ways to prepare. It’s pleasurable because the prostate is stimulated from friction while being penetrated, and it helps to be comfortable emotionally with your partner, start with foreplay, use lots of lubricant, go slowly during penetration, and check in with each other during sex to make sure both of you are doing alright. Bottoming may get a bad rap in part because if done hastily or without the right mindset it can be physically (and possibly psychologically) painful. Done right, it’s sheer bliss.

There are a number of posts on how to learn this, so I won’t repeat all of it in detail here.

Patrick

 

Patrick so true!

 

Yes! Even when accepting my sexuality, and recognizing that I want to make love to a man that way, as I mentioned a few posts back almost all common references to it are derogatory and often refer to male on male rape.

i've only played with toys so far, but one my goals is to find a man I can experience this with!

 

It will rock your world. Experiencing the sensuality and erotic pleasure of sex with another man will change you forever. You will never miss anything hetero again. For me is total validation that I was gay.

 

(+1 Contented)

One of the ways I know I’m gay is that I want to be with a male on a really deep emotional, physical, and spiritual (i.e. whole being, not necessarily religious) level. Being gay may have an obvious expression in a different way of having sex, but the desire to be intimate with another person is the same feeling as any heterosexual. When that desire is there, being penetrated is a natural thing to do and feels amazing. On the other hand if I’m trying to become close to someone by having sex, or if that connection isn’t there, that usually doesn’t work.

Patrick

 

So here's how shame works, according to Brene Brown: Guilt is a message from your subconscious, informed by your memory, of harm that you have brought to yourself or someone else: You did wrong. Shame is a message from your memory, the voices of your parents and detractors, telling you that *you* are wrong. Shame is a lie. All this deep, dark cultural stuff is rooted in shame. You in and of yourself are not evil; therefore your natural inclinations and interests are not/cannot be evil. Evil brings harm: Who is harmed by anal sex, because it is anal sex? On the other hand, maybe you get more mileage out of your sins by regretting them. For some people, the sense of sin is the entire draw, would not care one way or another if it were not in a sense shameful, perverted, unspeakable. You might do well to unravel these various threads and see what you get. But you are not evil, all the distaste of the straight world for anal sex is overstated, there's nothing your local pastor wants more than another hour on BigAssBabes -- speaking here, btw, as the guy in church who took care of the pastors' laptops. Yep.

 

I still have these feelings. I didn't realise that I am gay until I was 50 (details in my earlier posts), which was less that 2 years ago. Because 'being straight' was me, for so long, it is taking some adjusting to me 'being gay.' Previously, 'gay people' were 'other people.' Not me.

As opposed to needing another man's hole to feel better?
Since realising I'm gay I have had sex dozens of times, and describe myself as a versatile top. As has been mentioned, being bottom does not mean you are not being dominant. When you are sitting on another man's dick, controlling the angle he enters you at etc, you will know that you are 'using' his dick, every bit as much as he is 'using' using your hole.

Is there any rational reason why you would feel more shame with another real human-being's dick up your ass, than a plastic substitute? Does 'being gay' come down to what (you think) others think of you, rather than following your own deep desires?

I completely understand what you mean by 'being gay,' but consider that we either are gay, or we aren't. The choice comes down to either embracing, or denying, our own sexuality.