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I think I've outlived my reason for my son to bother with me.

Discussion in 'For Parents and Family Members of LGBT People' started by tgboymom, Feb 10, 2017.

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  1. tgboymom

    tgboymom
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    I miss my kid. I hate to say this because I don't want to believe it, but I think since I've provided the doctors and medications and surgery, he no long has a use for me.

    Is this normal? I only have one child... so I don't have prior experience.

    I just sent him and his partner's Valentines presents, and it was like pulling teeth for them to go to the office to get the box. It was a big box so the post office brings it to the main office of the apartment complex rather than leaving it at the mail boxes and it's only a short block up the street from their apartment.

    Have I outlived my usefulness? :confused: I can see this kind of stuff from teenagers, but not from 30 year olds. I guess it's my problem... it's just a matter of how to get over it.

    ahhhhhhhhhhhhh pffffffffffft
     
    #1 tgboymom, Feb 10, 2017
  2. I'm gay

    I'm gay
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    Hi Lori,

    Kind of like empty nest all over again, huh?

    I understand your feelings of no longer being useful to Jake. He's behaving like a normal child, though, and I think you understand that. He has his life to lead.

    One difficulty for you is the distance between you. Is there any possibility of moving to where he is? I know how badly you want to be a regular part of his life, but that's difficult to do with so many miles between you both.

    Another possibility might be to set up a weekly Skype call? That would let you see him regularly.

    I wish I had better answers for you, but I do understand your feelings.
     
    #2 I'm gay, Feb 10, 2017
  3. Chip

    Chip
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    This has got to be painful and difficult and uncomfortable for you.

    There isn't enough information to go on to fully understand the situation, but one thought that comes to mind (this from memory of some of your previous posts) is that your relationship with him may have been somewhere on the codependent spectrum.

    Codependent relationships are marked by over-identification with, and caretaking by, the codependent enabler, and a willingness to be taken care of by the codependent. To be clear, it can be difficult to understand the line between "healthy supportive relationships" and "codependent" relationships. But I seem to remember your taking a lot of the responsibility for finding the doctors and treatment and so forth for your son, which is a typical hallmark of a codependent enabler.

    I'm not saying this as a judgment; enablers (of which I'm a recovering one) mean well, and genuinely want the best for the person they're taking care of. The problem is, enablers derive their sense of purpose and self-worth from their caretaking. When the dependent begins to heal and stand on his own feet, and exert his independence, the enabler typically gets angry and resentful because s/he no longer feels needed.

    The problem with the enabler relationship is that self-worth and esteem is derived from the caretaking, so when it is no longer needed, the enabler feels taken advantage of, or ripped off, or hurt.

    If this is the case, what's really going on is that one person (the dependent) is becoming healthier, so there's an opportunity for the enabler to also examine and explore who they are and also become healthier (and get better at taking care of him/herself.)

    I don't know if this matches your situation, but it is the first thought that came to mind from my limited understanding of your situation. If it resonates for you, then I can suggest, first, the wonderful book "Facing Codependence" by Pia Mellody.

    Second, this is the sort of thing where a therapist can be absolutely amazing. Having a trained professional to talk about what's going on for you can be really powerful and effective in encouraging you to understand your own issues and experiences, and put your relationship with your son into context. As you become more comfortable and understand your own self-concept, you'll find that you can re-establish a new, different, and much healthier relationship with your son.

    I hope that (if this is on the mark) that it helps.
     
    #3 Chip, Feb 11, 2017
  4. Lynz

    Lynz
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    Hello lovely Lori,

    Please PLEASE tell Jake how you are feeling. I now you are an awesome person, so I know he must be too. Tell him. I know he will jump right in to talking to you more.

    I know u dont have skype or facebook, so I'll recommend it again - I have a best best friend in London and a best best friend in Canada. Skype and Facetime are free video call apps. U can download onto any computer, phone, device these days. Then video call as much as you and Jake can :slight_smile: it's so good. My mate in London carried me round her home yesterday to show me her new decorations lol. Another time she did the same for her new puppy. Video callsssss. Do itttttt.

    Also, remember we all love u and are always here for you xxxxxxxxxx
     
    #4 Lynz, Feb 11, 2017
  5. tgboymom

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    yep... empty nest for sure. I can't afford to move out there alone. My husband won't come. Besides... if he's hardly bothering with me now, it'll be much worse if I'm nearby and he still doesn't bother with me.

    There's more..........................the discrimination...and not even by strangers!

    I almost drove out there to beat the living hell out of his partner's father the other day and Jake begged me not to.

    He told Jake that he deserves what he gets because he knew what he was getting into by transitioning.

    What REALLY got me is that he was put down for his Jewish last name. Jake is a born again Christian, but Jewish by birthright... his father is Jewish and he was taught both and to respect both. Jake had to sit there and listen to his father being called names for being a Jew......which translates to Jake. I'm assuming that man considers his son gay since his partner is a guy.

    I called him the next day and told him that I want him to come back here NOW... where I can protect him. He said "what aout Tim"? I said... do you think he's any safer with a father like that? He can come too. Then there's the "what about school"? "There are OTHER schools"

    This is more than empty nest.... it's fear.

    ---------- Post added 12th Feb 2017 at 05:30 AM ----------


    There's more.... please read my first reply. I agree with the codependency... but there's more.

    ---------- Post added 12th Feb 2017 at 05:37 AM ----------

    There's discrimination there too, darling...... it's a huge reason why I want him away from his partner's family. His partner is welcome here. I have several acres. i can put another house on it, i have guns and I know how to fight. i don't think they are safe out there.
     
    #5 tgboymom, Feb 12, 2017
  6. Lynz

    Lynz
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    Hiya!

    Well what a complete dick!!!! The father i mean.

    Has Jake spoken to Tim about it? Tim really needs to have serious words with his father. He does not have any right to talk to Jake in that way. Did Tim stand up for Jake when it was it said?

    God, my wifey stands up for me in a heartbeat with family. She immediately cuts off discriminating family though. Her (our) 20 year old nephew commented on a gay male couple at our wedding reception. He got booted out of the room. Heeheehee.

    Tim has to learn he needs to protect Jake too.

    Pftttt rough times. Keep talking it out xxx
     
    #6 Lynz, Feb 12, 2017
  7. Chip

    Chip
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    Hi,

    I can imagine how difficult this all is for you. In helping you, though, one phrase absolutely jumped out at me...

    This is some of the most serious, controlling codependent enabling behavior I've seen. Your son is 30 years old. Let that sink in. It is not your role to protect him. It would be grossly inappropriate for him to move back in with you, or to "let you protect him." If you are feeling distance from him, this may be why. He's trying to be independent, and you are aggressively trying to maintain the codependency.

    Yes, the behavior by his partner's family is inexcusable. But the solution isn't for him to move back in with you, where you'll have more ability to control him and continue enabling him. The solution is for him (with or without his partner) to move away from his partner's family, and learn to solve the problems in life himself. If he doesn't learn this, then what is he going to do when you aren't around any more to solve the problems for him?

    I know this may sound harsh, but what you are describing is pretty severe codependency that is really, really unhealthy for both of you, and as he gets healthier, it will completely destroy your relationship if you don't work on your part of it. I would strongly suggest therapy with a clinician with extensive experience with codependency and family systems.

    This is a solvable problem, and as difficult as it seems now, you will be a lot happier when you are able to better manage the codependency and controlling behavior.
     
    #7 Chip, Feb 12, 2017
  8. tgboymom

    tgboymom
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    I AGREE... it sounds CONTROLLING! This is my child!!! MY ONLY CHILD! They do not live WITH Tim's father. The father lives on a farm and the kids live in the city. Tim has a sister and a nephew who live on the farm in their own home as well. My child and Tim are not welcome to live on the farm.... and that's fine. What I worry about is if his father is anti-LGBT and hates Jewish people as well, how many of his father's friends are of like mind and what will those anti-Semitic/anti-LGBT people do to my kid! They go out there for family reunions and to see the sister and nephew and do the usual "visit the father" thing. They ALL knew him before he transitioned so even though he LOOKS like a man, in their minds he is a woman. I'm scared for my kid's life!

    Yes..... I did say come back NOW, but I didn't mean to live with me. I have several acres and have offered to build a home for them on it. Hell.. they never have to run into me! lol Jake will inherit everything anyway and I'm not getting any younger and Jake's father (co-owner) is 70!

    I agree with you that my behavior is controlling, but I assure you that it is born of fear. My mother was extremely controlling and I swore that I wouldn't do to Jake what was done to me. When Jake decided to move out, I even said to him "I will not do to you what grandma did to me. If this is what you want, I will not make it difficult for you and will help in any way I can". And.. I helped with the move. I went furniture shopping as well as other furnishings and paid for it to make it easier on them. When I tried to move out, my mother blocked the door to try to keep me from leaving and said "oh no you're not leaving me stuck without your pay check". I told her I'd give her all of my money, I just wanted out. I swore I'd never make it so tough on my kid. What I'm saying might sound controlling, but how can I agree with allowing my child to be in danger? Could any mother?

    You sound like you know what you are talking about ...... what would you recommend I say/do to help remove/protect him from this dangerous situation? :bang:

    ---------- Post added 13th Feb 2017 at 07:22 AM ----------

    It pisses Tim off.... but that's as far as it goes. What can he do... that's his father and he loves his father. I suggested that Jake does not join him when the extended family gathers for reunions and such. He said he actually already told Tim that he'd rather not expose himself to such disrespect.

    Tim's father doesn't know me very well. He needs to cut the shit or I'll start some!
     
    #8 tgboymom, Feb 13, 2017
  9. Lynz

    Lynz
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    No disrespect, but Tim needs to grow a pair. He must stand up to his dad. He is an adult. His dad must understand that. He must not disrepect his son's choice of partner. Tim not standing up for Jake is not being a loving partner.

    If it were the other way around, would you be annoyed if Jake stood up for Tim? Or would you allow him to stand up for his love? To teach you when you are being wrong, when you are being cruel?

    Tell Jake to tell Tim to have a word.
     
    #9 Lynz, Feb 13, 2017
  10. tgboymom

    tgboymom
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    I'm getting afraid of saying anything about anything. I'm controlling and codependent and all sorts of things that aren't good for my kid.

    I know I was controlling when I refused to pay for the surgery unless he came HERE to have it and recover. I knew it and I knew how bad he wanted the surgery and I used it so I could be sure he'd have proper post surgical care..... and he ended up feeling glad about it because he was fed and medicated and cleaned properly and as his healing progressed he had two parties in his honor and met some great folks and had a pretty good time for a guy who just had a double mastectomy.

    I am probably a bad mother in most respects... but there is one thing no one in the world can convince me of... and that's how much I love my kid. I don't have to convince him of that.... he knows I'm ALWAYS on his side.. 100% unconditional love.

    I guess fear of what will/can happen to my kid is just something I'm going to learn to have to live with.
     
    #10 tgboymom, Feb 14, 2017
  11. Chip

    Chip
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    To your 30 year old adult son, not your kid". This is something that is within your son's responsibility to deal with.

    For you to build a home for Jake to live in would be codependent
    For Jake to come and live on your property would put you in a position of power and control; it is your house, your property. It would not be emotionally healthy. There's a huge difference between living on a property bequeathed to you, and living on a property under your parents control, subject to whatever rules/expectations/oversight/concern is imposed by said parents.

    Then that's something you need to work out in therapy. You don't need to saddle your son with your lack of boundaries. Your fear is your problem, not your son's. He is not obligated to live with you, tell you what he's doing, tell you what worries he has, or anything else... he is a 30 year old adult capable of taking care of himself and making his own decisions.

    Good words, except...

    All of these are somewhat enabling under the circumstances. Sure, they were done with the intent to help, but in your case, the line between codependency and healthy boundaries and reasonable parental assistance is nonexistent.

    Parents cannot (and should not) control their adult children's behavior, make their decisions for them, or assess what risks their children do or do not want to take. Healthy parents can detach and let their children make their own decisions and face their own consequences.

    Share your concern, and leave him, without undue influence, to make the decision that he feels is the right one for him, and support him in whatever decision he makes. And get into therapy yourself, as soon as possible, to work on your issues with control and codependency.
     
    #11 Chip, Feb 15, 2017
  12. tgboymom

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    Yea... well.. thank you for the advice. We've all been through a lot here and sometimes I get a bit melancholy. I'm sorry for burdening you folks with that. I take it here so I don't take it to him. I will make every attempt not to do that again!
     
    #12 tgboymom, Feb 16, 2017
  13. I'm gay

    I'm gay
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    Hi Lori,

    Chip's opinion here is just that - his opinion. It doesn't reflect the opinions of everyone here or of EC itself. Please don't think that your posts aren't valuable here or that you are burdening anyone with your desire to seek help and guidance.

    I don't know if Chip is a father or not, but I am, and I see things a little differently than he does. I have read all of your posts and the responses during the time you've been posting here. I don't see controlling and co-dependent. I see you doing what mothers do, especially when your child is hurting. You've been a fierce advocate for him, and you obviously want to be a part of his life. Why wouldn't you?

    I see nothing wrong with your offer of building him a house on the family property. That kind of arrangement has been occurring throughout history, and no one worried that the parents were "controlling" just because multiple families lived on the same land.

    With all of that said, however, you must respect Jake's wishes for his life. I think it's fine for you to offer these ideas for him, but ultimately it will need to be his decision. Whatever that decision is, please respect it.

    I do worry about you, though. I can see the toll all of this is having on you. Please consider some therapy for yourself if you haven't already done so. I think it can help you with everything you have gone through. It's not until all the chaos and activity dies down that we begin to process how we feel about it - and that's what's happening now. So, combining your feelings of your son's surgery and transitioning with your feelings of fear, acceptance, worry, guilt, and now abandonment, it's time to work on yourself too.

    You matter too. We're here for you. :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:ride:
     
    #13 I'm gay, Feb 16, 2017
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