General News Congress moves to require women to register for military draft

After the disaster of Vietnam, I think that all governments would reconsider imposing a draft in an age where social media exists, when it was not absolutely necessary.

On the War on Terror, the same could be said for the disaster on the war on drugs. While I respect your opinions, whatever they might be on that topic, I'm not quite sure what a reasonable and realistic answer is that could solve a problem as expansive as that one. Perhaps you have an answer.

When I said that other countries have it worse, I did not mean that we should ignore the issues we have here, however as far as having a draft, again maybe you have an answer on what the better solution would be.

I'd also like to point out that conscientious objection does exists for those who are unable to fill certain roles. What bothers me is the idea that if, in a time of need, people would completely turn their backs on those who do need help because they disagree with the government. Yes, the idea of the country being destroyed is an extreme one, but it is also one that has happened in Europe before.

I did not ignorantly condemn people, I condemned the people who stated they would flee, or claimed that they would do nothing to protect themselves or their families or other peoples families if we were attacked. I'm sorry that you are upset that you would be forced to help out instead of getting to pick which things you deem as important of your cause, but that's not what the law says you get to do.

---------- Post added 2nd May 2016 at 05:11 PM ----------

If a Hitler like situation happened and someone wanted to kill all the LGBTQ people, there would be millions in the US who wouldn't have an issue with that. That doesn't mean they shouldn't have to fight to protect the citizens of the country.

All of you are so freaking lucky that people volunteer for the military, because if there wasn't, we'd all be dead.

 

Give me a fucking break. You cannot force anyone to fight for something they don't believe in. I do not trust this country in the slightest. We are an evil nation and the atrocities we've committed around the world are disgusting. I would rather die than serve this country. The draft is an evil system and has no right to exist. I plan on cutting my fingers off when I turn 18 simply to not register. I refuse to serve the morally bankrupt facist swines that have run this horrible country for hundreds of years now. The Revolutionary War was unjustified. The overwhelming majority of wars sense were unjustified. The tiny minority of wars that might be considered necessary were easily preventable were it not for the fact that sociopathic facists like Wilson, FDR, and Truman were running our country. If we get another band of presidents as horrible as Kennedy, LBJ and Nixon were, than it is more than likely that we could end up oversees where we have no business being. I hate this country, I hate our government, and I refuse to fight for it.

 

Well, all I can say is that we live in a country where people are voted into power, and then those people make decisions base on information given to them. If you do not like that, maybe you should move to a country where democracy is not a policy in place.

 

My point is that the United States often engages in operations overseas that are extremely misguided, and these aren't the kinds of things that I want to be forced to fight in. The Iraq War was started on flimsy intelligence, and the United States frequently sees itself fit to "police the world" by toppling dictators, that, while reprehensible themselves, were the one key to stability in an area that's now plagued by civil war and horrific terrorism. The current war on ISIS is largely the cumulative effect on a number of misguided engagements in a volatile part of the world.

The solution is not have a draft. If the United States wants more people to join the military voluntarily, perhaps conditions in the military should be improved, perhaps the United States should be getting involved in so many foreign conflicts when the net result ends up being a larger loss than they initially anticipated.

How do you know people would turn their backs on those who do need help? The only examples you are providing are ones in which an immediate invasion threatened the lives of Americans on U.S. soil, a type of military engagement that has never occurred. Pearl Harbor and 9/11 were essentially terrorist attacks, thus there is little to compare this hypothetical situation to. I cannot say how people would react if the U.S. were invaded and the lives of Americans were threatened in such a way. In situations like that, people are often taken as prisoners and refugees anyhow. The draft has only been used to fight foreign wars because the draft has been used in carefully planned operations. In the even of an invasion on U.S., careful planning would be out the door. There's really no saying what would happen in such a situation, but I certainly would not turn my back on my family or country. And I wouldn't need to be forced by the government to defend it.

So because something is the law, that means it's right? Again, that is a logical fallacy. The law is not always right; in fact, the law has often been wrong in the past. My personal ethical system deems it necessary to disobey unjust laws.

And yes, you did ignorantly condemn people, because you applied that someone who is opposed to the draft would turn their backs on their families, which is patently false. Being opposed to the draft =/= hating your own people (to illustrate the ridiculous extent this false equivalence can lead to).

Yes, that's how most nations work...they have to be prepared to defend themselves in the case of war.

And I highly doubt "we'd all be dead". You are exaggerating for emotional appeal and it's as transparent as polished glass.

 

I knew you were gonna say that. Just because countries worse than this one exist doesn't change the fact that this country is fucking terrible. If the war mongers in DC want a war so bad they can go get killed themselves.

 

I do agree that the military does need to treat it's people better, however as of now there is no draft, only a requirement to register in case something happens. As I've said before, things have changed greatly in the last 30 years. I do not believe that something like Vietnam could happen again.

As for how do I know that people would turn their backs on those in need, I am referring to the posts of people who claim that they would flat out refuse or leave the country. Is that not turning your backs? And while you would not have to be forced to, there would be people who would be. Some of those individuals do not care about others. Plattyrex seems to be one of them...

Pearl Harbor was not a terrorist attack, it was a declaration of war. Japan actively made that decision, not some splinter cell. As for 9/11, were we supposed to do nothing?

As I said earlier, the law is created by people who are voted into power. That's democracy. If you do not believe that you can follow these laws in the events that they come to be, and if the people voted into power also plan to enforce these laws, maybe you should move to a country where they align more with your view set.

As for the fact that we'd all be dead, you can ask Israel on whether or not a draft might be a good idea or not. There are people in this world who want us dead, and there are events in recent history that support that fact.

 

I hate it when people talk like there is something wrong with dodging the draft. There isn't. If anything it's commendable.

 

I'm curious to know your in-depth thoughts on the matter Platty, and I'm not being sarcastic.

 

Kay. Fair enough. I'm sorry if I'm being aggressive but I am very passionate about this. So I'm in the camp of thought that America has never fought a justified war. Our country was founded on an unjust war. Being taxed wthout representation in Parliament is nowhere near a good enough reason to start a war and get hundreds of thousands of people killed. Any other issues we could have taken with British rule were just as easily applicable to the people living in Britain at the time. The war of 1812 was the same sort of thing. There wasn't any reason behind it outside of staying independent from the country that made us a thing. I am by no means defending the British Empire, in fact I think it was one of the most evil powers in history, but they had hardly wronged us at all. Pretty much every war from then to the Civil War was about conquest and imperialism. Civil War is a bit more complicated, as it did involve freeing the slaves. That being said, that was in no way the goal. The goal was to forced reformation with states that had LEGALLY seceded from the Union. I will say now that I do not like Lincoln, nor do I think he did any of what he did because he was a good person. I think he was a cold - hearted tyrant who violated the constitution more than any other single president. Obviously freeing the slaves was astronomically good, but was more of a side effect to the war than the intention or product of the war itself. World War 1 was unnecessary. The only reason the United States got involved was because we loaned a ton of money to Britain and France and we wouldn't get it back if Germany won. World War 2 is a different story, but it oly happened because of how terribly w e handeled the first one. Hitler rose to power because of the horrible conditions we imposed onto Germany. We sould have either let the country rebuild itself, or not allowed it to continue as an independent nation. The Korean war was complete bullshit. We had no business there in the first place. The man ruling the south was stronly authoritarian. We weren't defending democracy, we were defending capitalism. Vietnam is the same sort of deal, except this time the side we were defending was at fault for the war and was marginally worse than the people we were fighting. The war on terror is interesting. The terrorist organizations in the middle east now would jot exist without US intervention. We toppled there governments and left them in a state of borderline anarchy. Of coarse violent factions were going to compete for power there. If we really needed to kill Saddam Hussein so badly we should have been more than aware that we needed to establish a new government inmplace of the old one. I do not like America. That is not to say I dislike people serving in the military. I think they are the bravest people in the world who happen to be involved in a bad situation because of said bravery. Personally, I don't believe we have ever fought a justified war. I also don't think we've ever had a good president, and I think the people who start these wars are cowardly facists who profit off the blood of the innocents. Bad people don't get killed in war. Good, innocent people get killed because bad people are in a position to make war.

 

A true democracy would hold a referendum or public vote for every law and policy implemented a la Switzerland. Therefore, one can argue that the US is not a true democracy - although I think that goes without saying.

As things currently stand, the majority of Americans oppose any kind of draft, so a true democracy would take heed of public opinion on the matter and abolish selective service entirely.

However, that is not going to happen.

Drafting in America's 19-25 year olds in case of a war really doesn't seem wise - not everyone is cut out for that kind of environment, either mentally or physically. In such a scenario, people should at least be screened out if they don't have what it takes. I'm sure the American military does not need people who are either not able or unwilling to put in the effort to defend their country, especially against countries who have millions of people in reserve, all trained to fight in war (usually dictatorships or one-party states that have poor track records regarding human rights).

 

I agree. I think it's funny that America is for some reason viewed as a symbol of freedom and democracy. We aren't, nor have we ever been. At the end of the day the government can do whatever the hell they want, and therefore we are not a democracy at all.

 

Oh wow 0.o

Gotta disagree with you here friend.

FDR and Kennedy were pretty good people.

---------- Post added 2nd May 2016 at 05:59 PM ----------

We weren't supposed to do nothing, but what we did was stupid and horribly wrong.

We started a war in Afghanistan and Iraq. We had no business in Iraq, and Bin Laden wasn't even in Afghanistan. I believe, if memory served, he turned out to be in Iran the whole time. Also can you explain to me how we wound up allies with Saudi Arabia who may or may not have been involved with the 9/11 attacks? Our government was worried about 9/11 they were worried about their own selfish interests and that's why we were really there.

 

I strongly disagree. I know it's popular opinion amongst liberals in the same vein as all conservatives liking Reagan, but I think they were bad people. FDR was a war profiteer who forced people to fight against their will whilst simultaneously constantly violating the constitution in any way he deemed fit. He passed bills allowing peo pl le to be arrested for publicly speaking out against the war. That is the mark of a war hungry coward desperate to keep his power over the country, not a good person. Kennedy started our involvement in Vietnam and placed the single most evil president in history as his vice, and was single handedly responsible for his rise to power. His family also had very blatant ties to the mafia. It's much t complicated to get into here, but you can look into that if you really care. I respect your opinion, but I think they were both horrible people.

 

FDR was literally dying at the time of WWII he didn't even make it to the end of his term. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say he wasn't too overly concerned with power. He saw the very real threat of the nazis and did what he felt he had to do. Personally cases of genocide are the one and only time I personally believe military action is warranted. That being said we should go through the proper channels and act through the UN and NATO not as team America world police.

As for Kennedy his father had ties to the mafia sure, but that doesn't mean he was involved. Also his vp turning out to be a shit-head isn't really Kennedy's fault he isn't psychic. I'm guessing being assassinated wasn't on his list of plans. Vietnam was a disaster though I'll give you that. I had no idea Kennedy started that one.

 

Agree to disagree I suppose. I think this just about the first time I've disagreed with you on anything political tbh. Even though I disagree, I can kind of understand where you're coming from.

 

It was bound to happen.

 

I would still vote for you if you ran for president.

 

Probably not gonna happen anytime soon, but I appreciate the support x3

 

Well, I'm done here. I will not change your minds and you will not change mine. Good luck with stuff I guess?