Court Clears Attempted Rapist Because His Victim was Trans

And how can you tell what someone's biological sex is? How do you know if I've had SRS? What if a cisgendered girl just happens to look a little boyish? If I introduce myself as Alison, that's a pretty good indication that I want to be referred to with female pronouns. If someone is wearing women's clothes, the intent is also clear. Calling a woman a man is always offensive. Always. It doesn't matter if they're cisgendered or transgendered.

Either way, it's a good way to get one someone's bad side very quickly. It's difficult to stay civil when the wrong pronoun feels like provocation, especially when it's done deliberately--like what you're describing. "Yeah, I think you look like a dude, even though you're wearing those clothes." That's basically what you're saying.

Also, that attitude of being apathetic just because something is easier is pretty rude, lazy, and ignorant by its very definition. Calling a transgendered person by their biological sex is one of the worst things you can do a trans person. Never do it. It has to do with respecting the decisions of others. You don't have to agree with them, but it's not your life. If you don't respect me, why should I respect you?

 

That's exactly what I said. You don't know. The name is one of the indications, yes. People can mistake a tomboy or a feminine boy for the opposite sex. It's a mistake, but it's not their fault. Did you even read my post? I said "without talking to them".

What's wrong with people nowadays is that they get offended too easily. Black. Racist! African-American. Ignorant! Non-African-American black people exist, wait, did I just say black? Racist! People often ignore the intention behind the words. I don't get offended if I know the person didn't mean to insult me (like the Facebook gay joke for example).

 

Why do you get confused? If I put "male" as my gender, it's because, like you, I identify as a man. Regardless of whether I've undergone any type of surgery or hormones, you do not need to know what's under my clothes. Also, why not ASK what pronouns a person prefers? Most trans* people will not be offended; many will be glad that you're making the effort to be respectful.

If you know the terms FTM and MTF, I find it hard to believe that you don't know that a trans* woman is MTF, and a trans* man is FTM. As for the general reader, yes, the woman being trans* is important to the message of the article. Stuff like

is extremely offensive though. The author of the article could have made the same point that the woman was trans* by saying something like "the victim, who was born biologically male, identifies as a woman". She is not a man in a dress, she's a woman in a dress, and hormones won't make her reach the "right" identity, it will just make her feel more comfortable in her body.

You know the phrase "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words can never hurt me"? It's not true. Words do matter. Since you're using the Facebook gay joke as an example, look at my posts in that thread. The principle is the same there as it is here. Words are the basis of discrimination and violence.

 

I could guess someone's biological gender, although it doesn't always work, know someone's gender by their appearance (boobs anyone? , facial features,...). Without approaching the person, how can I know if he/she is trans? Am I being offensive if I refer to the person by his or her biological gender?

OK, I was upset because I said people could mistake someone's gender, and they are immediately called offensive before even having the chance to KNOW. I'm trying to defend the people who had no idea someone is trans and are called offensive because they get his/her gender wrong.

I agree that the word "right" when put in quotation marks is offensive, but the "a man in a woman's clothes" is accurate as it refers to the biological gender (the article is about laws and court, and in laws when they use the word "man" they mean the biological gender). "Who was born male" or "a man" aren't different in that sense. She is technically male, biological wise.

I don't agree with you on the last point. That phrase actually only applies to "me" which is the person who says the phrase (and that person is experienced or something so he/she doesn't get hurt by words). It's not "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words can never hurt". That would be blatantly wrong.

Words, while hurtful, aren't the real target that you should direct your hate towards. It's the INTENTION. If a person use nice words with the intention to insult, discriminate, then are the words offensive? Likewise, if a person mistakenly use words that are hurtful with good intention, or no intention at all, is that person a bad and offensive person?

 

It's really sad that this woman was attacked. His intentions were to rape her so you'd think they would take it more seriously. She was attacked and violated.

I also find the article to be offensive when it refers to her as "a man in woman's clothes" and "actually a man." That is ignorant of the fact that gender is not dictated by a person's body parts. If the woman identifies as a woman, call her a woman.

If a person identifies as a certain gender, it is important that we use the correct pronouns. I've messed up before but as soon as I realize my mistake, I change the words I use. I think it's important for people to try to use the correct pronouns because it's a big deal. If a person's name is Sarah, she probably identifies as female and would like to use female pronouns. If in doubt, you can ask a person (in a polite way) what the person would like to identify with. But as a rule, you should always call a person by their preferred gender pronoun.

A person's words, without regard to intent, can be offensive. People can be unaware that certain words are hurtful but that does not make them any less hurtful.

In this article, the people are aware that the woman is transitioning and taking hormones so their intent is to misstate her gender which is ignorant and offensive.

 

Except by referring to people by their "biological gender"... which should be "sex", by the way... you are doing more than causing offense. You are hurting people. I don't care how well intentioned you are; it's simple enough to use one set of pronouns, and if they correct you, tadaaa! Now you know which pronouns to use! And if you don't know if someone is trans or not, good! For many transsexual people, the whole point is for people to not be able to tell they are trans. Refusing to accept someone's gender identity is disrespectful and downright cruel, regardless of the reasons.

"A man in women's clothing" is not accurate. Saying she's "technically male" is not accurate. She is a transwoman. She is female. She might have male genitalia, but she is not a man. If she was a man, she wouldn't be getting SRS or taking hormones, or trying to live life as a woman.

 

I agree with what you're saying about using the right pronouns... but I have to say, the phrase 'transwoman' could mean either a woman who wants to transition to a man or a woman who was formerly a man, it's a confusing word, and I always ask, I prefer the terms 'mtf' or 'ftm' as more precise.

But the thing about using the correct pronouns is absolutely correct.

 

Ugh. What an awful article.

I think what Night Rain might be trying to say is that sometimes it's impossible to know that someone isn't cis. If someone is wearing a dress, has long hair, a feminine face, jewellery, etc., then unless I am informed otherwise I will refer to them as a woman. If this person is actually a transman, then I will apologise as soon as I find out and use the correct pronouns from then on. But unless I am told not to or there is a giveaway, I will call the person female because that is what they look like. This works both ways, by the way; the person might be MtF trans, in which case I will use feminine pronouns because they look feminine.

Doing this does not make me ignorant and I am not being intentionally offensive. I can't ask every person I meet what pronouns they would like. This isn't stereotyping or transphobia; it's following the general trend that people who dress in a feminine way wish to be referred to as a woman. It won't always be right, in which case I will be happy to refer to someone with different pronouns if they ask me to. But if there is nothing to indicate that they do not identify as a woman, then I will use female pronouns because it is impossible to know that they are a man.

 

...It's still sexual assault...

 

This is vile. So not only do they not care AT ALL about the poor scared woman that was assulted because she was trans, they gave the rapist a light sentence? What is going to happen when he gets out and then just tries to rape some other woman? He planned that, he stalked her. This is terrible. I don't know who that is that was assaulted but I send her my utmost compassion for her ordeal.

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My Swedish Friend: Yep. Lots and lots of protests here in Sweden. Including lawyers who say that the clause they used to change the charges doesn't work like that. They're appearently only throwing something at it and sending it to a higher court.

Let's just hope the criminal gets the punishment they deserve, and the poor woman gets to see a therapist who can help her recover from such a frightening experience.

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And one final thing. Impossible? How, pray tell, do they think that Gay Men have sex? Do they think gay sex is a myth or something? I bet the people who made that ruling thing that the world is flat and the sun revolves around the earth, too.

 

so absolutley wrong. i cant even begin to tell you how mad this makes me. and i dont have a personal connection to the problem. i can only immagine how upset this makes the transgender community feel...

 

Are you kidding me?! Just because you have a penis doesn't make you male. or vice versa... He had every intention of raping her and they cleared it because she didn't have the 'necessary equipment'?! This is ridiculous. I can't even imagine how she must have been traumatized- let alone how it makes the entire transgender part of the community feel.

 

I know this is a bit extremist but I think, to a degree, my odd calculus teacher is right... Politicians are dumb. How do they even get to become a judge... So frustrating...