Hi. I just want to say first of all, thank you to this amazing forum. It has helped me so much over the past couple of days, with something that I've been holding in for the past 9 or so years. I have recently come to terms with who I am, but deep down it truly hurts. Why? Because I'm Christian. Growing up, I been told and preached that being gay is a sin. Being a Christian, I must admit that I haven't gone to church for a couple years, but I still have the faith. So a part of me is telling me that I will never be accepted for who I am, or that I will go to hell when I die. But the other part of me is telling me that God made me who I am. He didn't make a mistake. Why would God make someone gay if it's a sin? Being that I am older (22), and have meet new friends from college (basically new influences is what I mean), I have been exposed to all new things instead of only 2 things; parents/family and church. Over those 9 years, I have tried to repress my feelings for guys, but I always caved in and masturbated to gay porn. To this day I still do, but I have finally come to terms that I am gay (I prefer guys, but I do get crushes on girls here and there. I would prefer to marry a woman and have kids, but my sexuality towards guys is SOOOO STRONG). Without trying to say anymore, and making this post extremely long, can I get some feedback from some people who have something to say about this, or at least someone who was brought up in a Christian household and has come to terms with who they are; gay? I am finally happy for once in my life accepting that I am who I am, but it still hurts because I'm scared; scared of being Christian and gay, and being around family who can be homophobes at times.
The feeling of being frightened at the intersection of your spirituality and sexuality is one that I know well. I grew up in conservative [usually Southern] Baptist churches most of my life, although I don't remember the anti-gay rhetoric being in the past at the fever pitch it's reached today. In fact, I still live in a largely Christian community that is antagonistic to all things non-straight and non-cisgender. Having arrived at some semblance of inner peace about being gay, I still live with the fear of being outed to the bigots in my life and the uncertainty about my future in my present locale. With that said, if your faith gives you peace and comfort, you don't have to let go of it to come to peace with your sexuality. There is an abundance of material on Youtube about faith and sexuality, but I'll paste links to a few resources that helped me come to terms with the religious and gay parts of who I am. "Through My Eyes" by the Gay Christian Network interviews LGBT people who are Christians and shares their struggles and how they came to terms with their faith and sexuality. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QImNx1JA3BI If you want a more academic approach to why the Christian scriptures don't actually say that you're going to hell for being gay, you may find this talk ("The Gay Debate: The Bible and Homosexuality") by Matthew Vines enlightening: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezQjNJUSraY If you want to get super deep into a thoroughly academic approach, look for anything by James Brownson, like this two part lecture on Romans 1:24-27 (his material is part of the basis for the distilled information in Vines' talk linked above): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKOTNneoOpU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kONByDAXko For a different, broader and less theologically heady perspective from a Christian ethicist, David Gushee's talk may be helpful: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2o3ZGwzZvk The last couple of talks are heady stuff, so if you're not in the mood for it, save them for later or skip right past. Sometimes you just need a hug; if that's your thing, I'll send you a virtual one now. It can suck beyond belief when you're stuck in a place where you receive condemnation for a part of yourself that you didn't ask for and can't change, but what they're telling you isn't true; you are able to love and be loved just as you are. (&&&)
Thank you for such a lengthy post and including those videos. I really appreciate that. Those first 2 videos were amazing. It really shows that I am not alone in this, and that I relate to almost everyone who is Christian with these feelings. For so long, I have known that I had these feelings, but I always tried to repress them... in which I have always failed. Ever since coming to this forum, I have accepted who I am, and that's a Gay Christian. God made me this way, because I would not have chosen this. I have nothing against gays, but its truly hard trying accept things that so many people reject and put down. Ive been depressed for a long time, and now I know that it was caused by the gay feelings. I started accepting myself, and every time I drive to school, I will say outloud, "I am Gay!" It gives me such a boost of confidence before I start my day. It's so hard to say those words out loud, but I know that saying it is knowing that this is who I am, and I shouldn't be ashamed of it. I have family members that watch those Christian networks on TV of the huge churches that preach almost every night. I listen to them from the other side of the house because the TV is loud at times. I heard one sermon about "the gays" and how it's a sin, and it's so terrifying because I know that if I come out to everyone, I will be frowned upon. It hurts me on the inside, because I did not choose this. Its almost as if no matter how much you love God and Jesus, being gay is an abomination that someone chooses to live this way. And a little off topic, I heard another sermon saying that the United States and the government was founded on a Christian background. It just amazes me how much some Christians almost sound as if they are a colt. After meeting new people and new influences, I have grown almost completely apart from my families beliefs. For example regarding the Christian background of the US, my political science professor said that the US was not found on a Christian background; and that's what all the textbooks say. But anyways, I really appreciate you posting those links. I now realize that I am not alone in this battle. Now regarding being gay and Christian. Does this mean that to be both, I have to remain abstinence from sex with men? I'm a virgin, and I am extremely sexually attracted to guys (something I wish I did not have). I believe that having sex with the same sex is a sin. What should I do? I want to stay abstinent from having sex with men, but I'm scared that if the time comes, and "it happens," what do I do?
I think that at the end of the day God wants you to be happy and as long as you are not hurting anyone there is nothing wrong with acting on your sexual attraction to guys. The bible was written in a specific time period in a culture that was very homophobic so you have to read it bearing that in mind. Your relationship with God is personal and no one can be the mouthpiece of God. Christianity is not about hate but about love and if you build your life around that you will be ok.
That's why I can't believe anymore. God wrote the bible knowing how much unthinkable suffering it would cause LGBT. God in the bible is either cruel or he's the product of a primitive bronze age culture. I just can't accept that some one who loves us would write those words, knowing how they would be used in his name. But I'm a heathen. If you still want to believe more power to you.
You must ultimately follow your own conscience, but as best as I can tell, although plenty of Christians might condemn you, God does not. The first video I shared had people who believe that they do have to remain celibate as gay/lesbian Christians, along with people who believe that they can have a lifelong relationship (including sex) with someone with whom they naturally fall in love. But the rest of the videos show people who take their scriptures seriously and who can explain why you should not feel condemnation. For what it's worth, if you read much stuff online in the LGBT Christian blogosphere, you'll often see the mandatory celibacy position called "Side B" and the affirming position called "Side A" (those are arbitrary designations used for shorthand). There's also "Side X" which is the view that merely being gay is a sin and you have to choose to become straight (those folks wouldn't call themselves Side X; it's a term only used by Side A and B folks, who generally don't take Side X seriously because the ex-gay nonsense has been so thoroughly debunked by now).
SO I actually am in the exact same position, except as a girl, questioning myself liking other girls. I also am a christian, turning 22 in about a month, AND live in california. haha. Its as if fate brought me here to this post. But yes, my family, as well as myself, are all very strong christians, and some of my family can be homophobic sometimes even, and it makes me feel so bad, like if they knew I felt this way they would hate me. I'm currently trying to make sense of it all, if this feeling inside is wrong or not, clashing with my christian beliefs, But Im thinking, I put my faith in God and trust that His will will be done in my life, so maybe He meant for me to feel this way. Because well seeing my family be homophobic sometimes just makes me think this disgust and maybe even hate for another person just because they're gay can't be what God wants for His followers. He wants us to love our neighbor, not judge them. The way I see my family, as well as the more extreme misguided, even hateful christians, that judge gays so harshly, I just think maybe God wants me to feel this way to be able to reach out to fellow gays who are in need of God, to just show them that christians are not an enemy, nor should they ever be portrayed as that, but unfortunately they somewhat have become that way towards gays it seems. You know what I'm saying? Like maybe God doesn't want this division between christians and gays, but rather He wants acceptance between the two, because really hate is never healthy. I'm just trying to piece together why God would have me feel this way.
I feel for you. Spirituality is a personal journey and I would not presume to tell you what your faith should be. Perhaps I can tell you a bit about myself, and see if it helps. I'm older than you. I'm the proud father of a beautiful, talented, courageous gay daughter (which is why I find myself on this forum). I was brought up in a christian family, in a denomination that has lots of strict rules, and lots of doctrine, and lots of threats about heaven and hell. I found that particularly painful as a young adult when I fell in love and discovered sex. My church disapproved of a relationship with someone who was not a member of the church. It disapproved of sex except between married couples (and I'm not sure it even thought that was a good thing, unless for the sole purpose of procreation). Rather than obey my church, I moved away from it, moved closer to my love and her beliefs. Over time, I have abandoned the faith I was taught as a child. I have come to believe that religion - particularly organised religion - comes from humans, not any higher authority. Just have a look at how many religions there are, and have been. Have a look at how many gods have been, and are now worshipped. Have a look at just the monotheistic religions, and see how little common ground there is between all of them. If there were a single objective truth, it would be shared by all religions, surely. So, what I take away from all of those different beliefs, is that spirituality is a personal thing. You choose what you believe, from your own experience, and from other people's opinions (but recognising that they are only opinions, not 'truth'). You may choose to believe in a benevolent god of love; your creator, and with whom you wish to spend your afterlife. That's your choice. If you choose that, I suggest that you believe that she or he is benevolent, and created you in his or her image. That must mean that sex, and sexual pleasure is a gift from your creator, and a holy gift from you to your lover. It must also mean that the whole of human diversity is a reflection of your creator, and that includes you, as you are, true to yourself. I suggest that you worship your creator, by being true to yourself; a human image of him or her. I was at a Pride festival very recently. Part of the parade was a local Christian church. The congregation carried placards that read, 'Love thy gay neighbour' and 'Love thy trans neighbour' (among others). They know that their God loves and approves of gay people. Plenty of good Christians (and good people of other religions) believe that. Those that don't - in my opinion - are not doing good. A couple of other things. The stories in the bible - and other holy books - are not historically accurate. Check that for yourself. They are fables. Choose your own interpretation of them. You don't have to believe your pastor's version. Similarly, the rules in the bible - and other holy books - are not laws. If the stories are not historically accurate, the rules are probably not accurate either. Choose your interpretation and level of compliance. Religion should help you through life, not add to your problems.
There's nothing incompatible in Christianity with homosexuality. The "laws forbidding" homosexuality are from the Torah (Old Testament) which is part of Jewish dogma, and it's from that Jewish dogma that about ninety percent of today's homophobia stems. Jesus said nothing about homosexuality, everything negative that some Christians say about homosexuality stems from Jewish dogma. I might sound anti-Semitic, but it's a cold, hard truth that nobody wants to hear.
It may help others as it has helped me, to realize that it is other persons who have caused the pain and rejection I have felt in my life, not God. In fact, from a spiritual point of view that higher power (or whatever you may relate to it as), has actually helped increase my strength more often than not. If all the assholes who ever bullied me or have been bigots against people who were different were acting on behalf of Jesus Christ, then that is news to me. Oh sure, a lot of them say or believe their violent impulses are sanctioned by the great philosopher himself. However, as Benway has pointed out, Jesus the pacifist has not been on the record as advocating shooting gays or tying them to fence posts. All of this may prompt one to reject organized religion, but it shouldn't slow down one's spiritual impulses, whatever they may be.
I'm atheist but don't mean to intrude lol. My best friend is somewhat religious but one of the most accepting people I know. My mom & sister are very religious but very accepting too. My friend Greg is religious but one of the kindest people I will ever meet. We get so caught up in race, creed, gender, orientation,etc. we forget how similar we actually are. Homosexuality isn't the only "sin" and even Jesus said "May he without sin cast the first stone", defending an adulterer if I'm not mistaken? When I was a theist I felt, "If Jesus can accept prostitutes, pimps, thiefs,etc. and use his message to uplift people then why shouldn't I do the same especially for gay people? Don't I sin too?". This is me being optimistic for overall having great relationships with people who are religious so very anecdotal. That said I love my Christian brothers & sisters. No I don't believe in your prophets or God but don't we all want to live happy and support our loved ones?
What really irks me is that the Jewish community tries to save face by presenting itself as 'gay friendly' and 'all inclusive' when they're the ones who, through years of passing down oral tradition eventually published this in their Torah: "If a man practices homosexuality, having sex with another man as with a woman, both men have committed a detestable act. They must both be put to death, for they are guilty of a capital offense." ~ Leviticus 20:13 And for some reason, Christians, who are apparently extremely impressionable, seem to think these are the words of Jesus when in fact these words were spoken by rabbis four thousand years before the birth of Christ. It's insanity that two otherwise incompatible faiths have come together and created a world of pain for us based on the words of Jewish cavemen.
