The point isn't that you should try everything. The point is not to judge others based on what they do if you've never done it yourself. You don't know what that experience is like. That's like saying you absolutely hate something without ever having experienced it at all. I don't need to do heroin to not judge people. I won't do heroin because I know the risks, but that doesn't mean I think poorly of people who do or have. In fact, I do know a few good friends who have done it and kicked it and it only solidified my choice to not ever do it myself. That being said, alcohol isn't even close to being as risky as heroin is. You're taking what I said and applying it to something completely unrelated to this post. This post is talking about alcohol, which most of the world drinks, especially 19 year olds. Basically what I'm saying is, if you're not going to try it, don't look down on those who do. ---------- Post added 10th Aug 2011 at 09:09 AM ---------- Alcohol is not commonly grouped in the "drug" catagory, though technically it is one. All I'm saying is, I'v known many people who, before they drank anything, were against it. Then they got drunk and realized what they were missing. It's not for everyone, and not everyone enjoys it, but if the OP is going to be so controlling and judgemental about it, then maybe he should try it to see what he's judging. If he's not willing to do that, then he should not judge his boyfriend for doing it because he has absolutely NO understanding of what that is like. He doesn't understand why his boyfriend likes it. Telling people to lead sheltered lives where they judge everyone for something they don't really understand is always good too, right? I mean, that's the kind of thing us gay people LOVE isn't it? ---------- Post added 10th Aug 2011 at 09:23 AM ---------- Yes, alcohol isn't good for you. Everyone knows this. So is eating too much fast food, not doing your homework, not getting enough sleep, not eating enough, eating too much. There are a lot of things that are bad for you out there. You probably do a lot of them all the time without even thinking about it. Life requires you to weigh risks against each other. To most people, the risks that come with alcohol are worth it (because if you're responsible, most of those things aren't likely to happen). The problem isn't that people drink, or that it's bad for you. The problem here is that the OP can't seem to handle his boyfriend drinking. He's blowing out of proportion his boyfriend's drinking habits. I assure you from what he describes that his boyfriend is NOT an alcoholic. He is not dependent on alcohol, unless he's secretly sneaking sips all day. This whole thread is ridiculous. Also, just because I seem very against non-drinkers, that's not the case. I don't care if you decide to drink or not. Just don't go judging people who do. In college I discovered that I can be a very controlling person. Luckily, because I learned that about myself, I was able to take a step back and see myself trying to start controlling things. I'v learned that you can't try to control others. You have to let people be themselves and be individuals. Of course you wouldn't want your boyfriend to become an alcoholic. The concern is very sweet of the OP, even if it is an unrealistic concern. But his boyfriend is his own person and can drink if he wants to. It's not the OP's responsibility to keep his boyfriend from being an alcoholic. It's his boyfriend's responsibility to do that. All the OP can do is voice his concern. If he's really got a huge problem with it and can't seem to get past it, and refuses to try and understand his boyfriend better, then he should dump the guy and find someone who shares his views so he doesn't have this problem. However, be warned, the older you get, the harder it will be to find someone who doesn't drink.
Taylor said what needed to be said. Although my culture from an alcohol-perspective is slightly different than in the US.
I don't think alcohol in moderation is any worse for you than say wheat or dairy, two other things humans probably weren't meant to consume. I think one of the reasons that there is such a problem with alcohol in the states is all the media that is like "Alcohol is always bad, no matter what." This then conflicts with the other part of the media that glorifies drinking too much and partying. When kids try alcohol themselves and discover it's "fun" they ignore the "always bad" message, but it seems to conflict with their reality. We need to spread the idea "Alcohol is fine, but use it in moderation." Because it's true. Harping on the fact that alcohol is bad no matter what just serves to alienate people from each other and the important message, which is "Moderation" get's lost in the tussle.
People don't have to try being gay in order to understand it. Trying something is not the only way to overcome being judgmental about it. And just because the whole world does it doesn't mean everyone does - some people don't feel the need to be a follower.
You clearly aren't understanding what I'm saying. People don't have to be gay to understand it, you're right. But if people don't understand being gay, then they shouldn't look down on others for being gay, because they don't understand. So, if you don't understand why people drink, then don't look down on them for doing it. Basically it's as simple as this. If you don't like alcohol and you can't seem to accept the fact that other people do, then don't put yourself in situations where you're around it. If your boyfriend drinks and it really bothers you and it's not something he's willing to give up, then dump him. He's clearly not right for you if he doesn't share your values, and it's clear this is something you feel strongly about. All I'm saying is don't judge him for doing it. Don't start assuming he's an alcoholic because he likes to drink like most normal teens do (it might be illegal, but it's not stopping anyone.) Also, consider the subject from your boyfriends point of view.
I'm not a non-drinker, I'm not in recovery, I have been drunk more than once, and tipsy. I say this to short circuit the inevitable argument of "Well, I bet you've never done any of these things." I have been there, and done that, and now I, for the most part, choose not to drink. (I've had a half glass of wine in the last 2 years.) And I have plenty of other friends, ranging in age from 18 to 77, who feel the same way. But honestly, from my point of view, trying to convince people who have said they aren't interested in drinking that they "don't know what they're missing" is a complete load of shit. OK, a bunch of people like to get drunk, buzzed, high, stoned, whatever. You (Taylor) are obviously one of them. That's your choice, and anyone else's choice. The US and much of the world revolves around alcohol consumption. Most music clubs would cease to exist if people didn't buy alcohol there, because it's the alcohol sales that pays the bills, not the ticket sales to see the artist. But none of that justifies telling someone who says "I'm not interested in drinking" that they aren't entitled to that opinion if they haven't tried it, or that they're ignorant, or missing out, or anything else. In that way, the heroin analogy is correct. I don't need to try heroin to make a judgement about it. And while the downside risk of alcohol is substantially less (unless the person happens to be genetically alcoholic), it's absolutely a reasonable choice for someone to make. It's no more justified than a parent telling a gay son "Well, you should try sex with a girl, you might like it." Some people *do* know that they don't want to try something, and should not be belittled for "not knowing what they're missing" any more than someone who chooses to partake of such activities should be belittled for doing that.
You're right, I do enjoy those things. It's clear that not a lot of people here do enjoy that, and that's fine. I don't judge anyone for not doing something, even if I think you're missing out, what do I care that you are? I have friends who don't drink too, it's fine, we have just as much fun. I don't go forcing people to drink, however it's been my experience with a few friends who didn't drink before that when they finally did have a drink, they realized how much of a big deal they were making out of nothing. They realized that drinking won't make you an alcoholic or ruin your life. A few of them actually had wished they started sooner, only because of the social benefits of drinking (or even just being around others who are drinking). And that's why I made the mere suggestion to try it. No one seems to be understanding my point of trying to not have a problem with something you have no experience with. I'm not saying you have no right to an opinion, but isn't it better if you just try to accept the things other people do within reason? A 19 year old kid drinking a Smirnoff Ice with other people isn't even going to get anyone tipsy. If being around that little alcohol makes someone uncomfortable, then that sounds like a personal thing they need to work out for themselves, not something they should take as a sign to have a talk with their boyfriend about their drinking "problem." Sorry I feel strongly about this. I don't want people assuming anyone's an alcoholic for having a drink. Just like smoking a little weed doesn't make you a stoner, drinking a little bit doesn't make you an alcoholic.
So, then, if you really don't have a problem either way, then please quit trying to get people to follow your lead. Let them decide for themselves. Some people aren't interested in trying things that have the potential for harm. Please allow them to do that without snidely trying to insinuate that somehow they're "missing out." For every person you can point out who "wishes they'd started drinking sooner" I can probably find at least one, probably more, that wish they'd *never* gone down the road in the first place. So please let people make their own choices instead of trying to tell everyone that they *really should* try shit they may not be interested in trying, OK? Oh, and... the so-called "social benefits" of drinking are bullshit. One does not need alcohol, or anything else, to feel good about themselves, to function well at a party or group gathering, or anything else. Implying that's the case is irresponsible to our younger members, and simply wrong. And most people who choose not to drink, and have been around people who are drinking, and people who are not, will choose *not* to be around people who are drinking... so that argument is bullshit too. Again, what *you* (and the majority of people in the US) choose to do is fine, and it's your choice, and no one should be telling you there's anything wrong with it. It's when you try to imply benefits that are not there, or to sell others on the great benefits of it, that I have a problem. Let people choose for themselves, without the implied dig that they're being foolish if they don't choose to do what you did.
I see some things from drinking as beneficial. I enjoy it. It's my opinion and I'm entitled to that too. How about no one goes around telling anyone what to do? If you noticed, I only replied to posts that were directed at me. If you direct something at me, I am going to respond. I don't like leaving people hanging, clearly you want a response if you continue the conversation with me. These are my views and they are just as valid as anyone else's. My suggestions might not be the most popular or PC choices all the time, but I should still be allowed to share my views just as everyone else was allowed to share theirs (to which there are plenty that take the opposite position probably just as strongly). No one needs to follow my lead. Everyone can do whatever they want, all I ask is that you don't judge other people or try to control them.
He's not trying to force people to drink, he is just arguing his point as you are yours. To say that he is trying to get people to follow his lead while you're not trying to get people to follow yours is complete and utter bs. You're both (as are most people including myself) biased on this topic. His posts are obviously pro-alcohol, yours anti-alcohol and you are both in your posts pressuring people to adopt your sides, so for you to get mad at him for expressing his views is really hypocritical in my opinion. As for the idea of people who are not drinking staying away from people who are, I think he is just trying to say that the OP should avoid putting himself in situations where he knows that alcohol would be present and where he knows he would be uncomfortable. If I really don't like heights, I would not be going and looking out the window on a tall skyscraper. People can avoid putting themselves in certain situations that they know they will have issues with.
Bump. After reading most of your responses (thank you!) I wanted to first get this out of the way. I've spoken to him about this and he told me that he isn't someone that goes drinking every night. He does it on rare occasions, which I'm dealing with. I think it's more of a psychological issue with me, and when I look at it in retrospect (basically when I go home and think why I felt that way) I can understand that alcohol in moderation isn't bad. I'm guessing because I care a great deal about him, i'm overthinking his actions. This is why it didn't bother me as much when the 15 year old had the Smirnoff. Same goes with other 19 year olds that drink, because I don't know them, I don't necessarily care what they do. Anyway thanks again for all your replies! -shygeek
