1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Another female experience...and what do I do with this anger I'm feeling?

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by caliwoman, Dec 25, 2016.

  1. caliwoman

    caliwoman Banned

    Joined:
    May 3, 2016
    Messages:
    364
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Gender:
    Female
    Sexual Orientation:
    Straight but curious
    In the past, I've had trouble even getting angry at women who have treated me poorly. Men I can see clearly and judge the situation accurately. Women? Not so much. If a woman treats me poorly and I communicate that to her- in the very gentle, push-over way I do it- I always feel guilty and beg them for their forgiveness.

    Basically, if they screw me over, I tell them very delicately that I'm upset, then when they get upset because they aren't accustomed to me voicing my displeasure, they get pissed and I apologize.

    I sound like Hooks from Police Academy. Very gentle and co-dependent, because God forbid a woman who is bad for me, leave my life.

    I had another experience with the first woman I was with. During our first brief interaction, she had jokingly called me a bottom. Not sure if anyone remembers, but it's that woman.

    Last week, she text messaged me out of the blue. Said she had come across one of my pics and was thinking of me. I texted her back that I think of her, too. The last time she and I spoke, I had asked her for an open and honest conversation and if should could please take down her walls for five minutes to do so. This ended with her telling me, "You're making me so uncomfortable right now! So uncomfortable!" and hung up on me.

    1.5 months later, she text messages out of the blue.

    We begin chatting and it turns romantic. We still have feelings for one another and we think of each other sexually. I tell her I'd like to see her again and she agrees. I ask to see her the day after X-Mas, on Monday when she's off, and she agrees. Our talk turns sexual and we talk for 5 hours that night and text until 3am. She tells me what she'd like to do to me and vice versa. And the best part is she sounds different, more emotionally unavailable, but when I ask her why she hung up on me on the previous occasion, she tells me it was because I cussed her out. I'm confused because this isn't true, I'd never cuss her out. I chalk it up to her not remembering things right.

    The next day, when I want to cement our plans (I live near Palm Springs, she lives in San Diego and it's a 2.5 hour drive out there), I tell her I'm thinking about getting a hotel late on Sunday and staying out there with her on Monday. She balks.
    "I'm not quite sure of my plans, but woo-hoo, one of my friends is coming out here!"

    Huh? We just made plans for me to come out. This should have been a GIANT RED FLAG for me, but again, I proceed.

    I tell her that I have to start arranging my schedule, because I do have to leave her X-Mas day and need to get a hotel. She dismisses it and says she understands, but she doesn't have a set schedule. She seems VERY wary of me getting a hotel room.

    She's freaking out again, just like she did the first time we spoke. It's like she's great over the phone and our connection is awesome, but in person or when real plans are cemented, she becomes gun-shy and looks for a way out. I make the bad decision of telling her, "I'm going out today. It can be relaxed, we can hang out, no pressure." She has this thing about feeling pressure of an expectation and will wiggle out of plans to avoid it. Although now I know I shouldn't have done this, I think (at the time) that going out there on short notice will alleviate that. Big mistake.

    She finally agrees to let me go out there and see her as long as I agree to no expectations. I'm not sure if that means no expectations of anything romantic or physical happening, although she and I nearly had phone sex the night before. I tell her I'll pick up her up and we can go driving along the coast and chat, or even sit out on the beach and talk. She doesn't want this. She prefers somewhere with people, she says. She wants to go to a restaurant or a crowded bar. Anything to avoid being one-on-one with me. She's even uncomfortable with me picking her up and being alone in the car...
     
  2. BrookeVL

    Full Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2016
    Messages:
    2,157
    Likes Received:
    293
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Gender:
    Female (trans*)
    Gender Pronoun:
    She
    Sexual Orientation:
    Lesbian
    Out Status:
    Out to everyone
    Sounds like a big red flag to me. I would tell her; "Look, either I come over and we hang out or we're done for good. I'm tired of these games."
     
  3. Creativemind

    Regular Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2015
    Messages:
    3,281
    Likes Received:
    411
    Location:
    Somewhere
    Gender:
    Other
    Gender Pronoun:
    Other
    Sexual Orientation:
    Other
    Out Status:
    Out to everyone
    Noooope. I would ditch her. She's the definition of unavailable and I don't even know why you'd waste your time.
     
  4. caliwoman

    caliwoman Banned

    Joined:
    May 3, 2016
    Messages:
    364
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Gender:
    Female
    Sexual Orientation:
    Straight but curious
    Continued...

    After much back-and-forth, I tell her that she seems to be very avoidant of one-on-one time with me and that she seems to need an amount of wiggle room to feel comfortable. She admits to needing an escape exit but doesn't elaborate why.

    Throughout the day, she keeps texting me about our plans. She wants to know exactly what we are doing. She wants to go to a bar, a restaurant, but dismisses plans that include us walking and talking and tries to avoid me having to pick her up. We've already been physical in the past and our convos usually end up x-rated and have had phone sex.

    I tell her to calm down, it'll be okay, and I'll see her at 6:30pm. The texts continue until I tell her, "I remember you once telling me you'd like to give up control. Let's try that now. Okay??"

    She hems and haws, but finally agrees. I drive out there later than expected and during rush hour.

    Half way in, she texts. Then calls. They are all the same, pushing me away.
    An hour away she tells me she might just take a nap.
    Thirty minutes away, she tells me she might take her roomie with her to go to a bar and shoot pool and that she'll meet me there.

    ---------- Post added 25th Dec 2016 at 01:18 PM ----------

    When I finally arrive at the restaurant, she's not there. She had just told me she was driving over. Nope. She's not answering her phone. Finally, she picks up and tells me she's "ubering it" and will be here shortly. I ask her if she's been drinking and she replies that she has and "well, what do you wanna do" inferring that we might not see each other. WTH???? I'm pissed and tell her that it took me nearly 3 hours but that I'm here now and to get her butt over.

    Finally, she arrives and I hug her, but she's stiff. We get in the car to look for the bar she suggested to shoot pool and I ask to hold her hand (remember, we've been talking romantically and xxx-rated and have already been physical. Just the day before we discussed having sex). She agrees to hold hands, but her hand is limp and not very tight on mine.

    We drive to the pool hall and it's so loud and full of people, I can't even hear her. We drive back to the restaurant and go inside. She tells me, "Okay, I'm being open and honest with you right now. Ask me anything you want." I kinda don't know what to ask because since we've already spoken for hours and hours, it's not like a new date. I do ask questions and she does open up which is nice to see. She tells me I'm stand offish, but it's because I"m exhausted and the way she acted with me on the drive there.

    Again, she asks me to ask her anything. One of my final questions is, "So why do you need that wiggle room" and that's it. SHe's not happy. "We've already talked about this, why do we need to talk about it again?" and with that, she makes a face I've seen her do before and shuts down. I can see it in her eyes, she's done.

    I'm ready to leave and she's not done with her third glass of wine. She asks me a few questions, like if I dabble with my straight friends, if I still live with my ex (I tell her that I am not), if my ex and I still sleep together, and then again, asks me if I'm still living with him (like she doesn't trust me).

    We leave, get in the car and then abruptly she says, "I don't feel you were very engaged tonight. I couldn't tell by your eyes. The connection just isn't there. I can offer you friendship. Take me home."

    It took me nearly 3 hours to get there and after a 40 minute dinner, that's it. She is done with me.
     
  5. BrookeVL

    Full Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2016
    Messages:
    2,157
    Likes Received:
    293
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Gender:
    Female (trans*)
    Gender Pronoun:
    She
    Sexual Orientation:
    Lesbian
    Out Status:
    Out to everyone
    Wow. What a Bitch. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life girl.
     
  6. caliwoman

    caliwoman Banned

    Joined:
    May 3, 2016
    Messages:
    364
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Gender:
    Female
    Sexual Orientation:
    Straight but curious
    We've spent months missing each other, picked up right were we left off, talked for hours, it got romantic, nearly had phone sex, now this? And I'm still freakin' trying.

    I'm telling her, "This is it? Really?

    She says, "I opened up to you tonight. I was very genuine and honest about something that only three other people know of and you were not engaged."
    She mentions me being on my cell phone, but I wasn't. I was only checking the percentage of my battery, but when I told her she said, "Is your ex texting you? There's a charger in the car."

    I ask her to hang out for a half an hour more. She balks. After some talking, she agrees and then says, "You have 27 minutes left" Later she says that she was just joking about this and I took it the wrong way.

    We drive around and start chatting. Again, I ask to hold her hand and she agrees. I admit I'm being the aggressor when it comes to physical contact. I'm thinking that maybe we can just be FWB, but when I go to kiss her, she squirms away and tells me to knock it off.
    Why I'm acting so desperate to someone like this, I dunno. Apparently, I like the pain.

    ---------- Post added 25th Dec 2016 at 01:29 PM ----------

    We get a flat tire and I have to wait for AAA to come out. When the tow truck arrives, she crouches down next to the driver and talks to him as he changes the tire. She stays away from me as much as she can and I'm like WTF.

    I go to her and say, "You can't even stand next to me?"
    She says, "But I want to watch him change the tire so I can learn."

    We talk for a bit and I compliment her recent weight loss and tell her that she looks pretty. She says, "I went from beautiful to adorable and now pretty? I guess I'm getting downgraded."
    I tell her she looks hot and then says, "I don't know what that means."

    We get in the car and start driving again. Since she opened up about some traumatic experiences earlier, I ask her light questions like where she went to college or to show me her high school. She balks again and asks me why I want to know.

    Eventually, she answers and we're holding hands. Still, I'm hoping we can be FWB, I'm that desperate for physical contact with a woman and she's the only one I have any interest in.

    ---------- Post added 25th Dec 2016 at 01:32 PM ----------

    She doesn't divulge too much, but then she starts telling me about how her dad didn't think she was very pretty and that it always scarred her. I'm confused. She deflects about where she went to high school but wants to talk about that?

    We continue driving and I kiss her hand. She moans a little. I kiss her hand a little more, then lick it. She moans even more, then stops and changes her tune. "Why are you doing that?" she asks.

    "Did you mind it"
    "Well...no."

    We continue driving and I lick her hand again and she stops talking (she likes it, I can tell). She gathers herself and continues. I take out her index finger and suck on it and then she really moans and stops talking. I get her middle finger and suck on that one and again, she moans, but then changes pace. "Why are you doing that?" she says.

    "Did you like it?"
    "Yes."
    "Then just go with it? Or do you want me to stop."
    "You can keep going."

    ---------- Post added 25th Dec 2016 at 01:36 PM ----------

    I suck on her fingers with more intensity and she likes it. I'm driving and use my sweater to wipe them off, gently, during the times I can't suck on them. I see a side to her I rarely see when she says, "You can leave them wet." She says it softly, unguarded. It's those glimpses of someone very soft, that I'm trying to see more of.

    I lick her fingers more and then bring her hands closer to me. I ask her if she'd like to touch me. She has always said she's not the initiator of things, even before we met, and that the other person has be the one to initiate. So I do.

    She brings her hand up to my breast and I reassure her that I won't freak out this time, like I did last time (I had never had a female experience before). Then she asks, "Why aren't you going to freak out?!"

    "Because it feels good. Do you want to?"

    She starts to feel me up and we start to mess around.

    ---------- Post added 25th Dec 2016 at 01:40 PM ----------

    I arch my back and she leans up to start kissing my breast. I kiss her forehead gently and moan. She reaches over, on her own, and starts to try and finger me over my pants. We do this for a bit until a car approaches.

    Once the coast is clear, we do it again. She's trying her hardest to finger me over my pants and get me to orgasm, but I'm not even really liking it. It feels like work. I make an excuse that a car is driving up and almost have to pull her hand off of me.
    I go to feel her up briefly and her nipple gets hard right away, but she removes my hand. I massage her breast over her shirt and she moves my hand. "Can't I touch you" i ask, but she doesn't answer.

    Then she says, "You've gone too far" and asks me to make a u-turn. We stop briefly and unlike last time when I just went for a kiss, I ask her if I can kiss her, thinking with her trying to make me orgasm, it would be okay. She says, "You just made it awkward. Now I'm VERY uncomfortable."

    ---------- Post added 25th Dec 2016 at 01:47 PM ----------

    Now I'm just so confused that I'm fed up. I take her home.

    I tell her that I'm ready to let her go, now. That I tried. I reveal all of my feelings to her and tell her how deeply I felt. I'm telling her my goodbye. We hold hands and i share a song with her that makes me think of her. I tell her that the last time when I said I only wanted to be casual FWB, that I didn't really feel that way and wanted more of a deeper relationship. She says, "Then why didn't you say so then?"
    She's so sincere, but I'm confused because we're in the car together NOW and she doesn't want me in that way.

    As I say my goodbye, she strokes my face and my hair. As I drop her off, I tell her to "Come here" and give me a hug. We give each other a kiss on the lips goodbye.
    She's standing outside of my car and asks me to text her when I get home. I tell her that it's okay, I promise to be safe and that I'll be fine.

    "Can't you just text me when you get home."
    "No, I'm okay," I reply.
    "Just text me."
    "I promise I'm okay. Plus John (my ex) will call me on the way to check on me." She knows he and I are still friends and that he's very protective of me.
    "See! You would have ALWAYS thrown that it my face!"

    I'm confused. I didn't say it in a mean way or to throw it in her face. She already knows that my ex is very protective of me in a watchful kinda way. She's angry and I'm taken aback.

    "No, I'm not throwing it in your face. You know that everyone calls him my bodyguard and he's already asked me to call him on the way home."
    "See!! It would have always been this way! I would have never been able to live that down!"
    "Huh?"

    She continues to ask me to call her and if she'll ever hear from me again. I tell her I have to go. I drove home and at 3am, she texts and asks if I made it home okay.
     
  7. Creativemind

    Regular Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2015
    Messages:
    3,281
    Likes Received:
    411
    Location:
    Somewhere
    Gender:
    Other
    Gender Pronoun:
    Other
    Sexual Orientation:
    Other
    Out Status:
    Out to everyone
    This woman has emotional problems....even just a FWB sounds like it would lead to drama. She is very passive aggressive and can't be clear about what she wants. Would be a huge turn off for me.
     
  8. scouse

    Regular Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    140
    Likes Received:
    5
    Location:
    uk
    Gender:
    Female
    Gender Pronoun:
    She
    Sexual Orientation:
    Gay
    Out Status:
    Out to everyone
    I dont know, from the off it seems to me like this woman didnt want physical contact. Shes stalling right up to the meet, wants to be in a busy place and not alone, not particularly responsive to hand holding or kissing, very wary about the hotel. Im not saying there havent been mixed signals and it seems like communication, in a direct way, has been an issue. It just seems to me like she was hesitant from the off. If someones stalling and umming and arring before the meet id call it quits as theyre not saying what they really want and thats going to be confusing to respond to.
     
  9. caliwoman

    caliwoman Banned

    Joined:
    May 3, 2016
    Messages:
    364
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Gender:
    Female
    Sexual Orientation:
    Straight but curious
    When we got into it, I had thave practically peel her off of me. She kept trying to finger me to bring me to orgasm. I had to tell her repeatedly that a car was and to move her hand away from my pubic area and it was then that she finally let go and stopped kissing my exposed breasts.

    I do get what ur saying, but when the action began, she didn't wanna get off of me.



    ---------- Post added 26th Dec 2016 at 11:08 AM ----------

    Excuse the typos above
     
  10. scouse

    Regular Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    140
    Likes Received:
    5
    Location:
    uk
    Gender:
    Female
    Gender Pronoun:
    She
    Sexual Orientation:
    Gay
    Out Status:
    Out to everyone
    I would find the whole thing pretty confusing in your shoes, i must say. People who push/pull are hard work! So are games. I dont think she knows what she wants or isnt communicating it in any event, which isnt fair to you. People need to be consistent in how they present, else youll never know where you stand. Like i say, hard work! Id leave her be and move on to someone nore assured in what they want and in hearing you.
     
  11. caliwoman

    caliwoman Banned

    Joined:
    May 3, 2016
    Messages:
    364
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Gender:
    Female
    Sexual Orientation:
    Straight but curious
    Yes, I very much agree that she has no idea what she wants. Nothing I could say or do would please her. It's like she looked for reasons to fight with me.
     
  12. Mr B

    Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2015
    Messages:
    94
    Likes Received:
    24
    Location:
    London
    She seems to want you but she is an extremely insecure person, you will need to be very patient and persistent to gain her trust, but if you fancy her then why not? Just try to let things develop very slowly at her own pace as with a scared kitten, let time be on your side, don't worry she is already yours, just don't push things as she is easily scared away. Just be nice to her and let her come to you. In the end, great rewards await as she will be the most devout partner ever. Don't wanna sound like some sort of clarvoyant or too machiavellian and I might be completely wrong here, this is just my best guess, this is just what I would try to do if I were in your situation. Good luck!
     
  13. Anthemic

    Full Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    1,890
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Alabama
    Gender:
    Female
    Gender Pronoun:
    She
    Sexual Orientation:
    Lesbian
    Out Status:
    Some people
    Honestly, fuck this girl. But not literally. She sounds like she has issues and I'm willing to bet she will end up messing with your head more than you're willing to stomach. She sounds like she has major commitment issues, and that she strings you along for her own ego. It's like she wants to talk on her own terms (probably when she's feeling low), and then she boosts her ego with your very obvious interest in her.

    I know it's hard to let her go. She knows exactly what to say to keep you coming back; like calling you "bottom". I bet that just makes you quiver all over. I know it would do that to me. But eventually, you're going to get fed up with this kind of bullshit. It took me years to finally stop putting up with these wishy-washy mind games. I got sick of being a punching bag and an ego boost. I want something stable. And you know what? I fucking deserve it. I give so much to people and I do not deserve to be treated like a toy that's only fun for a while. And neither do you.

    Do not put up with this. I know from experience that this girl will keep hurting you. She "misses" you when you stop talking to her. But then when you become invested in her again, she pulls away. If she really liked you, she'd do just about anything to have you.
     
  14. caliwoman

    caliwoman Banned

    Joined:
    May 3, 2016
    Messages:
    364
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Gender:
    Female
    Sexual Orientation:
    Straight but curious
    I'm so angry at her for this hot-and-cold BS. This is a first for me. Usually, I make excuses for these kinda people. It's a first for me to feel this anger. I kinda don't know what to do with it.
     
  15. wrhinla

    Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2016
    Messages:
    47
    Likes Received:
    11
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Gender:
    Male
    Sexual Orientation:
    Gay
    She sounds very neurotic and ambivalent about her sexuality. I would take a pass on her, if I were you. You have enough to deal with; she would only complicate your life tenfold.

    ---------- Post added 29th Dec 2016 at 10:30 PM ----------

    As for the anger you're feeling, I think you have every right to be angry. So go ahead and be angry.
     
  16. Anthemic

    Full Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    1,890
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Alabama
    Gender:
    Female
    Gender Pronoun:
    She
    Sexual Orientation:
    Lesbian
    Out Status:
    Some people
    Did you contact her again? This seems like nothing but an endless, toxic web of drama and bullshit. It's easy for me to tell you to run as fast as you can, because I have no feelings for this woman. But do the best you can to stay away from her.
     
  17. BrookeVL

    Full Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2016
    Messages:
    2,157
    Likes Received:
    293
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Gender:
    Female (trans*)
    Gender Pronoun:
    She
    Sexual Orientation:
    Lesbian
    Out Status:
    Out to everyone
    Just be careful hon, I don't want to see you hurt....
     
  18. caliwoman

    caliwoman Banned

    Joined:
    May 3, 2016
    Messages:
    364
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Gender:
    Female
    Sexual Orientation:
    Straight but curious
    I did not. The last time I spoke to her was one week ago and we ended then, permanently. She didn't apologize for anything, chalked up most of her comments to just "joking around," said she shouldn't have gotten physical with me and called me "really mean" for mentioning that my ex-husband was going to check on me during my drive home.

    ---------- Post added 30th Dec 2016 at 09:34 PM ----------

    Thank you, friend. She and I had a blow-up like none before it, so we're done. I actually requested that we both block each other on her phones, but she refused to block me even though she was the one who ended it because she said I wasn't capable of being friends because I was "too back and forth."
     
  19. BrookeVL

    Full Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2016
    Messages:
    2,157
    Likes Received:
    293
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Gender:
    Female (trans*)
    Gender Pronoun:
    She
    Sexual Orientation:
    Lesbian
    Out Status:
    Out to everyone

    Thank you, friend. She and I had a blow-up like none before it, so we're done. I actually requested that we both block each other on her phones, but she refused to block me even though she was the one who ended it because she said I wasn't capable of being friends because I was "too back and forth."[/QUOTE]

    Then why keep your number? This woman confuses me.
     
  20. Anthemic

    Full Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    1,890
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Alabama
    Gender:
    Female
    Gender Pronoun:
    She
    Sexual Orientation:
    Lesbian
    Out Status:
    Some people
    She's saying you're too back in forth? She sounds mental... Because it's HER that is too back and forth. I could not put up with someone like this. This is just too much... :dry: