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Thirteen Reasons Why

Discussion in 'Entertainment and Technology' started by AlexJames, Apr 13, 2017.

  1. AlexJames

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    I didn't see a thread on it yet so i made one, so i have somewhere to vent about my new favorite show. As much as i thought some parts were corny or poorly thought out, overall i love the show and can't wait for a 2nd season. Its relatable enough and its good some great points to it, and honestly for season 2 if it comes i'm just as invested if not moreso in the present-day cast. Like i wanna know what happens to everyone. I think making a second season would be great, to tell what happens to everybody cause they ended on cliffhangers.

    I love all the little points in the show. Like how Tony follows around Clay to protect him so he's not alone when he gets to his tape. Makes me wonder if he did that for the others. And i like how they play out Alex and Justin's and Jessica's storylines - everyone's too invested in the damn tapes and their own selfishness to notice or care that something's wrong with them. Just like with Hannah, something's wrong with them and nobody picks up on it. Overall, this feels like a netflix version of degrassi the next generation done better. Not perfect but better. Degrassi had the horrible flaw of forgetting its characters' plotlines like two episodes later and making it seem like their problems were totally resolved, which i hated.

    I also loved the inclusiveness of the show. The only inclusive teen show i watched prior was degrassi the next generation and that show was soooo bad about addressing issues. Issues were an episodic thing that got resolved and forgot about. So with only that to go on, this show really amazed me. Courtney's gay but in the closet, that one girl in her class appears to be gay too. Ryan is totally a stereotype but he's gay as is Tony and his boyfriend. Alex made that one off comment i never understood about Justin liking him back then - was that supposed to be sarcasm? I never got that tbh. Like why write that in the script to begin with. And if it was meant to be genuine, again why add it in if its not gonna go anywhere.

    Some of the flashbacks did confuse me though. Like there were 2 or 3 different versions of flashbacks of Justin's second tape and i'm not rewatching the whole series just to figure out which version of events is the one that actually happened. Plus some of the characters still feel shallow and not well developed 13 episodes later. Like Tony - never met his brothers or this sister of his. Alex's mom is never introduced, and you only know he even has one cause Justin asked where his mom was. Alex's dad confused me. Like his son is all 'Yes sir' and shit but his dad is written as being very...lax? lenient? Something like that. It just felt like two different parenting styles in one parent character. I didn't care for Marcus' character i admit but he came off as very undeveloped. (MINOR SPOILER BEGINS) Plus there's a plothole when it comes to the subpoenas that i just couldn't wrap my head around. How they know that one girl texted so and so a few times but don't know about the tapes. How they even got the names to subpoena to begin with. (MINOR SPOILER END).

    (MIGHT BE GRAPHIC OR DISTURBING) I also hated how they did Hannah's death scene. Apparently in the book she died of overdose but in the show they changed it to slitting her wrists. This alone i absolutely hated - its like they changed it for the shock value. I mean realistically, i've read that slitting has a low death rate so i guess if you wanna pick something kids might try and not succeed at then that's the one...but it just left a bad taste in my mouth. They didn't even need to change it but they changed it and admitted they overdid the death scene to make a point about how painful and terrible it is. God try unrealistic. As a self harmer by cutting, even just nearly going deep enough to need stitches hurts like hell. I don't think one could, without ever having cut before, cut deep enough on both arms one of which being injured and actually succeed the first time. The scene could have been just as painful and powerful as it needed to be without changing it like they did. They changed it to something that when i was growing up was an insulting phrase that pretty much was telling cutters to kill themselves - You're going the wrong way. Don't go across the highway go up the highway. (END WARNING HERE)

    I do appreciate though that they made a companion film called Behind the Reasons. I watched it and liked it, and i appreciate the hotline lists in the link on that video for those in crisis.
     
    #1 AlexJames, Apr 13, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 13, 2017
  2. SchizoBurrito13

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    I've been refusing to watch it(I'm stubborn) because I heard that it's really different from the book
     
  3. QuinnA

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    I binged it in one day, and liked it too.

    I think when Alex said Justin used to like him he meant in a friend way, not romantically. And that cause of the whole thing with the tapes he didn't like him any more.

    [TW, suicide mentioned] I also really didn't like the suicide scene. First off I heard they were told by professionals not to show it graphically on scene. And secondly the inaccuracy like you said. The lead up was very emotional and scared me quite a bit, but the actual event felt too fake to me. Like you said, the success rate is low even for people who've attempted before. It felt almost like the show was diminishing how much people struggle with self harm. [End TW]

    All in all I liked it though. And I haven't seen the behind the scenes, but it sounds like I should.
     
  4. AlexJames

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    (spoiler warning; maybe trigger warning)

    Yeah i really liked it too, overall. Minus the suicide scene. Ahh yes that makes sense. I keep telling myself i need to binge watch them again so i get everything i missed the first time. Speaking of, Alex's father's character still confuses me to no end. I hope if they do a season 2 they do Skye justice and listen to the professionals, cause media doesn't discuss self harm much and when they do they really need to get it right.

    Then again Alex's character will be hard to plot a storyline for - how they're gonna make him come back from that, idk. Unless they want to make a point about the reprecussions of unsuccessful suicides. But they had a chance to do that with Hannah's badly done slitting suicide and they didn't. They might just kill him off but i don't want that. I really don't want that.

    I'm interested in if they will confirm that Tyler appeared to be deciding not to keep Alex on his picture hit list, too. Lots of people are buying into a theory that Tyler shot him, but i think the finale is quite clear that Tyler decided not to shoot Alex cause he stood up for him despite not liking him or vice versa. Which i think helps get across the show's theme - everything affects everyone.
     
    #4 AlexJames, Apr 17, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 17, 2017
  5. QuinnA

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    [Possible trigger warning]
    Maybe they couldn't make Hannah's unsuccessful because it's based off the book and in the book it's successful. Maybe they could have Alex in a coma for most of the next series and explore the effects while he's like that? (Similar to Tristan in Degrassi)
    I definitely need to watch it all again now knowing to look for certain things. But it's 13 hours. Though maybe because it's the second viewing I'll be able to pace myself.
    People also think Tyler shot himself because apparently the hair of the person in the ambulance was brown, but I think it's a mistake, because why would the head think it was Alex if it wasn't actually him? (Another thing I'd need to look carefully for)
     
  6. AlexJames

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    I'm liking the Degrassi comparison. I really just want this show to turn into a much better written, not so drawn out version of Degrassi. 13 Reasons Why is, to me, what Degrassi tried to be.

    Yeah i think it would be a good point to have Alex in the hospital or become disabled or something as a result of his suicide attempt. If they want to make the realities of suicide as real and painful as possible, that i think is the route to go - not making him pass away in the hospital.

    LOL idk how ppl could think Tyler shot himself. I mean i thought that the finale made it clear that he brought the gun to add to his stockpile and its heavily implied he wants to kill the other 'tape kids'. Save Alex, cause despite not liking him (and vice versa) Alex still stood up for him to Monty. Which really drives the show's "everything affects everyone" theme imo. Beautiful, really.

    Ugh i really want to write a fanfic but all the character i empathize with are guys. And i'm a girl so writing a guy just doesn't come natural to me. And i refuse to write from Courtney's POV. This just occurred to me but do you think Ryan is aware of Tyler's plot? He knew about Tyler's stalking, i feel like, when Tyler showed him the photos and he picked out the best one which i feel like was heavily implied to be the one that got passed around.
     
  7. AlexJames

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    I am finishing Beyond the Reasons, the companion 'behind the scenes cast and crew interview' type thing made to go with the show. In Beyond the Reasons, Alex's actor Miles H.'s hair is what i can only assume is closer to its natural hair color, which is a shade of brown. Perhaps whatever temporary hair dye they used had already faded by the time they shot this scene? That's all i can come up with. And its canon that Alex dyes his hair anyways cause Jessica mentioned it in conversation to Justin so they just left it as is. That's my explanation anyways.
     
  8. Lazuri

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    Isn't that the show that glamorizes and romanticizes suicide?
     
  9. Embi

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    Far from it, actually. In my opinion, it's very real, painfully real even. It does have some issues and I wouldn't recommend watching it when you are struggling with mental health issues, suicidal thoughts, etc. yourself, but that's because it was made so people without these problems would understand them. And overall they did a good job.
     
  10. ConnectedToWall

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    I don't like the way it ignored the fact that untreated mental illness is the leading cause of suicide and instead tried to make it a anti-bullying show. Obviously bullying is bad, but people who commit suicide tend to do it because of mental illness, not bullying.
     
  11. pinkpanther

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    I watched it, but now that I saw the whole show, I'm not convinced I should have watched it. Skipping it might have been a better thing to do.
     
  12. SomeUsername

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    I've heard a lot of criticisms about the messages of this show. I've heard that it ignores the role of treatable depression and mental illness in suicide and shows suicide as an effective way of punishing your tormentors, which seem like messages that could encourage people to kill themselves instead of getting help. But it seems like a lot of people are praising this show too. I don't know if I should bother watching it.
     
  13. AlexJames

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    Yeah that's my fear too. Lots of people that want to kill themselves don't genuinely want to just die, they just want the pain to end. I've been there quite a few times myself. This show...the idea that you can kill yourself and you'll be talked about and people will regret the way they treated you, and with the whole tapes thing. That encourages it. But the pain shown in Hannah's parents and the affect her death has on, say, Alex for example serve to try to discourage it so idk.
     
  14. Lazuri

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    It might just be me, but if you're writing anything that has to do with suicide at any point, you should immediately ask yourself "is it probable that the way we have written it may make suicide looking appealing to some people or in any way an option for somebody having a tough time?" and if the answer to any of those questions is even something like "it might" then just don't do it.

    Normally, people tend to only commit suicide when they perceive it's the only option that's left to them--that's the only time it truly starts looking like an option in the first place--but if somebody makes it appear as though it ALWAYS is an option, it becomes a lot more enticing. Especially if you can use it as weaponized guilt to get back at everybody who hurt you and just generally make it everybody else's problem!

    Seriously, people go on about "does violent shows cause people to snap and kill people?" but something like this, something that romanticizes suicide and makes it seem like an option--a weapon to use against those who harmed you--is way, WAY fucking worse. Because there's not a question if mentally unstable people are affected by it; they're the only ones who will see it this way and they will do it.

    No, if there's any possibility that somebody will "realize" that suicide is an option from a show like this--and it's probable that somebody will--even if it's just one person, then this show was better off left nonexistent.
     
    #14 Lazuri, Apr 24, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2017
  15. Eveline

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    Truthfully, I probably shouldn't have watched it. The sadness and pain stays with you after you stop watching and everything felt too real, the depictions of rape just left me in shock, 10 minutes after the episode ended I started crying. I've watched films that made me cry throughout the film but after it ended I always felt better, this had the opposite effect on me, I just feel lost and sad now and I was feeling relatively ok earlier.
     
  16. Godless

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    The show was a suicide note dramatized. I don't agree with many of the early episodes because it appeared to blame the suicide on bullying. Like a the romanticized disturbing version you all were talking about. However, by the end you realize it was just a suicide note with context. The last three episodes made the point really well. The problem with the show was just that she blamed other people for her choice. How was it Clays fault that she screamed at him to leave and then his only friend died the same night? He did what any socially awkward kid would, grieve. The cops definitely would have tested the guys blood for alcohol and Clay would have also had a drug test, but I digress. Other than that, the final episode was really powerful in my opinion because it visualized how painful suicide is to the people left behind. I seriously doubt a school counselor would have let her walk out, but overall a great show.
     
  17. MCairo

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    Eh, I seriously doubt someone with suicidal tendencies as strong as hers would make something as elaborate as she did. Also, I don't understand...her school had hundreds of students but she kept involving herself with the same group of people who were always trouble. And there were guys on her list who didn't really do anything.

    I did enjoy the show, but there was too much irrelevant drama.
     
  18. Ghost93

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    I really liked 13 Reasons Why because I found the characters very compelling and the acting mostly top notch.

    However, I think the show is a double-edged sword in terms of its real-life impact on teenagers.

    This show does highlight the need to treat people with respect and to seriously consider how harmful their actions may be to others. The show has opened the doors for a lot of discussions about suicide, rape and bullying. I've heard from people who have used the show to discuss issues they are struggling with to both friends and families.

    On the other hand, I feel that a depressed teenager could take away the wrong message from the series and think that killing themselves and leaving tapes would be a good way to get sympathy and revenge.