Hi, I have some idea as to my orientation. I am just a bit confused in sorting through the mess brought on by my questioning. I think I am probably gay, but I want to know if my thoughts surrounding it are typical. I have an anxious personality and I don't want to be wrong, and I keep worrying if I am giving in to HOCD or something. I don't think it's that, but my anxiety isn't rational. I don't want to go down the wrong path. Before puberty I always thought I would be straight. I guess, because that was the norm. When my teenage years came around I started having 'crushes' on girls in my class, like my male friends did. This has caused a rooted issue with my thoughts to the contrary, like it's some bastion of denial and bargaining for me to be straight. I did have crushes on girls, in a sense. I would fantasise being with them as an emotional partner, and that aspect seemed fine and appealing in a way. It was everything else which wasn't. It was around this time when I had thoughts to the contrary. I remember innocently coming across some rather attractive photos of male celebrities, I became aroused when watching men in sport, especially at the end of the game when they took their shirts off and revealed their toned body. It created a dissonance within me. I thought I was attracted to women, yet these feelings seemed stronger. Like, when fantasising about women or looking at pretty women I would say I fancy her, but realised I had no butterflies and it was hard for me to get an erection. With men, the erection just happened and I experienced butterflies in the stomach and a fast breathing/heart rate. My shame over this caused me to bottle it up for a good while. I tried convincing myself that I was straight, and my 'crushes' on girls showed this. The thoughts wouldn't go away though. I would say I had a crush on this girl, but when going to bed all I thought was the cute boy in my class, and it seemed more exciting in this way. My male friends would rave about a female actress they liked, and I wanted to be like that, so I would try googling photos of her to convince myself I fancy her, but my brain would soon be telling me to google pictures of the cute actor instead. While, I could happily be in an emotional relationship with a woman, I am not sure if I could go out with them. I have tried dating women, but feel scared of intimacy; I care for female friends I am close to, but the idea of kissing of having sex with them feels wrong. My thought on seeing a woman undress was awkwardness and a feeling of "I hope she doesn't think I am exploiting her." Unlike my fantasies with men or when I have tried dating men. Everything seems natural, none of these anxious thoughts enter my mind. It's this which makes me think I am gay. However, it's the thoughts of close emotional bonds with female friends which give me doubts, and hang ups over 'crushes' on women. I think more I was just recognising they're attractive more than anything, but my doubts are there. I think I may feel closer to women, because I don't like how many men behave in such a laddish way and I might be feeling a bit disappointed that I am gay for this reason, so I am clinging for some hope that I can still be emotionally attracted to women. Though, I am sceptical of any true physical-emotional attraction differences. Are all these thought patterns normal for a gay guy?
Women were the reason I was confused for so long. I still find them pretty. I suspect what you've said fits a lot of gay guys. Certainly does me.
Everything you have said sounds very familiar to me as well. It definitely sounds like a lot that I went through.
Everything you've described sounds like someone who is gay. None of it sounds like someone who is straight. If you ever watched Glee, you'll remember that almost ALL of Kurt (the gay kid)'s friends were girls. But he was as gay as they come. And that's a stereotype that is often very accurate. I hear nothing that remotely sounds like OCD (there is no separate disorder known as HOCD, in spite of the religious crazies that attempted to make it so.)
I identify a lot with what you said as well, and they do seem like very normal thoughts to have as a gay man. I will add, along the lines of what Chip mentioned, that I had so many female friends growing up. I just got along famously with the girls! Very similar personalities and interests. And I thought so many were so pretty. I thought I was destined to be with one of them! (I also did not know gay people even existed) But as I became a teenager, it was a different story. I ended up liking men more... Like, way more. And I will still admire a beautiful woman or their picture. But it's just not how I'm oriented as it turned out. Thank you for your post, you write very thoughtfully! Good luck on your journey, and welcome to Empty Closets
If you heard this about someone else would you think they were gay or straight? This could be what's causing the confusion. You wanted to fit in with friends, to be straight and had some shame about being gay? [
Is it possible you realize that you're not attracted to women, so it's not 'real' you're just using them for denial?
I guess I am realising that I am most likely just recognising attractiveness in women, but being attracted is completely different. I am pleased to hear you two say this, because I worry if my thoughts are typical, as I am scared of misinterpretation for some reason. Thank-you for these comments. They help clarify that I am not the only one who has thought like this, which helps me come to terms. I think I know I am gay, and getting to the cusp of fully accepting, but the denial and internalised homophobia has held me back and I think my brain looks for excuses and justifications to try and grasp any hope I might not be. I am more happy to be gay now, I would accept, but it will take time to fully let go of the internalised homophobia, I think. Thank-you. As I have said above, it helps seeing others have the thoughts I did. Besides my own desires to be straight, due to internalised homophobia, I think lack of understanding of how common my thoughts are has hindered. I think I know I am gay, deep down, but worries over whether my thoughts were typical nagged at me. I would think they are gay. I just had a lot of excuses and worries that I am not truly gay, because I didn't realise these thoughts are normal for a gay man. Yeah. Society portrays heterosexuality as the norm, so I felt bad because I didn't fit in, and kids would make disparaging remarks about it. I think this stuck in my mind, as I am quite sensitive to what people think of me, so I think this caused some internalised homophobia and working out my thoughts can be difficult, even if it seems not so to the outside. I was genuinely exploring, and trying to fit in with what a part of me had hoped I was. I think there is a part of me, deep down, which realises that it's not right for me to be with women sexually or romantically, which is why I felt that way with women. However, the conscious part of my mind was still confused and had some reservations about being gay, because of how others had talked about it and societal expectations, so I muddled my thinking. Anyway, thank-you all for giving me help here. It has helped work out some things, as I progress with my understanding!
I think you are totally normal. These thoughts sound so familiar to me. And the internalized homophobia can be a very high hurdle to overcome. I know.
Hello, @QuestioningLeo! From everything you've stated here, I think the likelihood of you being gay is high. I can't say with absolute certainty, because of course I'm not you/experiencing your exact thoughts or emotions--but based on your own admission of things feeling right regarding fantasizing/relations with other guys, while you often had to find ways to click with straight male friends over female crushes? Well, it speaks volumes. That, and the fact that your fantasies of women exclusively focused on emotional closeness and nothing else suggests a need for close friendship, not romantic relationships with them. It's normal (given the way society still views same-sex attraction in many places) to desire otherwise and for that desire to manifest "evidence" to the contrary of what we already know about ourselves; it's seldom (if ever) done consciously, but it does happen, and this is the confusion it creates. Remember: even if a lot of guys act in a stereotypically macho fashion that you don't particularly like, there are just as many others (if not more so), who are varied and different, like you. In time, if/when you've come to accept who/what you are, you may find that the types you like are drawn to you. But give yourself time, and be kind to yourself; it's a difficult, oftentimes painful process, embracing ourselves. You'll get there when you're ready.
